[microcarve]

Happy Holidays everyone....

Quick question for John or anyone in the know. Is it necessary to clean the oilite bearings/bushings? I searched this thread but didn't find the answer tho it may well be there. Am picking up a groaning sound in my X axis and was wondering if the oilite bearings could be getting dirty or 'tight'. Can't seem to adjust the noise away. It occurs at a speed range of about 1800-2200mm/min, sometimes slower. Worse when the machine is cold.

Sorry if this to much off topic but the 'oilite' expert (John) resides here...

Don

Hi Don,
Happy Holidays to you & everyone too....

Sure, trash/dust can get into anything that moves. You can wipe them
clean with a paper towel or lint free rag with a little regular 30 weight
motor oil on it. Then put a drop on the rail and run over it a few times.
An old container from adding oil to a car still has a lifetime supply left
in it...

I've never known anyone to need to actually replace them, but I have
cleaned some a time or two and know of others who have as well. I've
seen pictures of machines in eXtremely dusty environments....and on
the first few pages of this thread they can be seen half deep in MDF
flour and urethane debris. Still working Great!

...though I wouldn't recommend neglect like that...


John

[atwooddon]

Hi Don,
Happy Holidays to you & everyone too....

Sure, trash/dust can get into anything that moves. You can wipe them
clean with a paper towel or lint free rag with a little regular 30 weight
motor oil on it. Then put a drop on the rail and run over it a few times.
An old container from adding oil to a car still has a lifetime supply left
in it...

I've never known anyone to need to actually replace them, but I have
cleaned some a time or two and know of others who have as well. I've
seen pictures of machines in eXtremely dusty environments....and on
the first few pages of this thread they can be seen half deep in MDF
flour and urethane debris. Still working Great!

...though I wouldn't recommend neglect like that...


John

Well, good news!!!! I finally gave up and took my cnc machine apart to the point where I could identify where the exact location of the drag was occuring. As it turns out, the rails (not the bushings) on the X axis were the primary cause. My guess is over time as I played with various cleanings and lubricants, the rails built up a layer of 'gunk' on them. Although they looked clean, it was still there. What I did was wipe the rails down with alcohol and wiped dry several times. Then I wiped on a thin coat of motor oil, wiped most of that off with a towel and ran the carriage back and forth. After a couple repeats of this, the bushings began to loosen up and finally would slide freely. Finally a very light coat of oil and everything slides freely now. The groans are gone and top speed has improved. I can now move the X axis at about 4500mm/min without stalling tho I don't run at those speeds. The machine is very smooth and quiet now.

So, no more experimenting with 'space age' lubricants, just alcohol cleaning and light motor oil from now on. The Y and Z axis will get cleaned in the morning.

Whew, thought I was going to have to buy bigger motors as a solution. My motors are not monsters, I think they are about 150 oz/in but they do a pretty good job when everything is set up right.

Don

[microcarve]

Well, good news!!!! I finally gave up and took my cnc machine apart to the point where I could identify where the exact location of the drag was occuring. As it turns out, the rails (not the bushings) on the X axis were the primary cause. My guess is over time as I played with various cleanings and lubricants, the rails built up a layer of 'gunk' on them. Although they looked clean, it was still there. What I did was wipe the rails down with alcohol and wiped dry several times. Then I wiped on a thin coat of motor oil, wiped most of that off with a towel and ran the carriage back and forth. After a couple repeats of this, the bushings began to loosen up and finally would slide freely. Finally a very light coat of oil and everything slides freely now. The groans are gone and top speed has improved. I can now move the X axis at about 4500mm/min without stalling tho I don't run at those speeds. The machine is very smooth and quiet now.

So, no more experimenting with 'space age' lubricants, just alcohol cleaning and light motor oil from now on. The Y and Z axis will get cleaned in the morning.

Whew, thought I was going to have to buy bigger motors as a solution. My motors are not monsters, I think they are about 150 oz/in but they do a pretty good job when everything is set up right.

Don

Thanks for the update!



Yeah, I think experimenting with various sprays/lubricants/cleaners isn't
a good idea....but it should all be 'fix-able' in the end....

I view a lot of those 'lubricants' as more of solvents, than lubricants.
WD-40 is the prime example. It'll destroy the oils and greases in bearings
by dissolving it and washing it away. And the thin film of WD-40 left after
that dissipates quickly. I wrecked a Nice $$ 1HP motor a long time ago
before I realized that.

Anyone who likes mechanical stuff should really be impressed with the sheer
clean, plain vanilla simplicity of Oilites and precision rails. They're good for
tons of applications, and are very affordable. And highly reliable.

The Fireball, and now microcarve machines, are (hopefully) designed to be
as simple and problem free as they can be. And any problems that do arise
should always be a fairly simple and inexpensive thing to fix. Even
modifying them should be cheap & easy...

But, things are learned along the way, and it's good that you mention the
different lubricants that could possibly cause slight problems.

WD-40 seems like a natural and sensible thing to use from time to time. But
IIRC...the oil that is in Oilite bearings is a basic 30W oil and sure as heck,
WD-40 and similar stuff will have an adverse effect on the oil.

