[louieatienza]

"Now how pedantic can you get"

Check out Australia's laws on firearms, and anything that looks like a firearm.

CE marking is there to make sure that the products that are being sold are safe to use. I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that you did, but it seems like it's from a lack of knowledge on the subject.

+1.. In the US we have UL (Underwriters Laboratories). I think CE is more stringent as far as certain materials used, but I believe most all products passing CE certification woild also pass UL.

[louieatienza]

Louie, at least with the design of the basic SVM-0 standardising with the split head and an 80mm bore for spindle mounting, you can pick and choose if/when you want to upgrade a spindle or two...

Yes of course I realize this... I do have the first split head SVM-0..

Since there is no belt, repositioning the spindle also becomes a possibility depending on the job at hand.

[The Blight]

If a reseller is importing from outside the EU, then the reseller is responsible for CE marking, not the manufacturer.

From For distributors - European Commission

"If distributors (or importers) market the products under their own names, they then take over the manufacturer’s responsibilities. In this case they must have sufficient information on the design and production of the product, as they will be assuming the legal responsibility when affixing the CE marking."

If the reseller is selling the product under their name, then they assume responsibility for the product. Then they have to either make sure that the product complies with the directives from the manufacturer, or alter it themselves. If the product complies with the CE directives, then they can simply slap a sticker on it. This is highly unlikely for a product such as this (complexity).

[The Blight]

+1.. In the US we have UL (Underwriters Laboratories). I think CE is more stringent as far as certain materials used, but I believe most all products passing CE certification woild also pass UL.

I have more experience with the FDA when it comes to US regulations. After spending a few years in a company manufacturing medical devices for the international market I got to see some of the documentation that is needed to comply with the FDA regulations, and I believe the company spent more time on these regulations than any other.

[handlewanker]

Louie.....on the subject of the draw bar toggle design....it's only a hypothesis, merely a doodle on the IPAD, but as it progressed many months ago it became apparent that it did have potential......over centre toggle type actuators are self locking and of many different designs, no two alike, and I'm fully aware of cam actions too.

I have a very real interest in a draw bar release for my manual mill as I have to stand on a box to reach the top of the draw bar nut when removing tools, but as it's the screw in variety in a quill, like a Bridgeport, I won't be "reinventing" it in this lifetime.
Ian.

[Skyfire]

Hi, I just watched a video tutorial for G code on UTUBE.....all is now clear as to what the procedure is and the sequence it gets done in.

The video was just a piece of plate with corners rounded off, but to get from A to B and allow for cutter diam as well when turning the corners and going in a different direction, is now clear to me.

This experience is like pointing someone in the right direction and taking the blindfold off......without the first few lines of the starting sequence G code nothing else makes sense.
Ian.

congratulations Ian! the first step to start from G0... It's not that complicated to understand G codes. Just command the tool nose to "go" here and there in the coordinate system...lol You can imagine it in your mind without any demo software now.. The higher class curve G codes like G2/G3 is something like a math function and the CNC controller core will explore it to many line segments and result shows as a curve.

M codes I think means "motion?" to command machine to do something else..Such as M3 to command spindle start rotation forward and M4 reverse. Totally not a hard thing to understand. So enjoy learning!

[Skyfire]

Thank you guys for many knowledge of the CE certification. I did a little homework on this too today. It's a little complex and seems that manufacturer and reseller can do this both. The CE on manufacturer side are mostly required during importing process for customs clearance. And if the products are sold on EU market, CE is required and reseller side need to be responsible for that. I only have individual customers in EU now and not have sales in EU local market yet..Things should be easier under such situation. If I will have EU resellers in future, CE is surely necessary no matter it's done on my side or reseller side.

As I know, there are some third CE certification body in China too and can do that for me. They can help to find problems on machine and test them to pass CE and sign a certificate for you. Only two steps for me: 1. make sure SVM machines comply CE standard, 2. spend money for detection and get CE certificate..

