[Edge20]

To Peter Passuello
G'day Peter
Colin Gray may have mentioned that I have successfully nailed together a cnc router. As I said in another post, learning to use it is a brand new ball game. Maybe I could give you a bell and come round some time to look at a tidy setup

cheers
Graham

[P.Passuello]

To Peter Passuello
G'day Peter
Colin Gray may have mentioned that I have successfully nailed together a cnc router. As I said in another post, learning to use it is a brand new ball game. Maybe I could give you a bell and come round some time to look at a tidy setup

cheers
Graham

Hi Graham,

Believe it or not I was just writing a reply to your previous post and was asking where you were in the SI. I think I know the answer to that now.
Colin hasn't mentioned it but I would like to have a look at your machine and will be more than happy to show you mine. Give me a call anytime, I am home all Easter weekend if that suits.

Cheers
Peter

[Harley D]

Hi folks, I'm Harley from Auckland. I am keen on learning if it's possible to build my own CNC laser machine with the hope that it can also take a router head if necessary. I have no idea where to start looking for advice plans etc or maybe someone has a machine they'd like to sell ?

I build Bill Fitzmaurice Speaker cabs and fEARful bass cabs for NZ and Aust market. These are made from 1/2" ply mainly so I need the CNC laser for a lot of the parts that go into the cabs.

If someone can point me in the right direction, that would be great. Thanks.

[kiwichris]

:wave: Welcome to CNCzone from another Kiwi.

Hi Harley...

Someone who knows more about lasers can correct me, but I think that to cut 1/2 inch wood you're actually talking about the higher end power wise for a laser?

A router might be a better path to go down. And a machine designed for laser is built far lighter and with different requirements to a router, it's going to be compromise making a machine to do both, IMHO. (having never built a laser machine myself...)

Also.. If you're doing this as part of a business, there is a basic law of DIY CNC you probably need to know up front:

If you want a hobby, build a CNC machine. If you want to make money, buy one.

Building a good CNC machine that can accurately make parts on a commercial basis is a pretty much all consuming obsession. Also, all the best advise and plans can't stop you making some very Expensive mistakes.

Right, with the negative vibes out of the way...

Starting at the beginning of the process. How big do you need the machine to be in terms of cutting area? Full sheet, quarter sheet? 300x300mm? :-)

[Harley D]

If you want a hobby, build a CNC machine. If you want to make money, buy one.

How big do you need the machine to be in terms of cutting area? Full sheet, quarter sheet? 300x300mm? :-)

Thanks for your reply. I know of one laser machine in NZ that cuts through 1-1/2" ply so I am guessing 1/2" shouldn't be all that much of a problem.

Routers are messy and noisy and I'd prefer not to use one so if push comes to show, I'd choose laser.

I'm looking to cut 1220 x 750 max sheets.

This gives you an idea of what I am cutting;



I have a son who is an ex air-force avionics technician and has his own business making circuit boards, controller interfaces etc - a bit of a rocket scientists really. He's currently living at home so that's handy don't you think

[P.Passuello]

Hi folks, I'm Harley from Auckland. I am keen on learning if it's possible to build my own CNC laser machine with the hope that it can also take a router head if necessary. I have no idea where to start looking for advice plans etc or maybe someone has a machine they'd like to sell ?

I build Bill Fitzmaurice Speaker cabs and fEARful bass cabs for NZ and Aust market. These are made from 1/2" ply mainly so I need the CNC laser for a lot of the parts that go into the cabs.

If someone can point me in the right direction, that would be great. Thanks.

Hi Harley,

I have to agree with Chris on this one. Build a wood router then look into putting a laser on it because if you build a table suitable for a laser it won't be able to put a router on it. The forces involved would destroy it.

I would also say that lasers are very limited in what they can cut as they are only capable of 2D work. Routers can do 2D, 2.5D and 3D. It should also be noted that most industrial furniture makers use routers not lasers and Speakers are just noisy furniture.

As for a machine suggestion I put forward the Joes 4X4 Hybrid. For the cost of the plans you get access to the forum which to be honest is worth the cost of the plans to start with even if you don't end up buiding one. There are many different versions of the 4X4 and I just had a quick look and one of the guy's has built a laser version. I don't know how thick a material it will handle but I will try and find out for you. He does state it is for use with both a CO2 laser and a router.

You can also build this machine in many flavours. R&P or Leadscrew, DIY MDF carriages or buy Cast Aluminum Carriages
Also the machine scales easily to any size you want with some people building machines with 8 x 4 cutting areas while others like myself a more modest 2 x 3.

This machine is as good as and industrial machine in my opinion and in some cases better, but that is my opinion and maybe I am bias. At the very least it is much cheaper to build and if you build it you can fix it, unlike a bought machine.

Welcome to Joe'sCNC.com

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/joes_c...tml#post302871

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/produc...m_top_out.html

Something to think about.

