[RatHouse]

Has anyone been able to contact Novakon lately. All of my attempts to reach someone over the last three weeks have been in vain. No response from my many emails and no return calls and recently all mail boxes are full so you can’t even leave a message.
My NM200 is only 6 months old and I have no warranty support. I have had jogging issues from the start and lately accuracy and repeatability have gone out the window. The Y axis often stops working even during a run and instead of a round hole I get a slot. When the Y does work it is often .075 out or more and not reliable. Recently the Z has also gone bad by gouging my parts by .250 or more and I get absolutely no help from tech or sales or administration. Been reading a lot about spindle motor problems and the lack of support in that area. At least I don’t have that problem yet.
It appears they have left town and left their customers with expensive tools that don’t work.

Eddie

[hornby chopper]

Hi i was just down at there shop and excanged the x axis motor that was causing the gecko to fault red light beside the green light on the lower right side of it.
You might want to check your motor to ball screw couplings the set screws might not be tight that was the case for my machine cutting egg shapes when i wanted round .

they e mail me back but some times they are very busy .

try PM ihavenofish or dynoray they know allot about these machines

[Frogblender]

Has anyone been able to contact Novakon lately. All of my attempts to reach someone over the last three weeks have been in vain. No response from my many emails and no return calls and recently all mail boxes are full so you can’t even leave a message.
My NM200 is only 6 months old and I have no warranty support. I have had jogging issues from the start and lately accuracy and repeatability have gone out the window. The Y axis often stops working even during a run and instead of a round hole I get a slot. When the Y does work it is often .075 out or more and not reliable. Recently the Z has also gone bad by gouging my parts by .250 or more and I get absolutely no help from tech or sales or administration. Been reading a lot about spindle motor problems and the lack of support in that area. At least I don’t have that problem yet.
It appears they have left town and left their customers with expensive tools that don’t work.

Eddie

Did you try to figure it out anything yourself? It may be a 1 minute fix. OTTOMH try slowing down your speeds, then loosening your gibs.

[RatHouse]

Thx for the advice....have checked the mechanical parts of the y axis which has given me the most trouble. That part seems to be working fine. The error on the Y is always larger never smaller which rules out things that could slip or not be tightened. The DRO shows the Y moving .250 when it is actually moving more than that sometimes by .075. Sometimes it is moving acurately and the next time it will ruin your part. Not consistant and very frustrating to find the problem. Z axis is now also not reliable. I have reinstalled all the software and XML many times with no change. Novakon has not replied to my requests for help

Eddie

[Frogblender]

The DRO shows the Y moving .250 when it is actually moving more than that sometimes by .075.
Eddie

That is bizarre. Perhaps the wiring to the stepper is wrong?

[hornby chopper]

hi when my coupling came loose on the x axis it would lose stepps to
the - side and gain on the + side and it would not be the same amount but it would keep adding up on the + side for every cut.

dinoray ? i think he went into ports and pins and changed to sherline he says that the steppers operate better

just a thought

[Dynoray]

Thx for the advice....have checked the mechanical parts of the y axis which has given me the most trouble. That part seems to be working fine. The error on the Y is always larger never smaller which rules out things that could slip or not be tightened. The DRO shows the Y moving .250 when it is actually moving more than that sometimes by .075. Sometimes it is moving acurately and the next time it will ruin your part. Not consistant and very frustrating to find the problem. Z axis is now also not reliable. I have reinstalled all the software and XML many times with no change. Novakon has not replied to my requests for help

Eddie

Hi Eddie, when you say you move the Y axis 0.250" on the DRO and it actually move's more then 0.250", do you mean your oing this by on moving in one direction? ie: "O" the Y and move 0.250"+ on the DRO and measure more then 0.250"
If so, the only way I can see that happening is if the steps per setting is wrong, but it would move the same distance every time.
By the way, don't bet on the Novakoned XML file being right, mine wasn't, even after the supposed 72 hour test before our machine was shipping. The steps per were wrong. So I'm not sure what they tested, but it wasn't our mill. The steps per have to be set based on the ball screw pitch and the resolution that the stepper motor driver is set at.
If your jogging the Y back and forth and when it goes to +0.250" it's more then 0.250" then your loosing steps or a coupler is slipping.
If your loosing steps, you will hear the steppers, sounds like a stripping gear.
If your not hearing that sound, it has to be a coupler slipping. Bear in mind, NOTHING on your mill was tightened when it was assembled, and the few things that did get tighted are stripped.
One more thing, if you have ran your mill for more then an hour or two (especially with coolant) and haven't taken the ball screw floating supports off and greased then or changed them, they will bind up and the steel ball screws runs in a steel support with no way to lube unless you take it apart.
Ray