BTW.. the "CE" is not a "Chinese E**" thing..lol, It is "self declaration of compliance" by manufacturer (maybe sometimes it's like a tricky) It's not formal and the manufacturer must take full responsibility for this. The formal legal ones should be "Certificate of compliance" from third party body, or "EC Attestation of conformity" from a Notified Body of EU.

I hope I understand this right and will do CE works once I have EU resellers soon.

Thanks again.

[Skyfire]

Thank you Defeng for Detailing the situation really appreciate , it will help to see further to us

You are welcome Thanks to your guys' support.

[G59]

BTW.. the "CE" is not a "Chinese E**" thing

We know, was joking.

[rustyh]

Just for the record,

G = General code (preparatory).
M = Miscellaneous code.

The actual official name of the G&M language is RS-274D, it was set by the Electronics Industry Association (EIA) in the 1960's.

Codes that begin with G are called preparatory words because they prepare the machine for a certain type of motion.

Codes that begin with M are called miscellaneous words. They control machine auxiliary options like coolant and spindle direction. Only one M-code can appear in each block of code.

[jips]

I don't understand how you can want to operate a cnc without nowing the way it works ! When i learned cnc at school i wrote pages and pages of G codes with pen and paper including the path corresponding of the codes i aslo have to read book of machining and code BEFORE putting a finger on a machine , i really not understand the way that your are taking the learning curve more over it will be very frustrating to not know how to do or operate in front of your shiny brend new beauty , i'm a real passionate of my job a new machine in the shop or new tool and i'm like a child at dysneyworld but seriously please take the thing in the right way step by step is a reason if we learn as it ! And it's the same for the cam software , when i read that you need to see the simulation again you take it upside down , the graphic path are pretty new on cnc before that before use a program we have to test it without the stock to see if everything will be ok and if it is CORRESPONDING to what you programed BEFORE . All I said is advice nothing insulting , plus you'll be more zen and confident and in safety when the time to hot the cycle start will come

[jips]

Attachment 276536
If i have to resume this button will be your first futur best friend

[handlewanker]

G code, G code, my kingdom for some G code.........LOL........it's getting clearer the more I see it in action.

The tutorials on UTUBE are very basic and simple.....just what I need.

You have to start somewhere, same as driving a car........getting behind the wheel is a tight lipped experience.....ask my daughter how she started.........I put her behind the wheel of her just bought 1967 manual VW Beetle, got out and said ....go for it, first having shown her how to declutch and change gears etc.......long story.

After a hop, skip and a jump, she rode around and around on a big empty car park for several hours, then changed into second gear.......LOL.......top gear was a long way away.....reversing even further......but now after 20 + years I can sit in the passenger seat and not have to be sedated......LOL.

From nothing, to understanding the sequence of G,M,F, I,J and T in the code took a few times looking at the tutorials on UTUBE.....but it gets easier each time.....and I'm going it alone.....whew.

What makes it easier is seeing a work piece with someone setting out the sequence blow by blow so I can see the events as they transpire......it's going to happen.

BTW, JIPS, what's that button for?.........emergency stop?
Ian.

[jips]

Called "single block" it allows you to run the program line by line , block to block ( gcode basic ) cycle start button to hit for each block moving , added to a slow rapid and boom you see what you code clearly and also your mistake , combine with the empty cycle and you can avoid or at least reduce at is best the crash or just a dead piece

[handlewanker]

BTW, I still can't see why a simulation of a real machine would not be useful.

If you wrote what you thought was the way to go, putting it on a simulator would highlight where it's going to go before you actually have a crash burn experience.....pixels are fire proof.

If I had the time I'd build a small one very simply from wood with draw runners for slides and Allthread for screws, driven by small steppers.... whatever....no spindle as such just a pencil in a holder etc. and see where the dang thing is going to go when I feed it with some G food, but decent electronics to achieve that would be just as costly as the real thing, and be redundant when you've finished with it.

