[fizzissist]

......why don't we just use the fuel that God provided for us. Like the remaining petroleum, oil shale, oil sand, coal, natural gas and even methane hydrates? There is no energy shortage, there is a BRAIN shortage. We need to use what we have while preparing for the future (maybe nuclear? maybe cold fusion?) by the investment in REAL energy rather than swamp gas?

The Lahontan basin was once flooded, and it worked out just fine!.....Maybe we need to re-flood it. Heck, the hills around Oildale (Bakersfield's next door neighbor) are covered with shark's teeth that you can find just walking around. It was the bottom of the ocean at one time.

Well, if we want to use the fuel that God gave us, ....well, we are. It's just that He stored a lot of it in the middle east.

[Geof]

There already is a very large lake in southeast California (hardcore desert area) called the Salton Sea, about a 3-hour drive from here. It gets algae blooms every year and when it does, the stench literally takes your breath away. The smell is absolutely indescribable; pig farms smell like perfume by comparison.

Mariss

There you have it! Your algal biofuel reactor ready made. Harvest the algae, convert to fuel, no more stench and everything is cool.

I had forgotten about the Salton Sea; it gets run-off from the Central Valley with lots and lots of fertilizer residue believe.

By the way, I don't dispute your opinion of the odour you get from decaying algal blooms; I have lived in estuarine locations that suffer from them. Mind you I have also lived on a farm and I think your pig farm perfume comparison is almost as much of an exaggeration as I am prone to sometimes.

[Mariss Freimanis]

Geof,

OK, point taken but I don't think Chanel will bottle either fragrance anytime soon.

The Salton Sea was formed by accident in the early 1900's when railroads were extended into Southern California. The Colorado River was diverted during construction and a levee break allowed the Colorado to flow into the below sea level (-200ft ?) basin that now forms the Salton Sea.

It is hardcore desert 120+F (50C) during the summer, 2-3" (50 to 75mm) of annual precipitation. The Central Valley is far to the northwest and 6,000 to 10,000 ft (2-3km) high transverse mountain ranges separates the two regions.

Mariss

[Geof]

.... The Central Valley is far to the northwest and 6,000 to 10,000 ft (2-3km) high transverse mountain ranges separates the two regions.

Mariss

I was vaguely aware of how the Salton Sea was created but obviously I am confusing it with something else. I remember a Discovery Channel thing years ago about some water body that had been made essentially lifeless due to the fertilizer runoff.

Actually, on a serious note, I think a good argument could be made for doing a trial algae biofuel system in the Salton Sea. After all is is a human created feature so nothing 'natural' would be put in jeopardy.

[Mariss Freimanis]

Can't do that. Like everywhere in California, there are probably some endangered species living in the Salton Sea. Maybe an endangered worm or something.

Mariss

[dynosor]

Can't do that. Like everywhere in California, there are probably some endangered species...

Yes, they are called Republicans.

[fizzissist]

Californians??

You know you're a Californian if:

1. Your coworker has 8 body piercings and none are visible.

2. You make over $300,000 and still can't afford a house.

3. You take a bus and are shocked at two people carrying on a conversation in English.

4. Your child's 3rd-grade teacher has purple hair, a nose ring, and is named Flower.

5. You can't remember . . is pot illegal?

6. You've been to a baby shower that has two mothers and a sperm donor.

7. You have a very strong opinion about where your coffee beans are grown, and you can taste the difference between Sumatran and Ethiopian.

8. You can't remember . . . is pot illegal?

9. A really great parking space can totally move you to tears.

10. Gas costs $1.00 per gallon more than anywhere else in the U.S.

11. Unlike back home, the guy at 8:30 am at Starbucks wearing a baseball cap and sunglasses who looks like George Clooney really IS George Clooney.

12. Your car insurance costs as much as your house payment.

13. You can't remember . . .is pot illegal?

14. It's barely sprinkling rain and there's a report on every news station: "STORM WATCH."

15. You pass an elementary school playground and the children are all busy with their cells or pagers.

16. It's barely sprinkling rain outside, so you leave for work an hour early to avoid all the weather-related accidents.

17. HEY!!!! Is pot illegal????

18. Both you AND your dog have therapists.

19. The Terminator is your governor.

20. If you drive illegally, they take your driver's license. If you're here illegally, they want to give you one.

.....and for all you machinists out there.....
You know better than to try and drive from the Fadal plant to the Haas plant around 5pm.

[jhowelb]

The Lahontan basin was once flooded, and it worked out just fine!.....Maybe we need to re-flood it. Heck, the hills around Oildale (Bakersfield's next door neighbor) are covered with shark's teeth that you can find just walking around. It was the bottom of the ocean at one time.

Well, if we want to use the fuel that God gave us, ....well, we are. It's just that He stored a lot of it in the middle east.

Granted, Arabs have a bit of the light crude, but that is a small part of the energy that IS out there IF we could get enough greenies out of the way.

AND, to my way of thinking at least Nukes would trump all this bio insanity as it is nothing more than a scam!

All them 08 ers out there will tell you real quick that the sharks teeth were put down before the Rockies jumped up! And if your gonna flood the 'dale you'll be ducking a number of squirrel guns!!

[martinw]

XYZ,

Algae has a stench, you know.

