[OrionBlade2003]

Not all NGK spark plugs intended for "street" autos are non-resistor type. My Jaguar V12 uses an NGK resistor plug. I would think best to contact NGK before purchasing.

From their website:
Technical Support
hours: 8:30am - 5:00pm Monday-Friday EST
tel: 1-877-473-6767 prompt #2

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/About_nGK/contactus.asp

Dats wha we use dem dere race plugs. Makes dem 'lectrawns go faster.

:banana:

[iEdd]

Anyone looking for the non-resistor type, get an NGK B7ES or B4ES (and many more), but they are the ones I remember are definitely not resistor type.

Just tested with a multimeter. The Champion Gold (resistor plug) have 94kΩ of resistance through the inner electrode. The NGK (non resistor) have about 5kΩ - I'm slightly surprised that this wasn't a lot closer to zero. I guess it is because the nickel-alloy electrode is not that great a conductor.

[integerspin]

I will have to move some stuff to get at the side of the tig to take a photo. The spark gap is a spark plug,as I said before, and L2 in the diagram looks like a car coil, L1 is an aircored inductor wound from thick section aluminium and will probably be visible in the photo. If I can get the top off the tig I will check the coil part number, it looks like a normal car coil and the capcitor values..

OK. Spark plug is a Bosch W8DC [M5 bmw?] picture[CLICK ME] picture is not brilliant but you can see how the electrode has been chopped off and the errosion of the electrode. It's been in use at least 20 years.

There is a picture of it place CLICK ME
Caps[C3] are 2 off 100uF 100V.

inductor 1 is HERE

coil isn't very exciting, it has HOGEFFECTSPOLE art 1120 12v written on it.

[OrionBlade2003]

er... integerspin...

Awesome. The electrode would have eroded away long ago had it not been ground off to begin with. I wonder if you cleaned the plug up, would it still work?! Looks like a nice sputtered coating of metal all around there, approximating an isopotential surface :-p

Anyhow, that helps a bunch. We used the plugs as-is, since our duty cycle was so low - a few dozen hertz at most, with nitrogen or argon flowing through the unit at elevated pressure, cooling it and altering the breakdown characteristics.

Anyhow, thanks again - very enlightening. I love old equipment - I've got a 1939 buick sitting in my garage that needed less work to get running and maintain than any other modern car I've had.

[iEdd]

js530, and anyone else that has made this:

How is your capacitor arrangement at arresting HV/HF and stopping it from killing the diodes? I got X2 mains suppression caps which are twice the microfarads of yours. Just want to know if there are any blown diodes or welder damage. Asking because other circuits I've seen have a 5k ohm resistor (10W or so) in parallel with the capacitor(s) which yours doesn't have and wondering if this affects it?

[slappynuts]

Wheres the thread on your DIY Plasma Cutter?

Exactly my thoughts.

You guys do realize that this could be done with junk from any junkyard and a few parts from the hardware store right? All these transformers and capacitors may have been the latest rage in the 40s when this circuit was designed but it is obsolete at this point in time.

Basically you can build your high frequency parts with a car coil and ignition module from the junkyard and a light dimmer sitch from the hardware store.

[slappynuts]

Here is the answer to all of your questions.

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaver.../simpleign.htm

[iEdd]

Basically you can build your high frequency parts with a car coil and ignition module from the junkyard and a light dimmer sitch from the hardware store.

Yep. (Warning: This one is for an AC Stick welder. For DC stick or TIG you will need the usual suppression circuitry across the -ve and +ve rails before the HF stuff.)

Too bad that gem of an article wasn't written until after I spent $120 on a Switchmode NST that doesn't work in this application.

[slappynuts]

Yep. (Warning: This one is for an AC Stick welder. For DC stick or TIG you will need the usual suppression circuitry across the -ve and +ve rails before the HF stuff.)

Too bad that gem of an article wasn't written until after I spent $120 on a Switchmode NST that doesn't work in this application.

Well isnt this part just a spark plug(gap) and wrap some wire from the spark plug ground around your tig torch lead? The one in the now missing DIY plasma cutter page used a GM coil and GM ignition module or something like that. Im looking for a better diagram ATM.

[slappynuts]

Ok I just tested this set up as working. This is as cheap and simple as it gets (and reliable).

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/k..._Gill_Coil.jpg

I plan on using a spark plug for my spark gap (im thinking lawnmower plug and a solid core plug wire). To finish off the high frequency part i think a length of pallet banding thats anealed and wrapped in a loop with a few windings around each side.

