[Don Clement]

Don.... You don't drink a substance that could help prevent cancer, that's to[sic] bad. (coffee)

Coffee is an addictive drug. I used to be addicted to coffee and drank a lot of the stuff. Nowadays I don’t do anything that's addictive with the exception of CNC machining and building things.

Don

[C*H*U*D]

Trying to stay on topic, I have my 770 in my basement right at the foot of the stairs. I use flood and have never noticed any machine shop smells even when running all day. My girlfriend is not a big fan of my 770, so I'm sure if she had a chance to get a dig in on it she would, be she's never said a thing about the smell.

Noise on the other hand is something she does let me know about, so I usually can only machine when she is gone for the day or before she gets home from work.

[BAMCNC.COM]

Coffee is an addictive drug. I used to be addicted to coffee and drank a lot of the stuff. Nowadays I don’t do anything that's addictive with the exception of CNC machining and building things.

Don

They have "de-caffinated"

Don't edit what I said in a quote please.

And CHUD, time for a new woman.

[Don Clement]

They have "de-caffinated"

I have a manual Rockwell vertical mill. It’s like de-caffeinated coffee. Once addicted to the Tormach PCNC there is no reason to use the manual. Works as a drill press though ;-)

Don

[philbur]

You could distribute the mill load with a subframe.

A 180lb person standing on two feet (each foot approx 1 ft x 0.5 ft) with an area of 1 sq ft = 180 psf!!!!

You need to construct your house to "heavy manufacturing" code.

Phil

I wouldn't worry about it going through the floor. I would worry about stability. A residential structure is built to different specifications that a manufacturing type structure. A quick search for the relevant floor loading shows that residential code is 40 psf and light manufacturing is 100 psf. Also, the waterbed has a much larger footprint than the base of a milling machine. Coincidentally, a waterbed puts almost exactly 40 psf load on the floor. A typical waterbed mattress is about 7" thick and is supported under e whole bed so no matter what size bed you talk about, you can look at just one square foot of it and get the floor loading. So 12*12*7=1008 cu in., or 0.583 cu ft. 0.583*62.4=36.4 psf. A tormach 770 weighs 660 pounds without the base, and without any workpiece, vise, etc on top of it. The tormach stand looks to be about 2 ft x 3 ft for roughly 6 sq ft to support it. 660/6=110 psf and you haven't even counted the stand let alone put anything on the table.

[109jb]

You could distribute the mill load with a subframe.

A 180lb person standing on two feet (each foot approx 1 ft x 0.5 ft) with an area of 1 sq ft = 180 psf!!!!

You need to construct your house to "heavy manufacturing" code.

Phil

Floor loads are average loads. If you really want to go that far, take a look at the Tormach stand which has 4 round feet that look to be about 3" to 4" in diameter. if you say they are 4" that is 12.5 sq in each, 50 sq in total, 0.35 sq ft total. 660/0.35=1885 psf.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

The actual meaning of building code floor loading specifications is being seriously mis-interpreted in this thread. The spec is called "uniform floor load". The name includes the word "uniform" because it is defined such that it would be perfectly permissable to put a "uniform" 40 PSF load over the ENTIRE area of the floor (think a room-sized water bed), and the structure would still be structurally sound. Similarly, it is entirely acceptable, actually expected, that there will be frequent situations where the load far exceeds 40 PSF over a smaller area - for example, pianos, large aquariums, and other such loads can be handled with equal safety. This may cause some minor localized deformation of the subfloor itself if nothing is used to distribute the load, but it would present no risk whatsoever of structural failure. So, even putting a 1000 pound milling machine on a residential floor would NOT present any problem whatsoever.

Regards,
Ray L.

[Steve Seebold]

WOW, from this "if its in the house, will it stink? to this

The actual meaning of building code floor loading specifications is being seriously mis-interpreted in this thread. The spec is called "uniform floor load". The name includes the word "uniform" because it is defined such that it would be perfectly permissable to put a "uniform" 40 PSF load over the ENTIRE area of the floor (think a room-sized water bed), and the structure would still be structurally sound. Similarly, it is entirely acceptable, actually expected, that there will be frequent situations where the load far exceeds 40 PSF over a smaller area - for example, pianos, large aquariums, and other such loads can be handled with equal safety. This may cause some minor localized deformation of the subfloor itself if nothing is used to distribute the load, but it would present no risk whatsoever of structural failure. So, even putting a 1000 pound milling machine on a residential floor would NOT present any problem whatsoever.

