[makingchips]

Hello,
I have a 1991 cnc 88 Fadal 4020 x 28 TR65 5 axis Machine,
The problem I am having is yesterday after a long run about 4 hours it was running fine until a tool change. The tool changed fine but when it went to start up the spindle started jumping very fast back and forth and a surging on off motion then about 20 or so seconds just shuts off. The motor has been rebuilt and a new inverter installed (yaskawa G7) What else can it be is there a card in the side cabinet that can be checked and if so witch one.
or is there something else I'm missing.

Thanks
Making chips

[Rchapp]

take cover off top and look for speed sensor pickup fadal
prob calls it something different -might
have to take a couple pcs off to get to it clean it
good with alcohol sometims just needs to be replaced.
When I get this error I try to replaced a couple of
cheap sensors before calling the $$$ calvary to fix it.

[Chippie]

when it went to start up the spindle started jumping very fast back and forth and a surging on off motion then about 20 or so seconds just shuts off.

Hello Making Chips,

Are you saying that spindle was going back and forth real fast? M3/M4 then eventually spindle driver fault.

If so there is an orientation sensor right above the spindle pulley and the gap between the sensor and magnet
maybe to big. You would turn the sensor so it would be closer to the magnet. about .010" - .015" There is also an orientation
factor in SETP that you can adjust to slow orientation down slightly.

If the spindle is oscillating up and down at a certain RPM say, 7,000 then it could be the encoder on top of the spindle motor.

Just a few things to check.

Good luck

Chippie.

[Cartesian-xyz]

I seem remember an odd occilation occuring similar to what you have described when the Spindle Inverters braking resistor was faulty.
It is a unit mounted generally on-top of the cabinet in a vented
enclosure and looks like an oven heating element.

Stephen

[makingchips]

take cover off top and look for speed sensor pickup fadal
prob calls it something different -might
have to take a couple pcs off to get to it clean it
good with alcohol sometims just needs to be replaced.
When I get this error I try to replaced a couple of
cheap sensors before calling the $$$ calvary to fix it.

I will check that tomorrow and let you know how it works.

To answer your other post its more of a on/off not M3/M4 its like run coast run coast faster and faster then it will shut off and coast to a stop then about 30 seconds to a miniute it will pop up motor overload or spindle driver access fault.

Making chips

[peseng]

1.fadal 4020 uses 2 posi drive belts ensure only 1 is engauged
2.spindel encoder mounted under top cover,and conectors
3.spindel driver (baldor /mitshubish) have an led display to show invertor faults
4. label on inside of main electrical cabinet shows data on relays,fuses and boards(cards)
5.fadal used have a free download of all manuals and problem shooting guide.

Hope this helps

[WORKALONE]

Hi, Fadal still has the free manual downloads but you must register on the site. I have a 1990 4020 and am using my TR 65 5 th axis for the first time. Could you please send a sample program showing the startup codes to the point of the tool starting a cut and also the ending codes after cutting is completed and sending the machine home. Not much info available it seems from Fadal. Thanks

[makingchips]

Work alone can you send me a file of what you want cut like an .MCX file or .iges also did you set your machine where you want it using seta setb option?

[makingchips]

your tools must be set to the pivot point of the AB table on mine its 7.9104 from Machine table top. Then you must add the difference in cad space to the bottom of the part mine is 6.479 from the pivot point to the bottom of the part. use Joe blocks and use an indicator in jog mode touch the Joe blocks (7.9104)
and come up to the top of the AB table and touch that do the math and that's the # you need for your cad file.

I also use the center of the AB as X,Y Zero I also use it as E20 so it never gets changed.

Making Chips


P.S. Fadal Manuals http://www.compumachine.com/Support/DL-Fadal.htm#PartsP

[makingchips]

N1 O01 (simple Swarf)
N2
N3
N4
N5
N6
N7 (date - Sep-06-07)
N8 (time - 09:19)
N9
N10 (t7 | 1/8 Flat Endmill | H7 | D7 | D0.1220" | | Swarf5ax...)
%
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%

[WORKALONE]

Work alone can you send me a file of what you want cut like an .MCX file or .iges also did you set your machine where you want it using seta setb option?

Wow, fast responce. Yes, I have set the AB startup positions using seta and setb. I have a solids file from Gibbs. Will that work? I can also send an iges file. I am not at the computer with that info at the moment. Thanks.

[WORKALONE]

your tools must be set to the pivot point of the AB table on mine its 7.9104 from Machine table top. Then you must add the difference in cad space to the bottom of the part mine is 6.479 from the pivot point to the bottom of the part. use Joe blocks and use an indicator in jog mode touch the Joe blocks (7.9104)
and come up to the top of the AB table and touch that do the math and that's the # you need for your cad file.

