[buffaloguy]

Ok Im a newbie and just got my first major (to me) issure today. I had everything working great for 65 parts then reset the bar puller for a few extra parts, the puller pulled the end stub out and the machine went on and cycled around, puller slammed the peice into the collet (3J style) and the machine turned off. Normally this isnt a problem, I just turn the machine off then on cause its in "emergency mode" and contunue on. This time is differnet, I was away for 30-40 mins before I realized this and now after I reset teh machine, all the tools are off .175" and the drills too. I can offset it to compensate but I want to fix the problem and not work around it. Its a brand new Doosan 220L with less than 300 hours. I was told teh tool holder (turrent) could be jarred and to loosen up teh bolts and realign it with a micro-indicator. Does this sound right? Is it something a guy with common sense can do or hire a repair man? Please help!

[Delw]

The turret has spun so to speak, not sure on your machine but there should be 4-8 bolts on the face of the turret and 2 tapered pins.
pull pins with slide hammer loosen bolts, indicate turret back in with a ID tool and Indicator in collet. put NEW pins in tighten bolts and let her rip.

Also cause you said the magic words (CRASH) your head stock could have been pushed to one side or the other. but in big dia long bar run inidator in Z axis ( indicator mounted to turrett) to see if head stock is square.

Turret fix is usually about 10-20 mins first time 30 mins to hour. tapered pins can be bought or made DO NOT USE STAINLESS mild steel ONLY as they are meant to shear or break so that doesnt damage the geneva drive.
you can run with out pins however if you cut large OD pcs or heavy cuts it will slip.


Delw

[RICHARD ZASTROW]

SPELL CHECKER

Dick Z

[mfgbydesign]

One addition to Delw's comment, before pressing in new tapered pins, run a tapered reamer in the holes to clen them up otherwise pressing the pins in may push it out of alignment.

[buffaloguy]

Thanks Delw! Hope all goes according to plan tomorrow at work and can be up and running quickly with your advice. Thanks again for the help.

As for Richard Zastrow, I am sorry I didnt get to use it for you. I can only imagine the grief and confusing those few mispelled words gave you. Had I had more time and not so rushed, I would have. But being just barely able to login and type all that, I could deal with the mispelled few words.

[littlerob]

I appreciate Delw's input, but I disagree vehemently. I say do NOT run the machine with the taper pins in, ever. If you have a real crash, your 30 minute job will turn into days possibly, when you have to remove kinked pins from the holes aligning a misaligned turret. I absolutely never run with the pins in, in fact it is one of the first things i do when a new machine arrives. The pins are designed for quick alignment, NOT to stabilize whilst running. Most techies will tell you this. Realigning a turret is a job you should know and be comfortable with, think if it as a learning curve of something you'll have to do again and again.

Robert

[Delw]

I appreciate Delw's input, but I disagree vehemently. I say do NOT run the machine with the taper pins in, ever. If you have a real crash, your 30 minute job will turn into days possibly, when you have to remove kinked pins from the holes aligning a misaligned turret. I absolutely never run with the pins in, in fact it is one of the first things i do when a new machine arrives. The pins are designed for quick alignment, NOT to stabilize whilst running. Most techies will tell you this. Realigning a turret is a job you should know and be comfortable with, think if it as a learning curve of something you'll have to do again and again.

Robert

Robert
I see your point and understand it completely. Ive tried it, after some employee bumps but it doesnt work in keeping the turret alinged perfectly all the time. Of course that all depends on what type of material your cutting and how big your parts are, not to mention what SFM and depth of cut your taking.
in our machines we were using a 8" chuck( they didnt have the 10" chuck and my customer couldnt wait for a 2 month delivery time ) turning alot of 6-8 inch parts in 304ss inconel 718 and tons of 9310.
We used ceramics alot on inco and trigons on the other stuff, usually it was .100 DOC or more and feeds around .015. due to the diameter of the part and the heavy cuts it tweaked after a while, mostly it was due to insert breakage then we would have to re aline the turret.
on the other 8 inch machine and 6" chuck machine we didnt have to worry about it, as they cut smaller material dia.

Theres pros and cons to both ways. I I had employees like I had before I will say I would remove the pins, but now I also have a 10" chuck machine so I dont have to worry about that either

We had some solid crashs with a few different employees and not once did I ever mess up a geneva drive or anything in the turrett gear box.
besides most of your crashes dont twist the turrett due to going in on the Z axis, they tend more to twist the turret head and the spindle houseing.

However there was the one time when I forgot a decimal place and fed .150 instead of .015, that sheared the pins right off and partly sheared the bolts holding it. if it wasnt for die grinds we would have never gotten that turret off to replace the bolts or pins.