I use some of the "Teflon" sprays from time to time for different stuff and
I've noticed it can also build up and get a little messy over time. But for
the Thomson shafts, I've always had great luck with the drop of motor oil
and the very rare wiping of the bearing interior. All the machines come
apart and go together again easily for any reasons anyone may ever
have. Maintenance included....

Thanks for the Very Good --and Useful-- post, Don!


John

[microcarve]

Don, also while I'm thinking about it...
You mentioned "when the machine is cold".

This time of year some of my machines have gotten a bit cold in
the past and I always had a program that I'd run before my project
to get everything sliding well before committing to actual work.

That was nothing more than an air-cutting of a bunch of star patterns.
That made sure all the axes were moving in practically all directions and
would get the oil....which can thicken a tiny bit in the cold....all
distributed everywhere well enough to run reliably.

These days, my machines are in well temp regulated places, so they
don't get so cold anymore, but I realize that many may be in places
where they do. So a "warm-up" gcode file can be very useful at times.


John

[CurtisBarclay]

Hi Don,
Happy Holidays to you & everyone too....

Sure, trash/dust can get into anything that moves. You can wipe them
clean with a paper towel or lint free rag with a little regular 30 weight
motor oil on it. Then put a drop on the rail and run over it a few times.
An old container from adding oil to a car still has a lifetime supply left
in it...

I've never known anyone to need to actually replace them, but I have
cleaned some a time or two and know of others who have as well. I've
seen pictures of machines in eXtremely dusty environments....and on
the first few pages of this thread they can be seen half deep in MDF
flour and urethane debris. Still working Great!

...though I wouldn't recommend neglect like that...


John

This is a little off topic and do apologize.

A little trick I learned a long time ago is transmission fluid!!! Yes, transmission fluid! Think about it, your transmission is probably the most precision built piece of equipment you will ever own. It's lubricated by oil, it has to maintain stability (can't become thick) in extreme temperatures and it has rust inhibitors!

WD-40 has always been a joke to me because it doesn't really lubricate that well and evaporates quickly, you will never see a can of it in my shop!!

My first choice is Liquid Wrench. Not too bad.

Example; You machine a few steel parts, come back a few days later and you see flash rust starting to show up (depending on humidity of course).

Same scenario, but you wipe the parts down with transmission fluid. Come back a few weeks later and the parts look like they just came off the machine! ( Again depending on humidity.)

It's cheap compared high dollar rust inhibitors and space age lubricants (by weight). And you can get it anywhere!!

It's a light weight oil.
It doesn't evaporate.
It has rust inhibitors.
Doesn't get thick in cold temperatures.
Easy to clean up.
Readily available.
Cheap.

How can you go wrong with something like that!

Try it, you just might like it.

Curtis

[TrickyCNC]

It's a light weight oil.
It doesn't evaporate.
It has rust inhibitors.
Doesn't get thick in cold temperatures.
Easy to clean up.
Readily available.
Cheap.

Curtis

It Stinks rotten !

[atwooddon]

OK, this is really OT. As I mentioned before, I was having trouble with my X axis not moving correctly. After I cleaned the rails and relubed the rails/bushings, I was finally able to complete the cutting of my wife's birthday present. It is a oval picture frame, approx 9" high and 6" wide carved from black walnut. Until I got everything moving easily again, it was doubtful I would be able to finish the carving in time. Thankfully, the machine ran for over 2.5 hours doing the finishing cut with a 1/8" ball end mill without missing a beat. So, thanks to input from John and this thread, I finished carving/cutting today. Attached picture is fresh off the CNC machine, no finishing effort yet. Thanks for your help guys!!!

Don

[microcarve]

Same scenario, but you wipe the parts down with transmission fluid. Come back a few weeks later and the parts look like they just came off the machine! ( Again depending on humidity.)

It's cheap compared high dollar rust inhibitors and space age lubricants (by weight). And you can get it anywhere!!

It's a light weight oil.
It doesn't evaporate.
It has rust inhibitors.
Doesn't get thick in cold temperatures.
Easy to clean up.
Readily available.
Cheap.

How can you go wrong with something like that!

Try it, you just might like it.

Curtis

I'll have to try that...

It Stinks rotten !

It's not too bad if you go with Zesty Lemon scented ATF.....


John

[microcarve]

OK, this is really OT. As I mentioned before, I was having trouble with my X axis not moving correctly. After I cleaned the rails and relubed the rails/bushings, I was finally able to complete the cutting of my wife's birthday present. It is a oval picture frame, approx 9" high and 6" wide carved from black walnut. Until I got everything moving easily again, it was doubtful I would be able to finish the carving in time. Thankfully, the machine ran for over 2.5 hours doing the finishing cut with a 1/8" ball end mill without missing a beat. So, thanks to input from John and this thread, I finished carving/cutting today. Attached picture is fresh off the CNC machine, no finishing effort yet. Thanks for your help guys!!!

Don

Wow Don, That Is Beautiful!



