[Len Hoffman]

Eventually all operating systems become obsolete. And so does the hardware. How many programs are written for DOS today? Surfcam, AutoCAD, Mastercam, all started as DOS programs and have evolved to window based and 64 bit. I suppose keeping an XP box around to just run one program is doable but not very practical. Cam software will not be the only programs that will need to evolve as operating system change. Who knows what tomorrow will bring. Surfcam has not evolved enough to warrant it’s outlandish fees so we’ll be looking at alternatives in the future.

This is true. The fellow I'm buying the machine from has been using V 7 Mastercam since he bought it when that was the current version. It runs on Windows 98! Ciamillo puts out some amazing parts from his milltronics.
I could see being annoyed by upgrades that change the way I'm used to doing things, especially if I'm satisfied with the results and the cost for upgrades is up there.

[ZZZZ]

Microsoft's support for WIN XP is scheduled to end shortly. That does NOT mean that all the computers running XP will stop working. My XP boxes will continue to run all the software that they run now, just as my WIN 98SE computers still run their programs. I have DOS 3.3 and DOS 6.22 computers running every day just fine. If you have CENT5, 6, or 7 machines running, you do too.

New versions of operating systems will be needed as new hardware platforms are developed, new software packages that claim to take advantage of the features the new hardware will be released, etc. Our current computers function normally, and our applications continue to help us do our work, but we are told that we will need to update/upgrade/spend in order to 'keep current'.

Unless I have an equipment failure or I require some new application that needs a different operating system, I don't intend to join the parade. What I use now will have to do.

[Len Hoffman]

Microsoft's support for WIN XP is scheduled to end shortly. That does NOT mean that all the computers running XP will stop working. My XP boxes will continue to run all the software that they run now, just as my WIN 98SE computers still run their programs. I have DOS 3.3 and DOS 6.22 computers running every day just fine. If you have CENT5, 6, or 7 machines running, you do too.

New versions of operating systems will be needed as new hardware platforms are developed, new software packages that claim to take advantage of the features the new hardware will be released, etc. Our current computers function normally, and our applications continue to help us do our work, but we are told that we will need to update/upgrade/spend in order to 'keep current'.

Unless I have an equipment failure or I require some new application that needs a different operating system, I don't intend to join the parade. What I use now will have to do.

This is where I am. If it works well and I'm happy I won't spend money to upgrade. Been plenty of non machine related software that upgraded with auto upgrades and suddenly I no longer knew how to work it, or more often there was some quirk of the new version that hindered performance.

I'm not a fan of change for changes sake.

[moldcore]

Keeping your software up to date may seem unnecessary but there is one big problem if you don’t. And that is translators. Communicating with your customers electronically is vital today. Most software is not backwards compatible. If your customers have current versions and you don’t, it can become embarrassing. I keep my CAD software up-to-date for this reason.

[Len Hoffman]

Keeping your software up to date may seem unnecessary but there is one big problem if you don’t. And that is translators. Communicating with your customers electronically is vital today. Most software is not backwards compatible. If your customers have current versions and you don’t, it can become embarrassing. I keep my CAD software up-to-date for this reason.

That makes sense too.
If I ever reach the point where customers are sending me designs to run then I may have to cross that bridge. At this point, and the foreseeable future, my main concern is being able to handle my internal design needs.

[Len Hoffman]

Hi everyone. Thought I'd pick this thread back up.
Moved the machine into place in my shop wed. Like I mentioned before what a mess! I don't think it was ever cleaned. The cabinet interior has coatings of rust and rancid coolant. And don't even get me started on the coolant tank! Whoa!

Anyway, we leveled it super nice as outlined by Milltronics. Zero level change through the entire Y axis travel.

Fri morning threw the breaker and homed the machine. It threw an "excess" code for Y and aborted the homing. Quickly figured out that the center two Y way covers had somehow locked together and were not allowing any further travel. Got them off and homed it. Ran a couple of programs through air and it's super smooth and quiet.

We have a lot of cosmetic issues to deal with as well as plenty of cabinet mechanical issues. For example the bottom door rollers were rusted and no longer rotating and the top slide is missing half the bearings. Instead of gliding the door is dragged closed and just sort of flops into place. Usable, but annoying. I have a hunch that that's going to cost some $ to restore to original working condition with new parts.