I do agree with your way as well but not when your running a machine to the max and more.

Delw

[buffaloguy]

Hey Delw and Rob, I see there is much for me to learn about the tricks of trade. I'll get there eventually like you guys!! My Doosan had a cover plate with 8 tiny screws that led to 6 8mm bigger bolts that lead to 12 5?mm screws and what a nightmare to realign this machine. Could be cause its my first time and lack the correct tools(?) but resorted to calling a family friend to come in and do it/teach me for a few hundred bucks. Might sound like a waste to you but I figured it will be done right and will be a learning curve for me. whats another few hundred afterall the machine cost like 50k. AS for Rob, I mainly use aluminum 9 out of 10 times and rarely go over 1.625 od and DOP at .18 or so. Nothing huge and heavy like you...yet!

[Delw]

Most machines you only need allen wrenchs, and a long 1" rod.

Loosen bolts up slightly( after takeing pins out and cover off) put 1" bar in od holder and move up or down till indicated. index a few times do it again. your suppose to do it with power off, but I always did it with power on.
make sure you tighten them evenly like you would a tire.

Delw

[littlerob]

Having someone do it for you is smart(if you can afford it). If you learned how to do it, than great. Because, it will NOT be the last time. Usually when it is something new like that, you're thinking man am I doing this right? And that's normal and okay. Now you know and will be doing 1/2 hour realigns in no time.

Robert

[buffaloguy]

Well the machine is fixed up and done correctly. From what I saw and learned, I would have never been able to do it on my own the first time. I mentioned before about the bigger 8mm bolts, those should have not been loosened up. Rather just the 12 6mm ones. Then to re-calibrate the 'home' position to the actual zero's and then to the tool setter would have drove me to drink! Then I didnt know how to reset the parameters by holding down a certain few buttons as the machine turns on etc.. But on a postive note, it was just an alignment, nothing broke or had to be replaced. Rob, I hope this doesnt happen again. Since my first time turning the machine on with only 2 days of intructions I only broke one drill and a 1/4 in boring bar.

Thanks guys!!

[littlerob]

Sounds good Bro. I am not trying to warn you to be careful about handling machinery (that should go without saying). What I am telling you is that it WILL happen again, if you run it. That's okay it doesn't make you a hack or anything, it just happens. :banana: You will push it and it will happen. Good luck man.

Another thought; it is really a good skill to have when things start to go awry and you can check that and eliminate it as a possibility, or fix it and eliminate it as a possibility.

Also the idea here has been that this happens when crashes occur or when you're turning big crap. BUT when you are turning small crap you sure notice .001" off center when you are boring a .05" hole. So small crap is affected too.

Robert

[ppascuzzi]

The turret has spun so to speak, not sure on your machine but there should be 4-8 bolts on the face of the turret and 2 tapered pins.
pull pins with slide hammer loosen bolts, indicate turret back in with a ID tool and Indicator in collet. put NEW pins in tighten bolts and let her rip.

Also cause you said the magic words (CRASH) your head stock could have been pushed to one side or the other. but in big dia long bar run inidator in Z axis ( indicator mounted to turrett) to see if head stock is square.

Turret fix is usually about 10-20 mins first time 30 mins to hour. tapered pins can be bought or made DO NOT USE STAINLESS mild steel ONLY as they are meant to shear or break so that doesnt damage the geneva drive.
you can run with out pins however if you cut large OD pcs or heavy cuts it will slip.


Delw

Don't forget to also check if the turret is tilted. Run the x axis up and down with the indicator reading the face of the tool plate, it should be square to the z axis.

For checking head stock alignment (taper) I prefer to use a mag base cylindrical square. Chuck up a piece of steel face it off with light cuts and then center the square on it. Now you can put your indicator base on the face of the turret and measure if the square is tilted as you run the z axis back and forth. Adjust the headstock until you are dead nuts on. With a little practice you can easily get it to with in .0002 inches taper over 6 inches.

If you happen to have a lath that does not have adjusting bolts or screws instead of loosening it up and tapping it into place with a dead blow hammer see if you can add a plate and some push bolts to use to make the adjustment.

You'll have to look at the machine and consider what happens as you move stuff. Some types are not as easy as others. For instance a Hardinge Quest lathe has the X axis mounted in the normal slant bed style but the head stock is mounted on a horizontal plane, with this style you have to adjust for taper and at the same time push the head stock in or out to have the spindle center aligned with center of the tool pockets. (If the lathe also has a Y axis you can just adjust the offset to achieve this)