[efinkg]

I'm trying to retrofit to EMC and I think I'm almost done, but I'm not sending my Enable signal anywhere from the Mesa 7i33, and the servos don't drive.

Anyone know where the Enable signal should go, if anywhere, or has anyone used Mesa products to convert a Hurco?

Thanks.

[gthlm]

PM me with your email address if you want a pdf of the manual, burny used to let you download it but it seems they want you to register to do that now...

Anyway, from a quick glance at it I don't think there is any enable on the servomate, basically it's on when it gets power. There are however limit switch inputs on each axis (RDD and LDD) that will inhibit motion when pulled to ground, also the reset and fault lines (RTS and FLT) will do the same thing so make sure they are all clear.

[efinkg]

I have a copy of the manual, thanks, it's just a little confusing to read through and I was having trouble finding any mention of enabling.

I'm also completely lost on PID settings, I suspect that it's a big part of the problems I'm having but I don't even know where to start with them. It looks like the main idea is to adjust them until things get unstable then shift back a little, but I'm not sure.

[gthlm]

It's a good while since I was mucking about with emc2 and the mesa boards, but one immediate thought I have is do you have auxiliary power plugged into your 7i33 or are you relying on the bus power from the 5i20? The 7i33 really needs it's own supply to work reliably.

More importantly, are you using pncconf (and the latest build of emc2?).

[efinkg]

I do not have auxiliary power, which I should work on.

Quick question, I believe I'm feeding 5VDC to the encoders and the limit switches, and the limit switches are only reading at 1.25 volts at-switch, and half that at the terminal blocks both on the servo amp and the 7i37 connected to EMC. Is this right?

[efinkg]

Another question, my Fault lines (Servo Amp Terminal Block, 4 and 5) are not connected to anything, but I also have no fault LEDs shown.

Everything short of the motors works, and I'm running out of ideas.

[rbalister]

Hmm, doesn't sound right. If you have the inductive switches (black plastic blocks) for limit switches, you should see 5VDC between the supply line and return. The third line (output) should change states when you put a screwdriver or some other ferrous metal thing near the end. The high level should match the supply voltage - nominally 5VDC.

Trace the supply line back to the power supply. You might have a loose or bad connection somewhere.

[efinkg]

I only checked the physical switches on the Z axis, but the terminal board voltages are consistent. I also get a solid ground on any axis that has reached limit.

I can check up on the feed voltages, the 7i33 is putting out a solid 5v, but I don't know if there is a second feed that might be screwing things up. Any idea what the threshold voltage on the limit switches is?

[rbalister]

The original inductive switches were made by Visolux. They were acquired by Pepperl&Fuchs a while back. The new number for the limit switches is 101XK5-1. Looking up the spec sheet for these shows that they want 5VDC +/-0.5V. If you're only getting 1.25V or so at the switch, that won't be enough. If you haven't checked at the switch, pull the box off and open the cover. You should find three small terminal strips stuffed into the box. On the switch you'll see a schematic representation of the switch and it will indicate which ones need to be supply and which is the output. These things don't draw much current (~20mA) so they shouldn't be loading down the supply, or whatever is driving them. That is, unless it's pretty weak to begin with.

If you want to see the specs for the switches, try this link.

http://www.newark.com/pdfs/datasheet...s/101XK5-1.pdf

I believe only the X and Y axis has these as limit switches. The Z axis has mechanical switches.

rayb

[efinkg]

So I have the limit switches showing 5V and external power attatched to the 7i33, there is a +/- 10v going to the DAC and DAC return on the servo amps, but still no go.

All ran OK before the retrofit, and I'm getting flummoxed.

Double checked the 60V AC and 120C AC inputs, and both are good. I've removed limit switches via pncconf, and still nothing.

Can I get a verification from someone with a running machine on the DAC voltages and what the fault line voltages are at the terminal board?

[rbalister]

If everything ran fine before the retrofit, the amps should be setup fine. Don't mess with the tuning pots.

If you have 60VAC going to the amps, you should see four LEDs lit on the fault card, they're +12, -12, XMFR, and PBU.

If PBU is not lit, that means that the drives don't have bus voltage. Check the AC supply going to the fault card. There's a rectifier that, along with the big cap in the upper left corner, generates the bus voltage. If you have 60VAC on the fault card, check the voltage on the cap. It should be somewhere around 80VDC. There are also a few fuses on the fault card that you may need to check. Finally, check the voltage on the grey/red wires on the top connector (J3) on the amp cards. Verify that they have bus voltage also. On each of the amps, the motor leads are pins 2/3 (motor +) and 4/5(motor -). With the power off, take the connector off J3 and measure the resistance between 2 or 3 and 4 or 5. You should see some resistance. I'm not sure what it should be exactly, but I would guess that it should be somewhere below at least 1K ohm.

