[TroyO]

OK, I haven't seen or heard of a milling attachment for the 8x12 but I have seen some similar types of things made for other lathes and it seems to just be a matter of getting something that will hold parts (Like a T-slot table or a a vise) and moving it up and down in a controlled manner.

I'd like to make it from readily available parts, without using a mill, and for less than $100 to $150 if possible?

So, brainstorming the thing... a 4.5" 90 angle plate could be locked down to the compound fairly easy, I'd think... with maybe some minor modification.

http://www.littlemachineshop.com/pro...3432&category=

OK... so now it's heading in the right direction for milling anyway, LOL.

Hmmm.... maybe an easy way be just to bolt a mini lathe compound assembly to the angle block and be done with it? Not so good for workholding, though.

http://www.littlemachineshop.com/pro...1769&category=

But, once it was bolted together I'd think you could mill off the thick parts of the compound rest assembly to make it flat, then bolt a thick plate to it and mill T-slots in to it maybe? Then you have basically milling table sitting sideways with the same travel as the mini-lathe compound.... whatever that is, LOL.

Or, maybe mount a small milling vice to the compound? Probably easier....

Anyway, just throwing the idea out there to see if anyone has input, suggestions or a better idea. :banana:

[NCturner]

I've been thinking about removing the compound altogether, and drilling three or four holes in an angle plate to mount straight to the cross slide. That'd give plenty of vertical travel for a milling vise.....

thinkthinkthink...

[TroyO]

If you doff the compound alltogether, wouldn't you loose fine feed for depth?

I was thinking that once you got the compound set 100% square (Using a DTI on a ground rod I'd assume... feed the compound all the way left/right and adjust till you keep the same reading on the bar the whole way.) you could then drill an index hole through the compound base into the crosslide so you could always return back to dead on square. (Not a bad mod idea in general, actually). Loosen the compound, drop in a 1/8" pin and you know its back to dead square.

Same idea for mounting the angle plate... get the basic mounting set, then DTI it across as you feed the crosslide and once it's dialed in, drill 2 locating holes through the angle plate so you'd know that was square whne you put it back.

I did some reasearch and found out that the compound travel from the 7X compound is 55MM... or about 2 1/8 inches. I was hoping for a longer travel. In theory with 4" from the bed to the spindle center you could mill work in a 4"x4.5" envelope.

That may not seem like much (OK, it isn't much) but for a schlub like me with NO mill it will let me do a lot I can't do now.

[blades]

Check this out Troy:

$110 (although out of stock at the moment)

Micro-Mark has what looks like the same one listed for $154 + $8 shipping....

MILLING ATTACHMENT FOR LATHEMASTER 8X14 LATHES, 9x30 LATHES, AND IMPORT MINI LATHES

I do like your idea of using a compound slide, but this unit looks a bit beefier & more travel than the 7x compound assembly.

[TroyO]

Hahahah.... well there ya go. Brainstorming done.. LOL.

That would certainly seem to do it. I'm not real sure how the workholding would go with only a 1 7/8ths clamp but I guess that's something to learn as I get in to it.

I also just got the "Milling on a drill press" (Jose Rodriguez) video from SmartFlix... it looks like you can do OK with an 8" drill press too (With some mods)... the table is on on sale at Enco for $89 and the drill press at $75 (And even free shipping) so for $164 I could probably get a little better work envelope. (8x5)

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...PARTPG=INLMK32

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...&PARTPG=INLMK3

There's even a good deal on hold down clamps..
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...PARTPG=INLMK32

Le-sigh.... decisions, decisions.... Hmmm, maybe the key factor is that the milling attachment isn't in stock, but the table and drill press ARE in stock.

The other option is to just hold out until I have funds for the X2... that may be a while though (Kitchen remodel in progress)

[blades]

My gut instinct tells me that the lathe attachment, although limited in what you can clamp in it, would be a much more stable setup for milling. I did do some profile milling in nylon on my 8" drill press, and the spindle is extremely prone to vibration. The spindle is great for a cheap drill press, but not really up to the task for milling, especially if you were to attempt milling aluminum or <GASP!!> steel with it.

[escott76]

(Not a bad mod idea in general, actually). Loosen the compound, drop in a 1/8" pin and you know its back to dead square.

That isn't going to work as well as you might think. Take a look around and see how many big machines pin their assemblies for square after bolt through. Not too many. There are reasons bridgeports don't come with a pin to lock the head in place, it simply does not work well in practice. Forget that just drilling the hole won't make an accurate fit for a dowel pin, even reaming to size isn't going to be a good idea. If things need to be square they need to be indicated, every time.