I also use the center of the AB as X,Y Zero I also use it as E20 so it never gets changed.

Making Chips


P.S. Fadal Manuals http://www.compumachine.com/Support/DL-Fadal.htm#PartsP

Making Chips, You are the missing link for me. Thanks for sharing such basic info. This will get me going.
Thanks, Work Alone.

[WORKALONE]

N1 O01 (simple Swarf)
N2
N3
N4
N5
N6
N7 (date - Sep-06-07)
N8 (time - 09:19)
N9
N10 (t7 | 1/8 Flat Endmill | H7 | D7 | D0.1220" | | Swarf5ax...)
%
N11 G17 G40 G49 G9 G70 G80 M48 E1
N12 T7 M6 ( 1/8 Flat Endmill)
N13 M42 M3 S800
N14 G4 P3000
N15 S6500 M3
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N1865 X-.5271 Y-.0179
N1866 X-.5228 Y-.0228
N1867 X-.5179 Y-.0271
N1868 X-.5125 Y-.0308
N1869 X-.5066 Y-.0337
N1870 X-.5004 Y-.0358
N1871 X-.494 Y-.0371
N1872 X-.4875 Y-.0375
N1873 X-.4809 Y-.0371
N1874 X-.4745 Y-.0358
N1875 G0 Z15.3386
N1876 G80 G91 G28 Z0 M5
N1877 G91 G28 X0 Y0 A0 B0
N1878
N1879 G90 M30
N1880 M2
%

Making Chips, this is such a help. What programming system do you use for 5 axis?

Work Alone.

[makingchips]

I use Mastercam X2 MR1

Thats just a partial nc file btw. if you can send an .iges file i will help you further. I will PM you my email address just post in here when you send it so I can look.

Making Chips

[peseng]

gibbscam also have a std fadal post with 5 axis, a lot will depend on on setting up simple e1(g54) on both gibbs and the machine.

[BAPP]

I will check that tomorrow and let you know how it works.

To answer your other post its more of a on/off not M3/M4 its like run coast run coast faster and faster then it will shut off and coast to a stop then about 30 seconds to a miniute it will pop up motor overload or spindle driver access fault.

Making chips

I have a similar problem with a FADAL VMC 15, circa 1993. I believe the spindle is OK, but at some speed, perhaps around 3000 RPM, the spindle just faults and the spindle coasts to a stop. The really weird thing is that when this happens, and I reboot and try to run the program from "the cursor line", it won't let me. It only allows me to start from the actual beginning of the program. Please reply with ideas that could cause this faulting problem.
I have a feeling it may not be anything major, but I cannot figure it out.
Thanks for prompt response.

[makingchips]

I have a similar problem with a FADAL VMC 15, circa 1993. I believe the spindle is OK, but at some speed, perhaps around 3000 RPM, the spindle just faults and the spindle coasts to a stop. The really weird thing is that when this happens, and I reboot and try to run the program from "the cursor line", it won't let me. It only allows me to start from the actual beginning of the program. Please reply with ideas that could cause this faulting problem.
I have a feeling it may not be anything major, but I cannot figure it out.
Thanks for prompt response.

Its not good news BAPP we had to get a new spindle drive controller it was about 8k installed, but its fixed now with no other issues knock on wood!

MC

[BAPP]

Its not good news BAPP we had to get a new spindle drive controller it was about 8k installed, but its fixed now with no other issues knock on wood!

MC

Thanks for the information MC. I'll wait and see what others say, then I may send out my spindle drive controller to be evaluated. It is not worthwhile for me to invest $8000 into this machine at this time.

[BAPP]

Thanks for the information MC. I'll wait and see what others say, then I may send out my spindle drive controller to be evaluated. It is not worthwhile for me to invest $8000 into this machine at this time.

2/11/08 Update. I spoke with the friendly folks at Fadal (they actually were quite friendly) and they told me to focus on the inverter, contacts and spindle motor. We evaluated each of these one by one and found them to be good. Then I swapped a spindle control board from the control cabinet from another VMC 15 that we have, and "viola", the spindle now works perfectly!! Now I need to repair my Fadal spindle control board. Any suggestions out there op a good reasonable company to do this??

[carbidecraters]

Alot of outfits will repair your controller card. You can even get your drive repaired for under 2K. If you eventually have drive failure make sure and get your spindle motor ohm'd to see if the motor caused the drive to fail.