[Dynoray]

hi when my coupling came loose on the x axis it would lose stepps to
the - side and gain on the + side and it would not be the same amount but it would keep adding up on the + side for every cut.

dinoray ? i think he went into ports and pins and changed to sherline he says that the steppers operate better

just a thought

Hey Hornby, it was someone else that suggested using the Sherline XML. I think that was just so you had a know working XML but I don't know if the Sherline steps per would be the same???
Best to just set it up correctly as to steps per, speed and acceleration.
Ray

[hornby chopper]

you are right dynoray it was ihavenofish that sugsted to go to sherline in ports and pins

[ihavenofish]

squashed or ovalised circles are almost always caused by pulse timing problems. its a known gecko "bug" that is totally random and difficult for marris to track down. they WILL warranty the drive for it though.

the actual result of the problem is that when an axis is moving slow, like the side of a circle, the drive will not catch all the steps. hence the flattened circles, or out of spec parts. youll almost never see this problem on anything other than rounded parts of paths.

sherline mode in many cases cures this problem. sherline mode has nothing to do with amount of steps, micro stepping, etc. its a pulse timing override. it makes the pulse half the clock cycle, which the drive seems to "never miss".

there is no real downside to sherline mode in use, although theoretically it makes a "noisier" motor. it is always the first thing to look at if you are having subtle missed step issues as it takes less than a minute to check. id say is about 50/50 for a machine with geckos to need this setting.

its ALWAYS best to check all the software solutions before attempting to tackle the electrical or the machine itself, because you can often make things worse if you dont know exactly what you are doing. it also makes double work as you cant elimiate or diagnose mechanical errors for example if the machine isnt traveling the right distance in the first place.

if you are getting a stall - indicated by one axis stopping and making a loud unusual noise - it is ALSO most often a software derived problem. mach3 is finicky about pc hardware, and it often takes some trial and error to nail down just the right settings. novakon tries to do this, but often you wont find out it needs tweaking until youve run your own real life gcode.

mach3 also has bugs in contouring, especially if you have a path made of many short segments (as you would doing 3d contours). most people never see the problem, but when you hit it with the right program at the right speed and acceleration, it goes poof. there is no fix for this, other than to slow down the feed and / or reconfigure your path to have a more graceful transition.

its fairly easy to determine if the problem might be software or hardware. if the "error" always happens in the same spot of a PROGRAM, its software. if its always in the same spot of the MACHINE, it is likely mechanical. if its totally random, it is most likely software, could be hardware (wiring, drive, etc).

if the drive is actually faulting with a red light, it is likely a loose or intermittently shorting wire.

you SHOULD be able to get reasonable responses from novakon in a timely fashion, but because most of you arent able to get any on site support, its always good to be able to diagnose simple issues on your own. it will save alot of frustration.

[Novakon]

Dear valued customers,

As we continue to grow and have been receiving a higher volume of calls than normal, we are finding many opportunities to improve our methods of communicating with you.

Recently we implemented a new phone system in order to better track our customer service while also enabling our staff to receive calls while not at their desks. Unfortunately, with this improvement to our systems we have been notified from a few of you that a small percentage of calls are not coming through. We have isolated this technical issue to a major telephone service provider who is not properly routing your calls and in some cases a “not in service” prompt may be heard when calling. This of course is a major concern for us and we are working diligently to discover why this is happening and how to correct this.

While we are working on this matter, if you are one of those who are experiencing technical difficulties in reaching us, please continue to email us with your comments or concerns at [email protected].