[rowbare]

Taig has a milling attachment for their lathe. If it suits your needs, the price is certainly right.

http://www.taigtools.com/c1220.html

[TroyO]

Blades, Yeah..I was thinking about it and came to the conclusion that the lathe milling attachment was probably the better option. It will remain usefull even when I get a "real" milling machine.

Escott76, Too bad the indexing pin doesn't work as well as it seemed it should. I've never even seen a "Big machine" in person so I wouldn't know how they usually work... I'm a newb, and despite short stints as a motorcycle or auto mechanic out of high school I never got in to any machining more advanced than the Brake Lathe at Pep Boys, LOL.

I'm not sure if you've seen the Milling on the drill press vid, but the basic idea is to fill the column of the machine with concrete, mount the X-Y table to the base plate and get rid of the drill press table entirely. He also epoxied the chuck in place after indexing it to lowest runout. He removed the return spring so it's manual both up and down. Probably the most interesting (to me anyway) is he threaded the top of the spindle where it engages with the pulley and put in a threaded rod. The threaded rod has a knob on it, with index marks and the pulley has an index mark. When you lower the spindle the knob contacts the pulley, which gives you a thousandths adjustable depth stop.

Beyond the drill press-as-milling machine application, some of those mods just sound darn handy for improving my cheap-ass Harbor Freight floor drill press too. (Just so as to be a better drill press.)

[blades]

I basically agree with what escott is saying, but things do need to be put into perspective here.
Bridgeports are not pinned (nor should they be) because as you said, if things need to be accurate they need to be indicated in every time. Having run a Bridgeport for more than 15 years, I agree 110&#37; with that fact. But, there is FAR too much mass in a Bridgeport head to even consider pinning (although I do recall seeing some Chinese Bridgeport knock-offs that WERE pinned).
But remember, we are talking about a small lathe compound swivel with no unsupported mass, and IF the reamed pin hole could be put in with some degree of accuracy, there is no reason it wouldn't be plenty accurate and repeatable. This does depend on other factors, such as the slop in the cross-slide pivot pin and hole.

[escott76]

I basically agree with what escott is saying, but things do need to be put into perspective here.
Bridgeports are not pinned (nor should they be) because as you said, if things need to be accurate they need to be indicated in every time. Having run a Bridgeport for more than 15 years, I agree 110% with that fact. But, there is FAR too much mass in a Bridgeport head to even consider pinning (although I do recall seeing some Chinese Bridgeport knock-offs that WERE pinned).
But remember, we are talking about a small lathe compound swivel with no unsupported mass, and IF the reamed pin hole could be put in with some degree of accuracy, there is no reason it wouldn't be plenty accurate and repeatable. This does depend on other factors, such as the slop in the cross-slide pivot pin and hole.

All very good points. I'd just like to add, and I'm sure you understand with the experience you have, is that a lot of times people see the need to "modify" perfectly well working things, to end up with something that is ultimately unsatisfying and produces poor work. Many times these mods are done to avoid "complicated" things like indicating, instead of understanding why it's important. It gets confusing when you're new, and read about more experienced modifying their equipment to achieve specific results, without understanding why and what is important. For instance if someone were to try the current example without reaming, just using a 1/4" bit to get a dowel pin slip fit into a hole.
Obviously you need to determine the accuracy level required, and with work this small, and reasonable tolerances, it may well be fine.

[blades]

All very good points. I'd just like to add, and I'm sure you understand with the experience you have, is that a lot of times people see the need to "modify" perfectly well working things, to end up with something that is ultimately unsatisfying and produces poor work. Many times these mods are done to avoid "complicated" things like indicating, instead of understanding why it's important. It gets confusing when you're new, and read about more experienced modifying their equipment to achieve specific results, without understanding why and what is important. For instance if someone were to try the current example without reaming, just using a 1/4" bit to get a dowel pin slip fit into a hole.
Obviously you need to determine the accuracy level required, and with work this small, and reasonable tolerances, it may well be fine.

Agreed!! There are many factors involved that would render this mod either a success or failure. On consideration is the distance from the discussed locating pin to the pivot. Presumably on a small lathe, this distance would be a couple inches at the most. Any slop in the existing compound slide pivot would result in inaccuracy and non-repeatability, even if it were indicated in initially. But, it may still be within an acceptable tolerance range, depending on the expectations.