Regards,
Ray L.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

WOW, from this "if its in the house, will it stink? to this

What is your point? I have no clue what point you're trying to make here...

[Steve Seebold]

What is your point? I have no clue what point you're trying to make here...

From WILL IT STINK to WILL THE FLOOR SUPPORT THE WEIGHT.

That's like my comment changing from from will it stink to dead cats.

What does either topic have to do with will it stink?

[waltpermenter]

awful lot of non tormach owners butting in with their 2 cents aren't there. cats vs dogs, gimme a break boys.

[Don Clement]

Makes one wonder that some who continually blog on this forum actually do make any real parts on their Tormach.

Don

[philbur]

Exactly, it just shows that original waterbed analogy is no more relevant that your latest calculation.

Phil

Floor loads are average loads.

[109jb]

Exactly, it just shows that original waterbed analogy is no more relevant that your latest calculation.

Phil

My original point was simply that you are putting a heavy vibrating moving machine on a residential floor and that I would reinforce the floor by putting support underneath. It is not a shelf of non-moving books, a dresser, or a piano.

My second point was that putting a machine in a building it would be prudent to have that building up to specs for a light industrial floor rating since that is essentially what you will be subjecting the floor to. The comparison of floor loads was to show that light industrial specs are more than double that of residential. The waterbed argument was brought up by someone else and my calculation was to show that even the localized load of a waterbed is not significant when compared to the localized loading of even a relatively small machine like the Tormach..

The final calculation I did in response to your post was to poke fun at your argument.

The bottom line in my opinion is that if you are planning to put a tormach size machine into a bedroom, it would be prudent to reinforce the floor framing beneath the machine. That is still my opinion.

[Don Clement]

It is not a shelf of non-moving books, a dresser, or a piano.

I don't know about your waterbed, but mine on the second floor gets plenty of vibration on a regular basis, especially back in 1992 during the twin quakes (Landers mag 7.3 and Big Bear mag 6.5) with epicenters less than 20 miles away. No reinforcement was ever needed. That said I do have my Tormach 1100 mounted on a concrete slab on the ground floor since a dogleg of the San Andreas fault is about five miles from here at the bottom of the hill. Unlike my narrow footprint lathe that is leashed with wire cable in case of earthquake, the Tormach has a wide footprint and needs no such leash. BTW I increased the lateral stability of my lathe by adding outriggers. Each of the two outriggers sit on two spherically jointed feet that also makes it easier to remove the twist from the lathe bed. I can see where spherically jointed feet might benefit my Tormach also. See photos below.

Don

[johnyac]

Trying to stay on topic, I have my 770 in my basement right at the foot of the stairs. I use flood and have never noticed any machine shop smells even when running all day. My girlfriend is not a big fan of my 770, so I'm sure if she had a chance to get a dig in on it she would, be she's never said a thing about the smell

What coolant are you using?

Never really thought about the noise. That could be a deal breaker, TV is on the adjoining bedroom wall.

Bedroom floor is concrete, single story, slab on grade. One of the piers is under the corner I'm thinking of for the mill. Zero need to worry about floor joists. Bet that somewhere, someone renting a second floor apartment, hauled a mill up to their place.

[109jb]

What coolant are you using?

Never really thought about the noise. That could be a deal breaker, TV is on the adjoining bedroom wall.

Bedroom floor is concrete, single story, slab on grade. One of the piers is under the corner I'm thinking of for the mill. Zero need to worry about floor joists. Bet that somewhere, someone renting a second floor apartment, hauled a mill up to their place.

The floor situation you have is perfect for the mill, but the noise would be the deal breaker in my house. I mentioned my fathers shop when I was growing up. It was at one end of the basement and was totally insulated. When he was working down there you could still hear the muffled sounds coming from the workshop and that was in the family room at the other end of the house. It wasn't loud or annoying at all at that distance and with the shop walls insulated, but at a closer distance it may be a big problem. Good luck.

[philbur]

If it's a concrete floor (and walls) and you are worried about smells you need to waterproof the concrete. If oil and coolant soak into the concrete it will smell forever. If everything is waterproof then how much it smells will depend on how clean you keep the machine and area around it.

Phil

.

Bedroom floor is concrete, single story, slab on grade.