[otrotabi]

We are rookies in CNC punching and bought a second hand Amada Vipros 2510C.

Everything works fine except every punch is hit too hard so there´s a circle around the punch and the sheet gets deformed (the sheet is not flat after manufacturing). So far we have been working mostly on aluminum 2.0 mm thickness to manufacture HVAC end plates, which include holes and embosses. I attach a picture.

Attachment 494400

We have been users of this product for a long time so I know for sure this is not the way this part is expected to look based on what we used to buy from other guys before.

I´ve checked:

G06 is setup correctly in the program. I also tried to fool the machine by telling it the material thickness was less (I tried for example G06 A0.5 B2) but I did not notice any difference.

PHNC M500 setup. I tried changing slow position parameter from 1 to 2.5 ... I could also see no changes.

My question is:

Is it a setup issue ? What else could we try? Or is it a machine issue ? Too much hydraulic pressure maybe ?

I look forward to hearing your comments. Thanks in advance.

[norin1373]

We are rookies in CNC punching and bought a second hand Amada Vipros 2510C.

Everything works fine except every punch is hit too hard so there´s a circle around the punch and the sheet gets deformed (the sheet is not flat after manufacturing). So far we have been working mostly on aluminum 2.0 mm thickness to manufacture HVAC end plates, which include holes and embosses. I attach a picture.

Attachment 494400

We have been users of this product for a long time so I know for sure this is not the way this part is expected to look based on what we used to buy from other guys before.

I´ve checked:

G06 is setup correctly in the program. I also tried to fool the machine by telling it the material thickness was less (I tried for example G06 A0.5 B2) but I did not notice any difference.

PHNC M500 setup. I tried changing slow position parameter from 1 to 2.5 ... I could also see no changes.

My question is:

Is it a setup issue ? What else could we try? Or is it a machine issue ? Too much hydraulic pressure maybe ?

I look forward to hearing your comments. Thanks in advance.

Hello

Which M code do you use as press pattern? Like M500 or what else
Describe the press pattern parameters which is in use

Can you see last slag in the die hole? How much is that lower than die tip?

Is deformation happening on all A to D punch sizes?

The stripper pressure on the sheet is only generated by punch assembly spring and not by machine’s striker.
so while its a wrong way, by decreasing sheet thickness in G06 line, you can decrease punching force not stripping force.

There is weaker punch assembly spring and a a kind or rubber you can attach at the bottom of the stripper to avoid deformation on AL alloys.

Wilson tool also presents a A size tool with longer stripper body and shorter spring which also has less stripping force. I have not seen this design on other sizes, you can ask from your tool supplier.

A very wrong mechanical punch assembly setup, and a bad PHNC may also generate these kinds of problems.

Good luck,
M.R. Norin
[email protected]

[otrotabi]

Hello and thanks for your feedback.

We are using M500. Current M500 setup in PHNC / Press Pattern Menu / Punch Pattern is as follows: (between brackets defaut settings as they appear on the user´s manual)

TOP POS 7.00 mm (5 mm - 0.197")
SLOW POS 2.5 mm (1 mm - 0.039")
DIE HEIGHT 30 mm (30 mm - 1.181")
BOTTOM POS 2.00 mm (2.5 mm - 0.098")

Particularly for station 311, which is the a "B" type station we are using with a Wilson punch/die tooling is as follows: (in this case I have decided to use the default values)

Tool type: B
Punch height: 207.5 mm
Cut line : 99.5 mm
Top Pos adj: 0
Shear parameter : 0

I tried changing Punch height both up and down (tried 205.5 mm and 210 mm) but there was no visible change. From what I have read this parameter is the one that needs to be modified after grinding the tools but this set of tools is brand new so far.

We only have "A" and "B" type tools. Though sheet metal deformation is worse with the B tools (which I think is logical) they are also seen on smaller holes punched with the A type tools.

My "tooling" dictionary needs some improvement I am afraid - Both in English as in Spanish which is my mother language.

I attach a picture. If you mean the gap between the punch tip and the stripper (as in the picture, please correct me if I am mistaken) it is set to 1 mm.

I will consult with Wilson regarding aluminum parts. They did send a sample together with the tools but they are on a galvanized steel sheet. Now that you mentioned it, I went to take a look at them and sheet is not distorted but I can see - very faint - the same circular mark around the sample.

However, I thought I would be able to find a particular PHNC setup for this material... Am I wrong ? In case I am right, what PHNC punch pattern or tooling data would be the ones to try to modify ?

[otrotabi]

After reading your post and looking at Wilson´s sample again, I changed material and produced a new sample with galvanized steel and indeed results are quite different, very similar to Wilson´s sample.

Attachment 494456



However, I still think - and probably wrong- that a proper machine setup should help prevent too much deformation even with aluminum.

[Jimmy49548]

Keep your form tools away from punching tools. Sometimes there is a height difference in the dies. Also check the actual punch length. It should be 207.5-208.0 mm. It could also be the spring on the punch. When punching Aluminum you should use a lighter duty spring. In the PHNC you can set tonnage and max tonnage. Make sure those are set appropriately.

[otrotabi]

Keep your form tools away from punching tools. Sometimes there is a height difference in the dies. Also check the actual punch length. It should be 207.5-208.0 mm. It could also be the spring on the punch. When punching Aluminum you should use a lighter duty spring. In the PHNC you can set tonnage and max tonnage. Make sure those are set appropriately.

Hi Jimmy, thanks for your tips, I will give it a try.

We actually have 2 different forming tools and there is a quite noticeable height difference compared to the standard cut tools. They are both B type tools. If it was your call, would you "group them" apart from the cutting tooling ?

[Jimmy49548]

I would keep the form tools away from the cut tools. I would also keep the form tools away from each other as well.