I did a similar modification a long time ago in the swivel base of a 6" Kurt vise. I drilled & reamed 1/4" locating holes at 0, 15, 30, and 45 degrees (after first indicating in each angle using a 5" sine bar). This worked really well for 2 reasons: first, it was done with a good degree of precision with the Bridgeport itself. Second, it would locate the vise angle well within the accepted tolerance range. It also helped that the locating pin was about 4" from the vise pivot, which had very little slop. Of course, I only used the 0 degree hole as a rough locator, I would always indicate in the vise to 0-0.
God, I miss running a Bridgeport!!

[TroyO]

Hmmm... so maybe it's not a bad idea in general..... but it had better be well thought out and executed.

To eliminate the center pin slop and extend the distance between refrence points, maybe 2 pin locations would be a better option. That would let you have them ~3 inches apart and have a ream-tight fit at both points.

BUT... maybe an even better option is to make a jig (Maybe magnetic?) that would let you dial it in accurately. I've seen something similar to what I am thinking of for table saw fences.

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=16755

The problem I've always had with adjusting stuff like this is the "bump and test" method... I just never seem to be able to get it really balls on. With an add on jig I could dial it in then lock it down and maybe indexing wouldn't be such a hassle. Made general enough it could be handy for dialing in all kinds of things!

I also just got a set of DTI and mics at a local auction, I need to get familiar with them. Random question on magnetic bases... how tight do they hold on? Just using a regular 1" dial indicator I often found the base to be moving instead of the DI... I finally gave up on the one that came with it and swapped out a hard drive magnet. It has it's own issues, but once it's on, it's on baby!

[escott76]

Hmmm... so maybe it's not a bad idea in general..... but it had better be well thought out and executed.

To eliminate the center pin slop and extend the distance between refrence points, maybe 2 pin locations would be a better option. That would let you have them ~3 inches apart and have a ream-tight fit at both points.

BUT... maybe an even better option is to make a jig (Maybe magnetic?) that would let you dial it in accurately. I've seen something similar to what I am thinking of for table saw fences.

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=16755

The problem I've always had with adjusting stuff like this is the "bump and test" method... I just never seem to be able to get it really balls on. With an add on jig I could dial it in then lock it down and maybe indexing wouldn't be such a hassle. Made general enough it could be handy for dialing in all kinds of things!

I also just got a set of DTI and mics at a local auction, I need to get familiar with them. Random question on magnetic bases... how tight do they hold on? Just using a regular 1" dial indicator I often found the base to be moving instead of the DI... I finally gave up on the one that came with it and swapped out a hard drive magnet. It has it's own issues, but once it's on, it's on baby!

The point I was trying to make is that it's a good idea to learn to do things the "right" way before trying to build a jig, modify existing parts, etc. Once you really understand why things are done the way they are, THEN you think about modifying things.
If you don't learn the basics, all the fancy tricks in the world won't help.
Does your magnetic base have a switch on it? Many do. Make sure it's in the correct position to grab.

[TroyO]

Yes, it has a switch on it. It holds if the wind is right and I push my nose to the left.... it's just not very strong.

The hard drive magnet holds great... but can be a hassle to take off and picks up debris a lot.

I get what you mean by learning the basics... there's a lot to cover even just with "basics" though, LOL. For now I'm just watching every video and reading all the magazines I can find (And abusing the forum search function). There's a lot of little things you miss even in video's though... little details that make the difference between something working right or being frustrating. Good tools help, obviously.. but even that is a learning curve. What tools really need to be top notch? Which ones do you need, but quality really isn't that important? What can you get by without by doing things differently?

I've been looking for a local machining course here in Denver... night class type of thing. No luck so far.

I kind of see the machine mods as a way to learn in themselves. It's possible to hose something but for the most part I've learned a lot on each one... and it gives me practical projects to work on when I don't have anything else specific that I need to make.

For now, I can make most of the round stuff on the lathe but have been running into limitations in bringing some ideas to life without a mill. Even a 4x5 envelope would let me do SOME of the stuff so as soon as I can get a hold of that milling attachment I will. Until then... there's always the chisel, hacksaw and file! ;P

(Don't laugh, you might be surprised what I've made with those.. LOL.)

[escott76]

Yes, it has a switch on it. It holds if the wind is right and I push my nose to the left.... it's just not very strong.

The hard drive magnet holds great... but can be a hassle to take off and picks up debris a lot.

I get what you mean by learning the basics... there's a lot to cover even just with "basics" though, LOL. For now I'm just watching every video and reading all the magazines I can find (And abusing the forum search function). There's a lot of little things you miss even in video's though... little details that make the difference between something working right or being frustrating. Good tools help, obviously.. but even that is a learning curve. What tools really need to be top notch? Which ones do you need, but quality really isn't that important? What can you get by without by doing things differently?