Other than the tool change switch on the spindle column everything else seems to be working. I'm seriously looking forward to getting this thing cleaned and ready for service so I can accelerate my learning curve.
I'll be coming back with lots of questions very soon I'm sure.
Attachment 239062

[sportybob]

Hi Len, OMG What were they using for coolant? battery acid? We need to find out and let EVERYBODY know NOT to use that stuff. I have never seen a machine loose that much paint. It sure makes it not very good looking. I will check and see if I can come up with the PPG paint #.

Glad to here you we able to home and move the axis around.
I will check on the door rollers as well.
The tool out button on the head cover is a normally open switch. close the switch and it activates the drawbar. have you done a tool change? F5 MDI ( M6T1) does it work? if so then look to the switch ( loose wire? ) F5 (MDI) M25 will set the drawbar on,, M26 turns it off. if that works, then look to the switch.

PM me if you have specific questions or 952-288-6340

Sportybob
"helping you to cut parts and make money"

[Len Hoffman]

Hey SportyBob. The owner said that his employees used straight water at some point. I'm not sure about that. My impression is that they never changed it out and just kept diluting it. The coolant tank was seriously nasty! Pressure washed it and the rust cancer is so bad that I'm considering just taking it to a commercial powder coater that's nearby and letting him deal with it.

The tool changer switch is fried. But I can't figure out why I can't get a tool in using the m25/26 codes. It acts like the retention knob is too long, but this tool with this knob went in before we moved. I can see the jaws opening for the knob, and it goes up a little ways but bottoms out before the tool is fully engaged. It looks like there's a bar up there that limits the insertion travel. Any chance that has to be readjusted after moving? I'd really like to get this tool in so I can sweep tram a dial indicator and see how that looks. The Y travel check with a machinist level is dead nuts.
Here we go guys. I'm going to need a lot of advise/help from this knowledgeable bunch. Thanks in advance!

[Len Hoffman]

Ah! Got it to work! Realized that I need to hold the tool in place then hit cycle start to draw the tool in. Now I understand.

[sportybob]

Hi Len, The PPG paint # is DAR300218. Any PPG supplier can mix it up.

I have a replacement tool out switch available. PM me for more info.

Bob

[Len Hoffman]

Hi Len, The PPG paint # is DAR300218. Any PPG supplier can mix it up.

I have a replacement tool out switch available. PM me for more info.

Bob

Thanks for the info Bob. Sending PM now.

[Len Hoffman]

Pretty much dismantled the cabinet. So much rust and years of chips glued everywhere in a funk of old coolant! Reduced it to the fixed elements of the cabinet and everything else came off, door, windows, spindle cover etc.
Accessed the mess and realized there was no way I had time to deal with it. So I loaded it all in the truck and took it to Classic Powder Coating, which is close by. A large scale outfit that does great work. Dropped it all off with them.They gave me a great price and what I get back will kick butt compared to what I would do.

The interior is going to get the KSB rust prevention coating system with KSB Diamond Coat in off white.

I need come up with some door rollers. These locked up and one even wore down from sliding, not rolling. I really don't want to have to repair these. Just don't have time.
Bob do you happen to have a pair? I haven't checked with Milltronics. Figured I see anyone here might have some first.

Because it works so fine I'm hesitant to clean the dusty film from the exposed electronics on the spindle assembly. What do the experts have to say about that? Clean with contact cleaner and very low pressure compressed air? Just cover it back up and let it keep working, or some other approach?
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[Len Hoffman]

Time for another update.
I've got it leveled and trammed (that's a week of evenings I'll never get back!) and it's pretty much back together now.
I'll post pics soon.
Now I need to settle on a coolant. 99.9% of the work will be with al 6061 and cylinder head castings, which usually have some amount of silicon.
Don't want a temper-mental, high maintenance coolant or one that's corrosive.

Would like to hear the experiences of others.
Keeping in mind that this machine is likely to work hard for a few days then be idle for days.

[Brian L]

I use an MQL mister on my machine, so I can't say how well this works in a sump, but I use Trim Sol and it doesn't dry with any residue on the parts and no rust on/in the machine. I've been using it for over a year now and happy with it.