When you say that you have +/-10V going to DAC and DAC return, are you measuring between DAC and ground and DAC return and ground or just between DAC and DAC return? It makes a difference. DAC/DAC return is a differential input into the power amp and represents a voltage proportional to the desired motor VELOCITY. If you're reading 10V on both pins with respect to ground, that would translate to zero velocity, or no movement. If you're driving this with a single ended output from the 7i33, try connecting DAC return to the signal common, or GND, on the 7i33.

If you have correct LED indications on the fault card and none of the axes are in a limit, try connecting a AA battery across DAC and DAC return. This will give a command voltage of around 1.5V and should at least make the motor spin. Reversing the battery should reverse the direction. If you reach a limit, reverse the battery. The amps are configures such that you are able to drive out of a limit condition.

[efinkg]

All axes run now, thanks to all, I had a limit switch wiring failure.

Hopefully upon adding a cable between the 7i43 and 7i37 the axes will stop bouncing between max throws at full speed.

[efinkg]

I'm looking to add a hardware E-Stop, since I'm not willing to trust EMC 100%, and I was looking to add something that disables all the servo amps. In the Randtronics Manual I read that pulling J1-6 and J1-12 together will prevent motion in either direction. I was also looking at pulling the fault line RTS on the terminal board in position 4 to ground.

Thoughts?

(Thanks so much)

[rbalister]

Even simpler, drop the power to the bus. Use the enable line from EMC to drive a relay that supplies power for the bus (ACC relay maybe). In series with the relay wire your Estop NC contacts. When you hit the Estop it will open the circuit and remove the enable and the bus power will be disconnected. All hardware, no software required. In addition, I wouldn't trust the fault circuits for Estop. If you're going to open or close a relay or other contacts with the Estop, best to remove the power altogether. Leave the fault lines for just that - faults.

[efinkg]

Thanks rbalister. I was going to use the ACC relay, upon thinking about it further.

Can someone verify how TB3-30 behaves when enabling the ACC relay? I expect it applies 5VDC with a common reference point, but I no longer have a functioning Machine Personality Board.

Thanks!

[rbalister]

After looking at the schematics and taking a few measurements, I believe I've come up with the operation sequence.

1. COR (control voltage) relay is off and SER (servo or ACC relay) relay is off.
2. Pressing POWER button allows 24V (TB3-1, 2, 3) to go to COR relay through air pressure switch (if installed) and overloads, finally landing on TB3-10. The CPU controls the ability to energize COR by either opening TB3-11 or routing it to ground, probably through an opto isolator on the personality card.
3. Once COR is energized, this routes 24V to the start switch and to a normally open contact on SER.
4. Pressing START momentarily applies 24V to TB3-17 and 18, then through a diode and finally to TB3-28 and 27. This is one side of the control coil for the SER relay. The other side lands on TB3-30 and eventually to the personality card. The personality card controls the relay by opening or grounding this line.
5. Once the relay is energized, the previously mentioned NO contacts will now be closed and supply 24V to the coil and latching it closed. The CPU can open the relay by removing the ground from TB3-30.

It appears it's not as simple as applying a voltage to TB3-30. I hope this helps. If you don't have the schematics, let me know and I'll email them to you.

[efinkg]

I have removed a significant percentage of the components from the Hurco, including the machine personality board. What if I were to apply 24V to the outputs of TB3-30 using a power switch that closed a circuit from the power supply inside the machine, seperate from that on the main power cabinet which allows 220V into the machine, or possibly used a 5v NO relay to do the same?

[rbalister]

OK, if you've removed alot of the original components look at doing the following.

1. Ground TB3-30. Don't send it to +24V, otherwise you'll have to ground the other side of the relay and reverse the snubber diode across the SER coil. In addition, the indicator diode will no longer function.
2. Apply 24VDC to TB3-4, 12, 13.
3. To close the SER relay, momentarily apply 24V to TB3-17, 18.

This will latch SER closed.

Do you plan on using any of the other relays on the control board? If so, that may change the recommendation above.

[efinkg]

My machine appears to not have those connections live to anything, although I may have removed them while retrofitting. I'm looking to energize the ACC relay, unless this is the same thing as the SER relay and we just have different notation.

[rbalister]

Yes, the SER relay on the control board (relay K5) is the one that the personality board activates to send 120VAC to the ACC relay. Sending 120VAC to ACC will energize the ACC coil, closing it's contacts and powering up the servo drives.

The start switch was connected to TB3-17. Nothing was previously connected to TB3-4, 12 or 13. Originally, 24VDC was connected to TB3-1, 2, and 3. TB3-4, 12, and 13 are in the middle of the relay control logic and are the nearest terminals to the SER relay (with minimal impact on the other relays) once the power and start switches are removed. Unless you use another relay to switch 120VAC to the ACC relay, you will need to activate the SER, or servo relay.

If you have a set of schematics, look at the page for the control magnetics, CRP. It's drawing 002-2513-051 sheet 2 of 3. If you don't have them, I can send you a copy. They make things much more clear than what I've written here. I'm sort of cheating by writing while I look at the drawings.