[Gundawg]

I would like to add a CNC mill to my shop I have a small marine products business and I have a few things I would like to build from aluminum. I have a Shopbot CNC router that I make a lot of parts out of HDPE & UHMW plastic. The router could cut some aluminum but it would be slow and since I have a MDF vacuum table on the router the use of coolant would not work.

I have a few questions what options are a good buy and what would be better to pass on. The vise they list seems expensive when I believe I could get a Kurt for that money as an example. I have a fourth axis for my router table I have never used I am thinking I might be able to use it with the Tormach it has a stepper motor. I am sure I could order the driver for the fourth axis.

I plan to do prototyping and small runs of parts. I was watching the video on the tool setting and it seems pretty fast compared to the routine I go through with my router. I don't think I want to spend the extra money on the tool changer but that would be a nice option. Are you guys happy with the performance of your Tormach? You can send me a PM if you would rather not post on here.

I have a Wells Index Manual mill it is a little bigger than a Bridgeport I have thought about converting it but I need to make parts not work on a machine. I do not have room for a large machine and do not have the electric service to run more than a 4 or 5 HP motor. I only have 100 amp service to the shop and I need to run other machines. All the machine centers I find used have huge motors on them and they are too big for the space I have for the machine. I have a couple manual lathes as well. I would like to end up with a small CNC lathe eventually as well. I may have to get rid of one of my lathes to add a CNC lathe but that is another decision for another time. I want to get into a CNC Mill for now.

Let me know what you think.

Mike

[flyinchips]

I can say I'm happy with my Tormach. if you read through this topic, I think you'll see that the vast majority are happy with their Tormach. There are some problems discussed in this topic list too. Again, if you read, I think you'll see that they are addressed by Tormach. So, no worries there.

I too, make prototypes. A tool changer would be nice, but as I usually am making a few pieces, I am carefully watching the initial jobs run to be certain there are no hiccups. This requires me to stand by the machine and watch, so I might as well change the tools. If production were my goal, the tool changer would be a must on a VMC, not the Tormach. I would go out and buy a used VMC to zip through the parts. I'm not interested in competing for those jobs, so no VMC.

I don't know about the vise, I did not buy one as I already had one. I know that careful shopping can reap some savings if you have the time to shop carefully. I purchased many of the recommended items on the deluxe list. The only disappointment was a $95.00 software package (I've forgotten the name, because I don't use it.) There are many free things on the web that does what the collection of stuff does, so avoid "Machinist Toolbox" or whatever it is called IMHO. Buy more Drill chucks than you think you'll need and consider buying more ER20 collets too. This allows you to keep your regulars in the tool table for repeated use.

There is a fellow on the web: NYCNC.com that has documented his first year of owning a Tormach very well. I recommend you go look at his videos to get and understanding of the entire process. He has a chapter on a competitors vise (Glacern), his thoughts on tooling both good and not so good selections. The series is well worth a few hours of your time to better understand some of the options.

[philbur]

Hi Mike,

Everything beyond the basic machine is a judgment of cost versus convenience. If you are using it to make money then convenience that saves time makes money. So my pick is:

- TTS with lots of holders.
- Powered drawbar
- Coolant system (so enclosure needed)
- Vice, vices or other quick change part holding devices
- 3D sensor/edge finder

If you work mostly in aluminium you might want to consider the 770, double the spindle speed could mean double the production rate. You could use the speeder on the 1100 but you might want to confirm how it would hold up 24/7.

Phil

[philbur]

Should have started new thread, sorry.

Phil

[MichaelHenry]

The 5" vise that Tormach sells is US-made and is a very good fit for the mill. There are not many (any?) 5" vises on the market now that I am aware of and Kurt stopped making 5" vises a while back. Personal opinion only, but I wouldn't trust a business to a cheap import vise.

Several owners use the Kurt 6" vise and seem quite satisfied with it, but it seems a little big for the Tormach mill to me. I might feel differently if I needed the larger capacity more.

Phil pretty much summed up how I feel about the items he listed. The Haimer probe is a really useful tool and I've grown quite dependent on mine. I'm also a fan of step jaws in the vise.

Mike

[dbrija]

The 5" vise that Tormach sells is US-made and is a very good fit for the mill. There are not many (any?) 5" vises on the market now that I am aware of and Kurt stopped making 5" vises a while back. Personal opinion only, but I wouldn't trust a business to a cheap import vise.

Several owners use the Kurt 6" vise and seem quite satisfied with it, but it seems a little big for the Tormach mill to me. I might feel differently if I needed the larger capacity more.

Phil pretty much summed up how I feel about the items he listed. The Haimer probe is a really useful tool and I've grown quite dependent on mine. I'm also a fan of step jaws in the vise.

Mike

Glacern makes a nice 5" CNC and standard vice. I have the 6" and have been totally happy with it. Worth a look....

