[Pplug]

I've been testing the beta interface for the last 2 months and I have to say it has decreased my routing times in half! Sometimes I get better than half! Techno has reworked the post processor and has allowed me to raise the acceleration speeds of the router. It has been running much smoother than with the old interface.

I looked in the beta section today and BINGO! they released it to everyone!

You can still have the old interface run alongside the new version- If for some reason things don't work out. Me, personally, I would never look back! My large router is almost as fast as my little homebuilt CMM conversion using the updated interface.

Make sure you look at the settings in the postproccesor section for more fun.

[advt001]

I thought you had the dos based control? Where did you find the beta? I got a big order and have to get my 4896 running and if there is an upgrade for the old control I need it.

[Pplug]

It's not beta anymore! Anybody can get it at www.technorouters.com Just look in the servo interface page. Try your toolpaths with the default preprocessor settings first, then try the preprocessor settings to speed things up even more. This has been one of the best updates I have seen from techno.

Ohhh!! I almost forgot, we can now jog diagonally using the number keypad on the keyboard!

[Dave's_Not_Here]

.... I just finished getting 420Q installed and tweaked to run my 4th axis and now a "New and Improved" version... Guess I need to give Mike a call and have him on standby just in case all the tweak's we did get hammered... Sounds like it will be worth the effort though!

Dave

[Dave's_Not_Here]

... it has decreased my routing times in half! Sometimes I get better than half! Techno has reworked the post processor and has allowed me to raise the acceleration speeds of the router. It has been running much smoother than with the old interface.

...My large router is almost as fast as my little homebuilt CMM conversion using the updated interface.

Make sure you look at the settings in the postproccesor section for more fun.

Chris,

What speeds are you running that you couldn't run before?
What areas are "smoother" compared to 420Q?

Thanks,

Dave

[Pplug]

Hey Dave,

My name is chris, but it doesn't matter.

I noticed that I can run the router faster around curves. The gantry used to jerk and shake the whole table. Just the fact that they increased the acceleration number from a default of 10 to 25 makes a huge difference. With the old preprocessor, I would never be able to run it at those settings. The cut quality suffered with a waviness and the table would literally jump around!

[Dave's_Not_Here]

Hey Dave,

My name is chris, but it doesn't matter.

I noticed that I can run the router faster around curves. The gantry used to jerk and shake the whole table. Just the fact that they increased the acceleration number from a default of 10 to 25 makes a huge difference. With the old preprocessor, I would never be able to run it at those settings. The cut quality suffered with a waviness and the table would literally jump around!

Chris... (that's what I get for reading the signatures...

I have had to use a Techno ATC Inch Post Processor to get away from the jerking on the Arc's. Had to edit out the tool change G-Codes but got smooth interpolations. Sounds like Techno might have made that unnecessary now...

I am fairly new to the Techno system... what exactly does the acceleration number have to do with the speed?

Also, I thought the pre-processor just compiled the g-code into an executable file? Does is control the "look ahead" or something? Why did the old pre-processor slow you down?

Sorry if this sounds ignorant...

Dave

[Pplug]

You can save the old interface with all of your configurations. Just duplicate the folder and then compress the copy. That way the installer will not update the compressed 420q. and it would make it easy to go back.

I'm no expert with the controller software by any means, however, I have gotten significantly better. I use the postprocessor for techno rg inch in artcam for the past 2 years with minimal jerking but I also tuned on the advanced smoothing option in the interface.

As far as I know the preprocessor does setup the program for the router's look ahead and converts the gcode numbers into voltages that the machine needs to control the machine. In the old days, preprocessing was necessary because the computer could not keep up with the interface card. I believe the preprocessing soon might be a thing of the past but the minimum requirements for the computer will rise.

Techno also told me that they are planning an upgrade to allow Mach3 to control the interface card! That would be incredible!

[jmb]

Hey guys, I work for Techno engineering and want to clarify a few things.