I used a 4uf 660v oil filled cap I found at the local junk surplus store for $4 , chinese knockoff bosch coil from fleet farm for $11.79 and a cheapo dimmer switch from fleet farm as well $2.79 .

My next stop will be to harbor freight tool to get the cheapest stick welder they have and grab a tig torch from work and a regulator(more to come).

[scirturbo]

Punisher, any update of your project?

[punisher454]

Punisher, any update of your project?

Sorry, no progress yet, I have 2 projects in the works that have to take priority right now. A couple times a week I do look over at the arc welder, tig torch and box of electronic components sitting on top and wish I had time to put it together.
The thing I'm working on now should be finished by mid summer and then I'll be able to get on to the tig welder.

I am intrigued by the dimmer idea for the HF.

[nutchanon]

this schematic can make tig welder

[mecanno]

i have built an similar arc starter but destroy my rectifer diode i need help for finish sorry for my english y am french boy i dont have filter capacitor

[Stanislaw Krasi]

Look here: http://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/topic128923.html
Stanislaw Krasicki
Szczecin
Poland

[ozzie34231]

Hi All,
I see this thread has gone a bit dead except for a Polish post that I can't read. I posted here a while back asking what is needed to do TIG with an AC buzz welder. Though some have added to the thread, and some quoted my question, I'm still a bit in the dark.
I've looked at the High frequency start box, and the Jacobs ladder, and while that might be clear to most, I'm still a bit in the dark.
I can build either of those or the thing posted by Nutchenon, but then what? Do I put those outputs in series with my electrode wire? That's putting a #8 wire in series with a very heavy welding cable??
Then I'm all confused about spark gap. The starter box has three gaps, while others talk about using a single spark plug???
Assuming I can get to the point of understanding the construction, what kind of TIG welding will it enable? Steel? 1/8" 6061? What would be the suitable applications?
I notice the "starter box" appears to have a foot switch. Does one only start the TIG arc with the High frequency, or is it fed constantly?

Thanks, maybe someone can alleviate part of my stupidity,
Ozzie

[Stanislaw Krasi]

TIG AC/DC 400A Home Made in Poland
Stanislaw Krasicki

[iEdd]

Hi All,
I see this thread has gone a bit dead except for a Polish post that I can't read. I posted here a while back asking what is needed to do TIG with an AC buzz welder. Though some have added to the thread, and some quoted my question, I'm still a bit in the dark.
I've looked at the High frequency start box, and the Jacobs ladder, and while that might be clear to most, I'm still a bit in the dark.
I can build either of those or the thing posted by Nutchenon, but then what? Do I put those outputs in series with my electrode wire? That's putting a #8 wire in series with a very heavy welding cable??
Then I'm all confused about spark gap. The starter box has three gaps, while others talk about using a single spark plug???
Assuming I can get to the point of understanding the construction, what kind of TIG welding will it enable? Steel? 1/8" 6061? What would be the suitable applications?
I notice the "starter box" appears to have a foot switch. Does one only start the TIG arc with the High frequency, or is it fed constantly?

Thanks, maybe someone can alleviate part of my stupidity,
Ozzie

1. Try running the Polish site through Google Translator (translate.google.com), there looks to be some interesting stuff there.

2. Yes it's run through in series, but remember that the shorter the wire, the less resistance, so it's OK to use a smaller wire (though mine uses 25mm^2 welding cable, which is about the biggest a hobby machine ever uses for its electrodes). WELDER->HF UNIT->TORCH & WELDER->HF UNIT->CLAMP

EDIT: Bear in mind the schematic at the top of this page is for an AC welder only. (It only runs the torch through the system.) For DC, you need both the earth clamp and torch run into the unit so that you can have capacitors to arrest the HV. Otherwise you will destroy your diodes.

3. More spark gaps will increase the voltage drop (series), or reduce the wear (parallel).

4. Hard to know what the limits are. I suppose whatever the weakest component can handle.

5. The HF needs to be on continuously for AC welding, as the arc is broken twice a cycle, but for DC, you only need to initiate it once, then turn the HF unit off.

Someone who understands it better can probably help you further...

[djowen41]

Hi guy i have read this entire thread and i'm very interested.

Does any one no of a reason that the ignition coil based HF starter wouldn't work with an inverter welder?

Cheers

[iEdd]

I hope not! That's what I'm in the process of doing. Just make doubly sure that you're arresting the HF/HV from entering the welder.