Thanks Very Much for the picture!
I'm inspired to go get myself some black walnut now!


John

[atwooddon]

Thanks John

I was fortunate enough to inherit quite a bit of 'old' black walnut from my uncle. He had it stored in the attic of his workshop for years. He decided he would never use it and told me to come over and get it. 'Come over and get it' meant a road trip from Calif to Montana to see my mother and also pick up the walnut for the trip back. I am not sure how many board feet it is but 2 complete layers of 3/4, 4/4 and 5/4 boards in the back of my Expedition. SCORE!!! His guess is the walnut is at least 25-30 years old, he picked it up from an estate auction about 15 years ago. Also got some mahogany and cedar.

My uncle is a cabinet builder (hobby) and also restores old furniture. Beautiful work, done the old way. Sure he has power tools, but most of the work is very traditional. He can do things with chisels and hammers that is amazing.

[microcarve]

Here's Ryans machine. I'll go over it once more and get it ready to
ship.....hopefully first thing Friday morning.

http://www.microcarve.com/mv3/ryan_g


Next one goes to South Australia. Not much more work left to go
on that one.


John

[microcarve]

.

A bunch of rail bushings in progress....





MDF parts are cutting better than ever on the bigbox machine....







These are fresh cuts with no sanding yet. Not much more than a quick
brush with a sanding sponge is needed....

It's working Great!


John

[microcarve]

An Enco order just came in...

I've been on the fence about getting a big drill chuck for a while....so I
decided to try one of the cheap ones from Enco. It doesn't have to do
real precision work, so I didn't expect much of it....$39 for a 3/4" chuck.

But, I'm very impressed. It's clean and smooth and runs very true.
Now I can stick stuff with 3/4" shafts into it without needing to do a lot of
collet changes. I'll see how it goes.....

Also I took a chance on a few hex keys that I need to replace on my
old HF set...which by the way, is a Very Good set of allen wrenches.
These were just $2 each and look really good.

A few misc big drill bits and end mills all for less than $100 shipped.

Enco has some really good stuff for even less $$ than can be found on
ebay. And shipping is fast too...

BTW...the first picture is about actual size of the chuck. Bigger around than
a beer can. Very Nice for $39!!!!

Well, Lots to do today. So, back to it....

John

[gmfoster]

John
Did you ever try Enco's bushings they are very reasonable..


You are still doing nice work I see.
GArry

[microcarve]

Squaring up some motor plates with the new big-a$$ chuck...

I got curious as to why it's so nice for only $39. Ohhhhh....it's made in
Taiwan....not China.

Looking good so far!


John

[microcarve]

John
Did you ever try Enco's bushings they are very reasonable..


You are still doing nice work I see.
GArry

Hi Garry,



Thanks very much!

Yep, I have gotten bushings from Enco in the past. But I find myself
in an odd position from other hobbyists in that I make the same things
over and over....(and over...)...

So...consistency can matter a great deal. Most people would never notice
little things like washers/bolts being different from one shipment to the
next, because they only need stuff a time or two. But over months,
batches of supplies are made on different machines and at different
times and with different qualities of materials.

So little tiny differences have created big problems in the past. My jigs
and fixtures wouldn't work so well with washers that were different
and varying thicknesses. Bushing O.D.s that are different make
my specially made boring bars useless.

Early on, those variances would cause lots of problems, but now I've
come to know what to expect and have been able to account for that
in advance. Now it's not a problem, but I've gotten used to paying a bit
more for consistency. And, I'd say it's worth it....knowing supplies are the
exact same, even when bought a year apart.

I've gotten some odd bushings from Enco that I didn't need but a few of
and they always work fine. But when I'll need a bunch of them over a long
period of time, I get them from McMaster. Oilite brand. Not odd imports...

Thomson rails are the same. Pay a little more, and rely on them working
100% of the time....


John

[Victor-Y]

I picked up the MV3 from the post office today. I need to paint the sides with John's recommended Zissner BIN. Then, I can put everything together.

Thanks, John. Everything looks great.

Victor

[microcarve]

I picked up the MV3 from the post office today. I need to paint the sides with John's recommended Zissner BIN. Then, I can put everything together.

Thanks, John. Everything looks great.

Victor

Thanks Very Much, Victor!



I appreciate the pictures a Huge amount! I'm so glad to see
it made it Home safely!


John

[microcarve]

Also...just for the record....

Here's the post about painting again....

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/1035013-post1177.html

That's as easy as painting will get, I do believe. The shellac
dries really fast and is pretty durable stuff.

Just do the edges first and keep a paper towel on hand to wipe
the spray nozzle....it's thin stuff and it'll drip there.

A very quick, light brush-over with a sanding sponge knocks off
any buildup.

Very Nice paint....if it's even technically 'paint'...


John

[microcarve]

A couple of the machines I hope to ship on Tuesday....

One goes to South Australia and one goes to Norway.

Finishing up one more needed Z axis today...

The flat rate boxes are proving to make things a lot more
practical for everyone. I didn't even know they had that size
of box at the P.O. for a long time. A lot of stuff fits in nicely.


John