[moldcore]

As with any coolant, proper maintenance is import. Keeping the mixture at the recommended ratio and having a good way lube separator is a must. We use Blasocut 2000 Universal from Blasser Swiss Lube with good results on 7075 and 6061 Aluminum. It will stain the 7075 if not cleaned off right away though. Only drawback is the price, about $150 for a 5 gallon bucket.

[Len Hoffman]

The guy I bought the machine from converted his other mills to misters. It's a lot neater.

I had the coolant tank powder coated and it's all fresh and new. I want to give flood coolant a whirl. Some of the parts I have planned will require a lot of chip making. Compressed air for chip clearing is appealing. Combined with coolant would surely eliminate most all chip run-through.

The coolant choice issue is a bit baffling to me.
I've read a few lengthy threads here and on Practical M.
Seems like one guy will love a coolant because it doesn't go rancid, performs well, rejects tramp oil (I have a belt skimmer) etc, then someone else with experience with the same coolant will blast it for going rancid, poor performance, and not handling tramp oil well.
All of these guys seem to know what they're doing and maintain properly, but get widely varying results from the same product. Are some more sensitive to less than perfect mix and tramp separation?
I really don't want to start out with a finicky coolant.

I saw mention in a post of using an aquarium air pump to keep the coolant oxygenated on machines that see more than a few days without running. Any one ever try this?

I have a 40 gallon tank so at typical dilutions a 5 gallon pail should do me, with a second for upkeep. Most of the coolants tossed around have been <$200.00 and I'm okay with that. The castrol offerings are pretty $$ and out of my price range at this time.
I'm leaning toward trim e206.
Seems some hard water folks (I'm in a hard water zone) like it.
What say the experts here? Any hard water GA folks out there?

[moldcore]

If your doing aluminum at high RPM it won't take long before your shop fills with a mist that coats everything over time. I don't know anything about misters but it would seem to me that it could make it worse. If you are going to be making a lot of chips then your going to go through a lot of coolant. So you may not have to worry about keeping the coolant fresh. A couple of days down time won't effect the coolant. The chips themselves hold a lot of coolant, especially if you use flood coolant. I leave the chips in the machine overnight to drain but sometimes that's not always possible, especially if you have a wash down system and chip auger. Plan on topping the tank off every couple of days with 5-10 gallons. I'm not a fan of skimmers. They never seemed to work with our Blasocut. We invested in a unit that separates the way lube. There are a number of those out there to fit your budget and volume of coolant you need to process.

[Len Hoffman]

Thanks for the info.
Moldcore is it possible that the skimmer did not work so hot with the Blasso because it absorbs the tramp oil? I know from research and experience with one of our manuals that uses coolant that some coolants reject the tramp oil and others absorb it. If it rises to the surface when not in use then the skimmer would be effective.

We've used Monroe Prime Cut in one of our manual mills for years with good results, but the tank only holds 5 gallons and the machining operations we use that machine for are not super demanding. Tramp oil, which we have little of on that machine, seems to float to the surface after it sits for a few hours.

Really need to soon get a read on what coolant will work for us within our budget restraints. We're ready to start using the machine, but until we get a larger menu of parts it will spend a fair amount of time not running. That means we won't turn a profit on it for a while. Would like to start out with a coolant that won''t break the budget (~ 200.00 max/5gallon pail) and not stink up the shop.

Like I said before I'm leaning toward trim e206 any one have an opinion of that choice?

[moldcore]

Len, you may want to post in a more general CNC forum. There isn't much traffic on this one. I don't think Blasocut absorbs the way lube. It floats on the surface and our separator removes a lot. The skimmers I've used picked up too much of the coolant. We tried the belt and disk type. That was about 15 to 20 years ago so maybe they've improved them since. One drawback with the separators is that there is always coolant in the unit being separated, our has about 15 gallons more than what's in each machine's sump.

[Len Hoffman]

Moldcore I revived an old, lengthy thread in the general metalworking machinery forum. And now I can't find the thread?! WTF? I'm going to start a new thread to see what I can turn up.
I've heard pos & neg comments about every popular coolant. Need to put this decision to bed soon so I can start making chips.

Going to also talk to a couple of local guys who are using the same water source I am. The water qualities seem to have a LOT of impact on the performance of the coolant and there fore the decision of which to use. Makes sense.
I'll give the skimmer a try, but if it drags out too much coolant I'll look at alternatives.