I've been looking for a local machining course here in Denver... night class type of thing. No luck so far.

I kind of see the machine mods as a way to learn in themselves. It's possible to hose something but for the most part I've learned a lot on each one... and it gives me practical projects to work on when I don't have anything else specific that I need to make.

For now, I can make most of the round stuff on the lathe but have been running into limitations in bringing some ideas to life without a mill. Even a 4x5 envelope would let me do SOME of the stuff so as soon as I can get a hold of that milling attachment I will. Until then... there's always the chisel, hacksaw and file! ;P

(Don't laugh, you might be surprised what I've made with those.. LOL.)

I've hacked together my fair share in my day I started machining with a lathe, and a milling attachment, these days I work as a toolmaker. Been a long road.
Personally I feel that if a tool is worth buying it's worth doing right. In particular don't skimp on the measurement tools. You work is dependent on your ability to measure it, you can only work to the tolerance your tools can measure to. A good dial indicator is expensive, and worth every penny. Same with calipers, and mics. Calipers are good for many measurements, but a set of mics is going to be much more precise, you just need 6 of them to match a simple caliper for range. A good square is also essential, and sooner or later you'll appreciate a small surface plate. Those can usually be found fairly cheaply.
If you can just find an old timer in your area to hang out with for a couple afternoons, you'll learn a lot. Possibly more than any class.

[TroyO]

I tend to appreciate ... ehhh, "value" in tools but not just a low a price.

If it covers most of my needs, most of the time it's good enough. As you mention... measuring tools are big on my list not to skimp on. That's why I bought some at auction rather than HF. I think SPI is decent, anyway and I'm pretty sure Starret is. By spending time instead of dollars I managed to get a good value there. ($80... 2 DTI's, 4 Mics 0-4") I do like the HF 6" digital caliper... better than the one I got at Rockler for 4X the price.

But, on the flip side... while a $70 precision square is nice.... I'll just as often grab one of those clear plastic squares from Office Depo while woodworking. I don't care if I drop it and it covers most of my needs, most of the time. (Pretty darn accurate too.)

So anyway... yes, sometimes adapting "junk" is just not a good idea (IE the drill press as mill... it's just too big a leap) but sometimes it works just fine (IE 6" jointer from HF. It's great.. hassle to set up but now that it is it's fine. Lord knows how many miles of board it's done)

I'm mostly diving in to metalworking from a purely tinkering perspective.... I have worked with a lot of materials and methods but always shied away from "block" metal. Epoxy, molding, casting, leather, sheet metal, plastics, sewing, wood, electronics... plus many others I'm probably not thinking of. Metal is the next on the list... One thing I like doing is costumes and movie props which are very multi-discipline. The lathe is great for lightsabers. :-)

I guess the point being... since it's not my livelihood I can tolerate some "Value" tools instead of top of the line. I do appreciate that "Value" isn't always synonymous with "Cheap" though. :-)

LOL. I still need some small machinists squares tho... it's on the list. (Funny... woodworking I was always looking for LARGER squares... now I'm looking for SMALLER ones...)

I have been using a ghetto surface plate.... a 12" granite tile. (OK... OK... another one to add to the list.)

[blades]

Not a bad start, Troy! I can appreciate your price-point on hobby tools. When I was a toolmaker, I never skimped on quality, especially when it came to measuring tools. But Harbor Freight is really a good source for hobby class tools. The 80/20 rule comes into play here: 80&#37; of the accuracy at 20% of the price.
A community college is a good place to look for a night class for machining. I wouldn't mind doing that myself just to have access to the machinery. I now work at Toyota, but unfortunately I don't have open and easy access to the machines to the extent I would like, although I did manage to sneak in and machine the necessary brackets for my CNC project.

[TroyO]

I just got an old magazine article on Ebay, for making a milling attachment using only a lathe and a drill press.

It was only $5, but may be an interesting project.... I still kind of think I can make a better one than I can buy, LOL.

Plus, I'm sure to learn something.... (Although sometimes those old articles are like "Find yourself a 1929 model 2 washing machine and.....")

Anyway, it's an article from 1954, so if it looks like it may have useful info I think I can scan it and post it on here. (C) is like 20 years, right?

[blades]

Yep, could def. be an interesting project, and at least give you some ideas to expand on. If it was good in 1954, it's probably still good today.

At least it's not one of those "build your own jet engine" articles! LOL, I got one of those when I was a kid, with visions of having a small jet engine on my bike.