Cheers
Peter

[Harley D]

Thanks Peter and Chris,

Very good advice - I'll look up Joe's CNC link

Cheers

[kiwichris]

You're welcome. :-)

Also, just so you're prepared...

If you're looking for 'real' components, be prepared for some shocks along the way with the cost of components here in NZ. The DIY CNC market is not well catered for at all.

Here's some info on a fairly nice machine made in NZ:

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wo...ter_build.html

Cutting area of 840x490 (Z 130) so it's smaller than what you're looking at and cost him a shade over $3200

Even using hardware store bits (pipe and skate bearings) a machine that size could eat $2k easy.

Not trying to put you off, just a reality check, as you've got commercial intent you'll want to be a step above 'junk box' like my current machine is. For what it's worth I'm looking to get a better router at the moment with a 1/4 sheet cut area, and my budget is $4k NZ. Struggling with the buy vs build options.

Cheers, Me.

[Harley D]

That doesn't put me off at all,

I have a buyer in the USA for cab parts who can also get me all sorts of parts if need be.

The biggest decision will be the LM system. An accuracy of 0.1mm will be more than ample for all the parts I will make.

CNC should reduce my labour for the entire cabs by at least 1/2 and will also allow me to make flat-packs for export to Aussie, so it will pay for itself well within a year

:cheers:

[kiwichris]

That's cool, you're realistic about the dollars...

I have a couple of friends who didn't get past pricing the linear guides part of the process.

I'm just waiting for one more quote for shipping before I make my build/buy decision.

My biggest issue right now seems to be lusting after gear I can't possibly afford, while waiting to find out from EQC if all the money I've got saved up for a router is going to vanish in a puff of house repairs. (Out near Leeston, still waiting from September to have our claim resolved)

Keep us posted on what you do, always interested to see how people get around the tyranny of distance.

Cheers, Chris H.

[P.Passuello]

Your right about the cost of shipping to NZ Chris and yet I have found that it was cheaper to buy items form overseas than to get them in NZ.
What I like about the machine I built is the use of V bearings and Angle Iron for the rails keeps the cost down for linear rails and yet it is a good linear system. Far easier to make than pipe and skate bearings. Another saving was made by using Rack and Pinion for the X and dual Y axis. This way if you want 6 or 8 foot of travel you don't need to mortgage your house to get a long leadscrew from overseas. I bought 4 foot lengths of Rack from the USA cheaper than I could buy from Auckland. Another advantage of Rack is it can be joined very easily so you only need to buy short lengths. The machine runs a lot faster (in my case 8 times faster) and better than leadscrew with the same steppers. They never bind or give any problem and lost steps become a thing of the past.

If anyone wants to save money on their build, the best piece of advice I can give is spend your money on a decent stepper driver with matching motors. If your like 90 percent of the people who build their own machine you will build a better machine shortly after your first and will continue to modify and upgrade it (I'm on build number 4). The motors and drivers will be the one component you will carry from one machine to the next. A cheap crappy driver makes for a machine that you will curse. Take it from someone who has spent more than double what it should have, trying to save on a stepper driver.

Didn't realize you were in the South Island Chris. Hope you get your claim sorted soon.

Cheers
Peter

[kiwichris]

Hi Peter...

Sounds like an interesting machine build....

How much hassle is involved in joining lengths of rack? I've wondered about that a few times where you have the ends touching is there much prating about in keeping things aligned?

After quite a bit of soul searching, pricing, head scratching and then further thinking I decided to import a made up machine. Essentially for double what I'd spend on parts I'll have a solid working machine up in running in a year less than it would take me to make it as metal work is not one of my strong points.

The thread on that is here: http://www.cnczone.com/forums/chines...100a_kiwi.html

The machine left Brisbane port on it's way here yesterday, will be in AKL on the 2nd, then down here the fourth.

Cheers, Me.

[P.Passuello]

Hi Chris,

While I was lucky and didn't have to join the rack on mine as my cutting area is 700 x 1000 but it is very easy to do. You simply use a length of rack clamped upside down to mesh the 2 lengths of rack together as you put them in place. This gets them aligned perfectly. You can grind the ends to get a nice neat join if you like though you don't need to go overboard on this and they don't actually need to touch. Another thing I like about rack is unlike leadscrew it doesn't have to be perfectly straight to work. Since the pinion is spring loaded against the rack it will follow any minor variations where as a slight bend in a leadscrew will cause whipping and binding.

Here is a wee video clip of the machine while I was upgrading it to R&P. I am cutting new Y carriages and they are still using leadscrew while the X axis I have already changed to Rack drive. The Y is running at 40ipm, (50ipm being it's maximum), while the X is 100 ipm. It can cut up to 200 ipm and can rapid at 600ipm using the same 270ozin motors. Please ignore the F Clamps holding the X axis to the machine. It was just a temporary while I cut the new Y carriages for the upgrade.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7L0RETxW9k"]Cutting the new Y axis video - YouTube[/ame]

Here it is after the upgrade

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtOKGDC497I"]Finished Table 005.avi - YouTube[/ame]

Nice looking machine your ordered, I bet November can't get here soon enough. What's the cutting area of new machine?