For those of you who email us, you will now receive a new case number in order to better track all technical support inquiries and you will be informed with periodic reports as to the development of your ticket status. We believe this new system will help us offer faster responses as we evolve in order to meet your expectations.

We appreciate your support during this time and welcome any feedback you may offer.

Best regards,

John Sandstrom
Owner

[kenofyork]

I had some issues with my 145 mill. The rails rusted and caused slipping very similar to the inaccuracies you mentioned. Also, the profiles were wrong and I had to call support to get the correct settings.
Take off the covers and clean up the rust and lubricate. I added caulking to keep the coolant off.
After I did that the accuracy has been quite good.
I have some other problems though...........

[hornby chopper]

Hi the problem with my nm-200 was the stepper on the x axis we replaced that and then we found a bare wire grounding rite at the metal 90 then every thing was good then started acting up so i checked the wires all the way back to the computer an the one wire 1b- of the x axis was working its way out oh the holder at the back of the controll panel .

every thing is working good for the last 2 days of use and i keep an eye on the axis couplings they seame to come loose every so often.

other then that problem i like the machine and the support that i get is great thanks khai,rodney ,ron, john and jeff

[bob-morey]

Check that your motor steps are correct. You can do this by measuring the travel with an indicator. Do this on all axis. The XML profile may not be correct for your motor steps right out of the box. Or perhaps the gibs in the X or Y direction are too tight?
Bob

[Larken]

Oval circles are caused usually a Backlash or loose motor coupler or thrust bearing. Also check where the ball nut connects to the axis.

(BTW, Ihavemofish, if it was a step pulse problem, the end of the circle would't meet up with the start.)

If your rails are rusting, change to a coolant with more oil content. I use DoAll 470 coolant.

Larry K

[ihavenofish]

(BTW, Ihavemofish, if it was a step pulse problem, the end of the circle would't meet up with the start.)

actually it would, because it looses the same amount of steps on each side. on a more complex program it would be out of position more noticably.

its an issue i am very familiar with, one that is acknowledged by gecko, and one that i have fixed completely on 3 machine setups using sherline mode.

its the first and easiest thing to check before going off to tear things apart on the machine. discounting it doesnt make any sense.

backlash of course could also cause a small flat spot on a circle, but not an oval one.

[Larken]

actually it would, because it looses the same amount of steps on each side. on a more complex program it would be out of position more noticably.

Loss of steps can make an oval ? ... I doubt it.

[ihavenofish]

Loss of steps can make an oval ? ... I doubt it.

depends how its loosing them.

point is, its the first place to look, and in my experience, the usual cause. backlash on these machines is insignificant and wouldnt leave a very visual flat spot on a circle.

[Frogblender]

there is no real downside to sherline mode in use, although theoretically it makes a "noisier" motor. it is always the first thing to look at if you are having subtle missed step issues as it takes less than a minute to check. id say is about 50/50 for a machine with geckos to need this setting.

mach3 also has bugs in contouring, especially if you have a path made of many short segments (as you would doing 3d contours).

This is excellent info. Thanks fish!

I'm excited to try Sherline mode - I've been going out of my mind trying to figure out why my mill seems to have shifted .001 or .003" in the X after doing some cutting. I need accuracy because the part gets flipped to cut the bottomside, and the mis-registration between top cuts and bottom cuts is causing alot of scrap.
Out of desperation, I was going to add a gradient wheel to the X leadscrew, so I could tell definitively if steps were being missed - I still may do this...

[ihavenofish]

This is excellent info. Thanks fish!

I'm excited to try Sherline mode - I've been going out of my mind trying to figure out why my mill seems to have shifted .001 or .003" in the X after doing some cutting. I need accuracy because the part gets flipped to cut the bottomside, and the mis-registration between top cuts and bottom cuts is causing alot of scrap.
Out of desperation, I was going to add a gradient wheel to the X leadscrew, so I could tell definitively if steps were being missed - I still may do this...

easy way to test. set the jog speed to .1% and listen to the motors.

other things to try might be running the program faster or slower and seeing if the amount of lost position is the same.

.003" could be backlash of course, but as i said, software is so much easier to check first