Dave, the tweaks you made should be usable in version 1.421 as well. We didn't make any fundamental changes to the fourth axis setup. If you run into trouble, we'll be here to help.

Chris, you are correct about the preprocessor; it converts gcode into machine-level instructions. The company did that originally because computers were slow, and gcode was bad and getting smooth continuous motion through the gcode was tricky at best. Most companies (all other companies?), used the concept of 'look-ahead' to limit the amount of required computation. If you only see the next 3 moves, computation is fast! But you pay the price with a slower feedrate, because the machine has to be able to come to a full stop at the end of your look-ahead window.

Techno decided to convert the entire file, regardless of length. That way, computation power is irrelevant, and you only require computation when you click the preprocess button. Cutting the part over and over doesn't require any additional computation. I think our tagline there is “infinite look-ahead”, but we really side-step the problem entirely.

You'd expect computation to eventually get so powerful that preprocessing a file would be unnecessary. That hasn't happened in our case, because the more CPU power we have, the more we suck up. Version 1.421 has some pretty sophisticated algorithms in it; algorithms 'discovered' in the past few years, as well as some methods we've developed here. From the testing we've done so far (and it sounds like Chris has had the same experience), the math works pretty well. Our machines are not very expensive, so we can't use a million pounds of steel. We do our best to compensate for that by making our toolpath trajectory software intelligent. The improvements you see will be largely dependent on the quality of the gcode you're accustom to generating, and the type of path you use. But so far, everyone has reported a pretty big improvement.

Advanced Cut Smoothing
The 'Advanced Cut Smoothing' doesn't actually smooth the toolpath. It limits hard accelerations in the control to eliminate the whine you hear when running a file. It's really just an audible improvement (not related to cut quality), and we'll probably make it enabled by default in the future. I'm not sure how it got named the way it did, but it's certainly misleading.

Acceleration and Feedrate
The acceleration determines how quickly you'll be able to reach your max speed. So if you use something small (let's say 5 inches per second squared), it would take 1 full second to reach 300 inches per minute. But if you used 25, you'd be at 300 ipm in 2 tenths of a second! Acceleration determines how quickly you move around corners and curves too, so in the real world, a higher acceleration will speed up the overall motion.

James
Techno CNC
Engineering

[Dave's_Not_Here]

James,

Thanks for the post!

Hey guys, I work for Techno engineering and want to clarify a few things.

Dave, the tweaks you made should be usable in version 1.421 as well. We didn't make any fundamental changes to the fourth axis setup. If you run into trouble, we'll be here to help.

Stay close to your phone... I have a history of making something simple into something difficult...

Acceleration and Feedrate
The acceleration determines how quickly you'll be able to reach your max speed. So if you use something small (let's say 5 inches per second squared), it would take 1 full second to reach 300 inches per minute. But if you used 25, you'd be at 300 ipm in 2 tenths of a second! Acceleration determines how quickly you move around corners and curves too, so in the real world, a higher acceleration will speed up the overall motion.

James
Techno CNC
Engineering

Do the algorithms compensate for directional changes that are more acute vs. oblique, so that the cut does not suffer from the higher speed/acceleration in these transitions... or do we still have to do our own "compensation" by dialing down the initial feedrate?

If we still need to dial down the feedrate, where does the advantage of quicker acceleration come into play... just on larger parts with fewer transitions?

Lastly, is there any chance of Techno posting some YouTube videos of the new Servo upgrade? There are a number of good Techno videos from a European distributor, showing things like ATC configuration, and they are immensely beneficial... I think Techno could really ratchet up their support easily, with a YouTube channel full of Techno support videos...

James,

Thanks for the insights and for taking the time to elaborate for us Techno users. It means more than you realize.

Dave

[advt001]

James I thank you for joining us here and welcome.

[jmb]

Do the algorithms compensate for directional changes that are more acute vs. oblique, so that the cut does not suffer from the higher speed/acceleration in these transitions...