Mariss

Dear Mariss,

On the subject of mighty stinks...

Dutch dairy farmers have a limited area on which to their spread their cows' "poo". ( Will that do, CNCAdmin?) .There is not enough land on which to spread it, so the stuff builds up in smelly ponds.

On a warm summer day, and with the wind in the wrong direction, we can smell it in London. I have.

Here is a (probably dodgy) article....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...12/ixhome.html

That nasty "niff" must have travelled at least a couple of hundred miles as the crow flies, and over a windy stretch of water, namely the English Channel.

If algae smell a fraction of that, you may have problems.

Best wishes,
Martin

[jhowelb]

Dear Mariss,

On the subject of mighty stinks...

Dutch dairy farmers have a limited area on which to their spread their cows' "poo". ( Will that do, CNCAdmin?) .There is not enough land on which to spread it, so the stuff builds up in smelly ponds.

On a warm summer day, and with the wind in the wrong direction, we can smell it in London. I have.

Here is a (probably dodgy) article....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...12/ixhome.html

That nasty "niff" must have travelled at least a couple of hundred miles as the crow flies, and over a windy stretch of water, namely the English Channel.

If algae smell a fraction of that, you may have problems.

Best wishes,
Martin

California is well know for dairies, we are quite familiar with the "down wind" associated with them. Believe me, that is nothing compared to a sizable pig farm which can't hold a candle to Salton Sea which is a mere sneeze compared to a saltwater bog. The term cesspool is accurate but inadequate. A for certain NIMBY!!!!

[ImanCarrot]

The worst smell i ever, ever encountered was my own flesh rotting.

I had skin grafts cos of a bike accident and they didn't take. They had to leave the rotting skin which they had previously cut off my other leg on my festering wound for a week tomake sure it hadn't took.

Luckily they cut off twice as much skin as they need so they had spare skin.. was weird seeing your own skin in a jam jar all white as parchment and all the hairs falling off... ewwww!

The smell was like, well, immagine the cheesy stuff you get under your toenails and really ripe stilton/ camembert with mouldy bread and a rotting horse. Honest, it was god awfull.

[Geof]

The worst smell i ever, ever encountered was my own flesh rotting....

You had gangrene!!!! And survived!!!!!

Well done.

[fizzissist]

Gangrene of the brain, that is.

Google, http://www.google.com/ , as of 9:30pacific w/daylight savings, turned the "lights out"

That's right. Their page says "We've turned the lights out. Now it's your turn - Earth Hour."

The page is black. Oh yeah, they turned the lights out. B.S.

They changed the page background from #FFFFFF to #000000 . One helluva reduction in CO2!!!

For all you AGW AlGorebull Warming fanatics, aren't you ever going to see how much BS this whole thing is??

[Geof]

Is anyone placing odds on the probability of crashing the grid either when the load suddenly goes off or when it comes back on; maybe both in different places. If I was managing a big base load generating facility I might be feeling apprehensive.

What possible load change are we facing?

[jhowelb]

Gangrene of the brain, that is.

Google, http://www.google.com/ , as of 9:30pacific w/daylight savings, turned the "lights out"

That's right. Their page says "We've turned the lights out. Now it's your turn - Earth Hour."

The page is black. Oh yeah, they turned the lights out. B.S.

They changed the page background from #FFFFFF to #000000 . One helluva reduction in CO2!!!

For all you AGW AlGorebull Warming fanatics, aren't you ever going to see how much BS this whole thing is??

Ah, but Fizzy! It makes EM FEEL GOOD!

[fizzissist]

Is anyone placing odds on the probability of crashing the grid either when the load suddenly goes off or when it comes back on; maybe both in different places. If I was managing a big base load generating facility I might be feeling apprehensive.

What possible load change are we facing?

You're the first guy I've heard take note of the load...and I have another question.

What's the real saving if you turn off lighting or motors that have an inrush/starting current that more than offsets the small saving? This 'effort' could actually cost more money and generate more CO2 than just leaving stuff on!

Color me #00FF00

[Geof]

.....What's the real saving if you turn off lighting or motors that have an inrush/starting current that more than offsets the small saving? This 'effort' could actually cost more money and generate more CO2 than just leaving stuff on!

Color me #00FF00

I think if things are off for more than a few minutes the saving exceeds the starting surge.

[martinw]

Dear Geof and fizzissist,

A long time ago, I was told that it made no sense to turn off flourescent lighting tubes for brief periods because the energy needed to re-start was greater than that saved by the off period.

Do you have any opinions about how long that period might be?

Obviously, it will depend on the type of tube. If you have compact , "planet-saving", compact flourescents , it may take some considerable time for you to grope your way through the gloaming to the keyboard.

Best wishes,
Martin

[PeeJay]

Do you have any opinions about how long that period might be?

Mythbusters tested this a while ago.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBus...ights_On.2FOff

[Geof]

Dear Geof and fizzissist,

A long time ago, I was told that it made no sense to turn off flourescent lighting tubes for brief periods because the energy needed to re-start was greater than that saved by the off period......

I think this falls into the category of urban myth. I have heard it off and on for decades, but it makes no sense to me. The inrush current for starting lasts for a very short time. Sure it might peak many times higher than the steady state current but the peak is very narrow.