[LazyMan]

The 5" vise that Tormach sells is US-made and is a very good fit for the mill

Where does it say they are made in the USA? I was under the impression that it was an overpriced Chinese made vise.

[Magnum164]

Question was already asked.



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[Magnum164]

Where does it say they are made in the USA? I was under the impression that it was an overpriced Chinese made vise.

I totally missed your post... However, when I bought my 770 I had to wait at least 2-3 months for my vise (it felt like that anyway adn well over a year or more ago). But I got buy without it. I thought they had told me they they had shipped from the factory and would be in within 3 weeks. That lead me to believe they were being shipped from China.

[Gundawg]

Thanks for the input. I am trying to decide between a slightly larger used machine or the Tormach. On the plus side for Tormach is tech support & this forum that is important to me. Without tech support and a great user forum I would have been lost with my ShopBot router it was my first experience with CNC.

After learning to run the router proficiently I feel the mill will not be as tough. I do production on a small scale and I am hoping I can make some money with this machine and it is not too slow. I generally plan other shop tasks while I am making parts with my router but with it I make many parts at one time with the 8'x4' table. I am thinking with this machine it will only be a few parts due to the work envelope and fixturing. The vacuum table on the router makes holding parts simple and fast.

Right now I have an order with a CNC shop for $2600 worth of parts material costing about $600 so if I had my own machine that would have been a big chunk towards the cost of the machine.

Thanks for the input and if I end up buying the Tormach I am sure I will be back with many more questions.

Thanks Mike

[Don Clement]

I also do prototyping and limited production. My shop is also limited in space with 100amp service. The Tormach 1100 has worked out very well for me.

I found that the Kurt D688 vise works for me on the 1100. YMMV.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1.../PCNC_Kurt.jpg

BTW I found the Power Draw Bar and lots of TTS toolholders a must.

Don

[LazyMan]

I found that the Kurt D688 vise works for me on the 1100. YMMV.

That a real nice and big vise. It's nice to know that it fits on the 1100.

I totally missed your post... However, when I bought my 770 I had to wait at least 2-3 months for my vise (it felt like that anyway adn well over a year or more ago). But I got buy without it. I thought they had told me they they had shipped from the factory and would be in within 3 weeks. That lead me to believe they were being shipped from China.

Makes sense. Besides, anything made in the US these days seems to have "proudly made in the USA" stamped everywhere.

[MichaelHenry]

Where does it say they are made in the USA? I was under the impression that it was an overpriced Chinese made vise.

Check the pictures on the Tormach web site, in the Products | Workholding section and look at Image 12 in the slide show. The label says "Made in USA".

Mike

[diyengineer]

Where does it say they are made in the USA? I was under the impression that it was an overpriced Chinese made vise.

The 1100 isn't made in the USA and works great. Glacern Makes some good stuff!

[MichaelHenry]

Thanks for the input. I am trying to decide between a slightly larger used machine or the Tormach.

You might also check here:

Mill Demos & Referrals | Tormach LLC | We provide personal small CNC machines, CNC tooling, and many more CNC items

to see if there is a Tormach owner near you that is willing to demo or discuss his mill with you. There's a map at that web page with clickable flags for each of these owners. I've shown mine to several people in the past, for example. Seeing one in person can really help you evaluate the mill and its capabilities.

Mike

[philbur]

I use to be on the list and now I'm not:violin:

Phil

to see if there is a Tormach owner near you that is willing to demo or discuss his mill with you.

[Magnum164]

Check the pictures on the Tormach web site, in the Products | Workholding section and look at Image 12 in the slide show. The label says "Made in USA".

Mike

And I check mine and it does have that marking as well. I should also say I bought a Kurt D688 as well and using on my 770.. Rather large, but if I ever get a bigger machine my thinking is I can reuse the vise and/or jaws on it.

[MichaelHenry]

I use to be on the list and now I'm not:violin:

Phil

What happened?

Mike

[LazyMan]

Check the pictures on the Tormach web site, in the Products | Workholding section and look at Image 12 in the slide show. The label says "Made in USA".

Yes you are correct. The machinists vise does say "made in USA" in the product description. I was looking looking at the CNC vise which certainly cannot be made in the US considering the "$312 vs $500 price tag. Then again $312 is not so bad considering the added functionality over a standard vise and the ability to fit 3 on a 1100.

The 1100 isn't made in the USA and works great. Glacern Makes some good stuff!

I wasn't trying to suggest that made in china means the product is bad, but certainly wouldn't use Chinese made endmills not matter where the mill was made. I was also looking at the $500 machinists which I thought was made in China, which would be absolutely ridiculous. If I were to purchase a mew vise I would probably buy Glacern.

[philbur]

Don't know?

Phil

What happened?

Mike