Cheers
Peter

[kiwichris]

Hi Peter,

That's a great looking machine. There was a big gap between the level of machine I wanted for my 2nd router and my engineering skill. I could have got there but it would have become one of the never-ending build threads on here I think. :-)

Do you have an idea of the end cost of the build? Using linear rails and 20mm ball screws my estimate was about $4k NZ all up for a similar size rig. All up the one I'm bringing in will have cost me around $7k ish by the time I include the mods to the garage and power upgrade to run it.

The machine I'm getting is 1000x600x150 with 1.5k VFD spindle and vacuum table. My plan is small cabinetry work, signage, dolls houses and furniture.

More importantly I've got some paid mould cutting work lined up for a friends engineering business which I'm hoping will help a bit with the loan repayments. ;-)

I've been thinking I might kit a small MDF router because there doesn't seem to be one in the NZ market. That would have to be after the jobs I've promised friends and family I'll do though. There seems to be a certain element of 'build it and they will come' going on in my case.

The good news is that it's the 4th of October that it arrives so the wait is almost over.

Cheers, Chris H

[P.Passuello]

I guestimate about $2000 to build though I have now added more to the machine than you are seeing on those videos.
I suppose one of the advantages and disadvantages of buying a machine is there is no constant stream of mods and upgrades.

Roll on October 4th, I look forward to seeing updates on your thread.

I had thought of designing a small MDF machine myself but gave it up as more trouble than it it was worth. It's one thing to make one for family and friends but to make a kit for sale requires a large support system to help people setup and solve their problems. Unless you provide the machine complete you are reliant on peoples choice of hardware and ability to assemble and set up the machine. My opinion is it is better to get your customer to provide the plan and you just cut the parts out for them.

You are right about the lack of support for CNC in NZ and the cost of buying hardware for machine builds. There doesn't seem to be anyone catering for this market here except those importing and selling on TradeMe.

Cheers
Peter

[kiwichris]

Urro..

Ay... I have had similar thoughts on doing the kit MDF machine.

I'll see how I feel about it next year. I've committed to making a small engraving machine for someone, so I'll go through the sourcing and pricing exercise as part of that and see if it can be done without driving me to drink! :-)

Are you doing any bits just for selling off your machine, or is all hobby stuff? I've been asked by a couple of people if I'll cut things on a commercial basis but I'm a bit torn on that count as I have a history of turning hobbies into part time businesses.

I then get really close to crossing the fine line between hobby and business, then wind up chucking it in as it's not fun any more when people are calling you at all hours looking for things.

Trademe is OK for some stuff but most of the folks selling CNC stuff on there are just getting the gear from Ebay and reselling. A couple I've noticed don't even bother to take their own photos or fix the bad English in the descriptions. I'm picking that's a fair representation of how much support you'd get from the sellers so you might as well import the gear yourself from China!

For mods to the machine I'll probably make a better dust-shoe from what I have read about them but that's about it. That being the conscious decision to be making stuff other than the CNC machine itself. :-)

Having said that I really enjoyed making my current small router, but I didn't make it big enough to build myself better machine components. I probably could have thought that through better at the time!

Cheers, Me.

[Adverse Effects]

ok this is something i havent seen in any other forum i am in

why are all the threds backwards? (last post first)

how do i put it to normal?

by the way Hi all long time reader first time poster

Brisbane South side here

well equipped work shop but dont get down there much anymore because of health problems

[Adverse Effects]

ynneb you may wantr to make a new sticky thread for "Local Supplyers"

where people post links to stuff and supplyers here in AU and NZ and you copy them to the first post state by state

[Stuart_H]

Hi all,
I am just about to start putting together a 1200 X 900 router table here in Howick, Auckland. First attempt at anything CNC but looking forward to the challenge. I have the steppers, drivers and spindle already and now just getting ready to put the table together.

I notice in previous posts, others having trouble sourcing Trapezoidal thread here in NZ. I have found a source in Auckland of this as well as all the nuts, Rack and Pinion, ball screw and linear rail solutions. They are at IAS linear motion solutions. PH 09 828 6684. (I'm not on commission, just found they had what I wanted).

Look forward to hearing of any other projects within a stones throw of me.

Stuart

[Edge20]

G'day all
Have just built a new cnc router after deciding my BYOCNC machine wasn't big enough. Based loosely on the Shopbot it is definitely more inspiration than design. Taking up about a square metre of my shed it has about a 650x650mm footprint. While I believe these things are never finished I am, with lots of help and advice from Peter Passuello (some of which I've even taken), about 98% happy with it. Twin ball screws on Y axis (stopped racking), super PID speed control and 4 axis Gecko Drive run by an old Dell with Mach3