Moving the slides around under actual CNC control in that fashion would give a feel to the pattern of events far better than seeing it in hyper space as a 2D image, and nothing can get bent up that cost mega bucks to repair.......hmmmmmm......food for thought....a training module to get you onto that first rung of the ladder.

Second thoughts....maybe a small cheapy EBAY CNC 3020 router ready to go, preferably second hand, $300 max... would save time and could be sold on afterwards
Ian.

[jips]

Good idea for the small wooden cnc an inexpensive way to simulate and learn the code more" funny" path and strategies . But even if i'm only 30 i still telling you nothing will be better than a good learning book a paper a pen and your brain nothing old shool just the right way . As you say for your daughter driving on the parking is like the empty cycle the first gear is like the single block but you don't take her to the hiway with this first drive knowledge that's why there is formation to know how and what to do with your car the road signs, others drivers etc... here in France if you don't pass the theory test you cannot take the drivewheel with the instructor

[jips]

An other good exemple as gcode is a language , if you want to learn french listening to a french singer or watching french movie will not maje you able to do more than bonjour and je t'aime paris that's why there is teachers or books and that's why machining and cnc machining are a job there is many other exemple if you want to do your code only by a cam software it's same if you don't read the manual take formation or learn the how it works the tutorials etc you will never or maybe very long time to do it wright because there is step to follow in the good order like gcode phrases and when you it the generate code it's not finish you have the editing gcode step you also have to check the post pro to know if it's corresponding etc... very often you have to modify the generated code to correct mistake or adjust it or modify or getting better so even if you only use cam or conversational mode you have to be able to read understand and modify if needed the generated code, you see the thing ?

[jips]

But i can bet that even if you stand on your idea to build your house by the roof , after some try even if you success you will go back yourself to the floor to go deeper and learn it at his best because that's it when your passionate

[handlewanker]

"Now how pedantic can you get"

Check out Australia's laws on firearms, and anything that looks like a firearm.

CE marking is there to make sure that the products that are being sold are safe to use. I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that you did, but it seems like it's from a lack of knowledge on the subject.

Hi.....it was merely to state, (in my humble opinion) that the European theatre of machinery production is making it extremely difficult to produce products that are as good as they were 50 years ago and to compete on a "better product" rating than China can produce in bulk for the masses.

This is not to say that China is slip shod and slack assed in their approach to product quality......looking back to the last 50 years, the expectations of product quality today does not exceed those produced before all this certification got into gear.....design and better techno advances not in that equation ......if that is not the case, why do people hold onto stuff they treasure from when their Dad was a boy.

My old Black and Decker D720 2 speed drill with all attachments is still going strong, and I bought it second hand in the early 70's.

Too much "looking after" makes for too much legislation.....somebody has to pay for it...... to ensure that everyone is being looked after, and God and his guardian angels can get fat and lazy and go and sleep.

I wonder if Rolls Royce or M Benz would compare to a CE standard 50 years ago.......somehow, I think they would have to have self emptying ashtrays into environmentally friendly bags that took the prospect of the Human element dumping the ash on the road side.....LOL.....the French are the worst culprits for pedanticism, followed by the Swiss, and the Germans follow the crowd because they have to.......my opinion entirely.
Ian.

[handlewanker]

Hi Jips.....lots of posts went by as I was out to lunch......I agree with what you say in the learning, but for me a book is a mass of words and I get more from a video with hands on and doing it even if it's only simulated......my sensory perception in the visual mode is more sharply tuned than the neuro cortex stimulation from seeing words that have to be translated into a visual context.

That is the reason I said that a simple test machine to play on and see how the tool reacts to coded input would make more sense to me than a highly detailed essay on G code and it's effects.

A 20 min video on UTUBE meant more to me than reading how G code controls the tool.

BTW, I learned to do screw cutting at the age of 14, by watching my father at work one day, and he let me have a go afterwards, when the boss was away......maybe the grey cells are on a different plane....LOL........some say it's intuitive.
Ian.