Oh yes. Absolutely. And you shouldn't need to do anything special to make it work. If you open Setup > Preprocessor, you'll find an entire "Corner Velocity Control" section that can help you fine-tune how it moves through corners. I will say, however, that in the months we've been testing performance, there was exactly one time I've ever vaguely needed to change the default corner settings.

Lastly, is there any chance of Techno posting some YouTube videos of the new Servo upgrade?

That's a great idea, and there is a pretty good chance we'll do it. I'm not sure how quickly I can make it happen, but I'll put it on the list. We've been pretty insanely busy in the past few months, but it's got to slow down sometime.

I'm glad I can help! I'm interested in your thoughts on the new software. We test as much as possible in-house, but your feedback on using our products is great. And if there is a bug that's bothering you, it's likely bothering someone else.

[Pplug]

Welcome to the zone!

Thanks for explaining some of the features and history of the the interface!

I think many people would like to know what the future plans are for the interface.

[RandK]

Interesting stuff. I'll give it a try. Good to see Techno here.

[advt001]

I'm still trying to determine if this upgrade will work for me. I have the SRV400
pci board. Has anyone had success with this 10 yr old board?

[jmb]

Hi advt001, the old SRV400 is an ISA-based card, not PCI. We also have a PCI400, which is the PCI-based version. The new interface won't work with the older SRV400 cards, so you may want to verify that you do indeed have the ISA version.

[advt001]

Thank you jmb you answered my question. Can you give me a ballpark price on the upgrade to the pci400 or is it even possible?I sure am glad you joined us.

[jmb]

advt001, I think I'm going to need some more info. But send me a PM (private message) with your email address, and I'll have someone contact you. It sounds like you have an older PC, so you may have to upgrade that too (we sell cheap computers we get in bulk from Dell, so maybe you'll want to get the whole package?). And we'll probably also need machine/motor info. I'll let someone else help you through that.

Sorry Chris, I don't mean to hijack the thread. I'm not familiar with the manners on this forum yet. But if you guys have specific questions about your machines, you can PM me or start a new thread. I'll try to keep up.

Oh, and you want to know about future plans, eh? Well, I can tell you that we're working very hard to bring the interface into this decade, and 1.421 is a big part of that. The software has been developed over the course of many years and many products, and it's due for a good cleaning. Version 1.422 (not out yet, even in beta) is already faster (program speed, not cut speed), with all the optimization we've done. It's a long process, but we think it's important. As soon as I can give you details, I'll do so.

[Pplug]

I could care less about hijacking posts! I'm just glad you are on the forum! It's nice to talk to somebody official who knows the products and development with out actually calling and waisting time. Besides, I always forget to call when I have time. I'm surprised techno does not have forums of thier own. But to be honest I think this forum would be better for the end user. Thanks for giving us a glimps into what might be rolling down the pike.

Btw.. This is my opinion, I think the old interface might be one of the leading factors in holding techno back from more sales! I'm glad to see it get the attention it deserves! I bought my personal lc4896 because I new the hardware was top notch and hoped the software would follow. 4.121 is great. One of the most sought after features I can think of is a real time preview of the curent job and table like in Mach 3. It would save me from making many stupid mistakes with table orientation(1 & -1) and allow me to use more scrap pieces. But it's my personal wish list.

Thanks for the work on the interface!

[Dave's_Not_Here]

... on the GUI.

A real-time processing window would be a big plus.

Also, the whole (1,-1) Scale Factor gets me whacked out every time I upgrade.

I want -x on the GUI, to move the gantry away from me and it moves toward me instead. I want -y to move the spindle away from me and it moves it toward me instead... I swap around the Scale Factors, swap the -/+, and when the axis move in the direction I want, then the x-0,y-0 changes and the gantry wants to run off the table rather than down the length of the bed...

soooo, I just live with the - Arrow Keys being "backwards" from what you normally want and at least get the gantry to move in the right direction down the table... not off...

Dave