[MrBean]

I just got one of those little "indoor" dragonfly helicopters. Great fun.
While searching for heli related stuff I came across a this tiny heli. No servos and no swashplate. How the hell does that work then?

http://pixelito.reference.be

I'd love to have a go at scratch building a small heli. But not quite that small.

Anyone have any ideas on how it operates with no swashplate.

Or servos for that matter. Maybe small proportional actuators instead of servos??

Regards Terry.

[chronon1]

I recently got the dragon fly --- on ebay -- then read a reveiw about watchera on Rcuniverse or something like that --- basically they call it worse than cheap junk.. if u keep it inside it shoud be fine .. but i do see signs of wear on certain areas around the swash plate --- it was $75 and after all the other crap about $103 but it is new ..
the website is absolutely horendous s www.watchera.com ....

'get what u pay for ' !!

the only thing i've seen is the double rotor to counter balance to eliiminate the tail rotor need -- but it still spins in a video i saw ...

i think u would have to be a mad man to try and machine micro swashplate parts !!! and have too much time o n your honads !!

i make sure to lubbe it before each flight to extend whatever limited life it has -- it is a 4 channel so .. i get oogood control but am still mastering --- i like the simulator that hooks the radio up to your computer to allow u to get acclimated !

[MrBean]

i think u would have to be a mad man to try and machine micro swashplate parts !!! and have too much time o n your honads !!

That's why I was wondering how the pixel operates with no swashplate.


Terry.

[chronon1]

Well Terry -- from reading that stuff on his site with my brother it looks like he cant reveal it because his patent application was licensed so he has to keep it under the rug because he got the payout $$$ !!

it could be electronics it could be a mechanical feedback thing .. i wonder how well it works in a people moving scale .... like a bell helicopter fishbowl size...

copters are quite neat .. and i'm having fun getting my turd of a dragonfly off the ground for the few brief moments.. tomorrow ill be using the garage floor instead of the living room !!!

[tauscnc]

I think it is electro magnets. Bacially there is a swashplate but with magnets. Intead of a servo pushing or pulling if you apply a charge it either push or pull the magnet above. Have 4 little magnets spinning with the rotor and 4 under that plus on and off and you get the throws. I think I read that somewhere. Really neat.

taus

[MrBean]

and i'm having fun getting my turd of a dragonfly off the ground for the few brief moments.. tomorrow ill be using the garage floor instead of the living room !!!

Sounds familiar.... I can hop mine around the living room and that's about it. The highest it's been is about 12" from the floor and travelled about 3 feet. The box says from age 8. Yeh right?

I think it is electro magnets. Bacially there is a swashplate but with magnets. Intead of a servo pushing or pulling if you apply a charge it either push or pull the magnet above. Have 4 little magnets spinning with the rotor and 4 under that plus on and off and you get the throws. I think I read that somewhere. Really neat.

taus

That sounds like the only way to do it. I guess the electro magnets could be made proportional by varying the current.

[CNCRob]

I think it is electro magnets. Bacially there is a swashplate but with magnets. Intead of a servo pushing or pulling if you apply a charge it either push or pull the magnet above. Have 4 little magnets spinning with the rotor and 4 under that plus on and off and you get the throws. I think I read that somewhere. Really neat.

taus

That must be kind of like what that tiny 9" Micro Flyer airplane from WattAge uses for its controll surfaces.

[chronon1]

[QUOTE=MrBean]Sounds familiar.... I can hop mine around the living room and that's about it. The highest it's been is about 12" from the floor and travelled about 3 feet. The box says from age 8. Yeh right?


I think my rotor is about 51cm diameter ... I have gotten it a couple feet up (also for brief moments) --- hovering is not something its good at so just need to keep upgrading my building sq ft & ceiling height! (a gym sounds good !!)

There is a ton of tunig / trimming ] tweeking to get it good - the old CG ..

I put my own 'training' things on the skids --- some straws taped to the underside-- helps alot to keep the blades from hittign the ground.

[tauscnc]

Hey Rob,

Kind of. I think it uses, in simpler terms, a power meter as the acuator. Apply the current and the meter moves a certain amount. Add a tiny pushrod and you have "flight."

here is a sight for you guys to check out. They have a forum and servos, etc.

www.smallrc.com

Man that stuff looks awesome! I can't even imagine what we will see in the next 10-15 years!

taus

[chronon1]

www.smallrc.com

Man that stuff looks awesome! I can't even imagine what we will see in the next 10-15 years!

taus[/QUOTE]

i dont know .. that flying car as seen in pop. mechanics for decades has yet to be used in and around the US where it was invented ?

[itsme]

Hi there,

I also bought a Dragonfly off eBay. I've also got a Raptor .30, but I figured that if I could sort of learn to fly the Dragonfly, then the Raptor would be easy.

I haven't even attempted to fly indoors with it - my Mom would kill me. I tend to practice on the (sloping) back grass. So far, I've had mine about 6 feet off the ground in a sort of stable hover for maybe 30 or 40 seconds. At the start I was only going a few inches off the ground, but then I thought I may as well see what it's got. Surprisingly, it was much easier to control once it was up in the air - I'm not too sure why. The quality is hardly spectacular on this little machine. It works, but with lots of slop and play in the moving parts - quite disappointing after playing with a bigger copter like the Raptor.

BTW, it's also always impressive when it meets the garden fence...it keeps the whole family entertained and is surprisingly robust, considering the fit and finish!

Regards
Warren

[MrBean]

I think "Ground effect" makes flying / hovering hard if you're below a couple of feet. I'll upload a video of my "Best" flight. It's not very long at all.
You can all have a good giggle at it.

Only had the heli for 2 days tho'.

[MrBean]

Ok here's the vid. My "Flying" area was about six feet square :withstupi

[Garfield2]

Ok here's the vid. My "Flying" area was about six feet square :withstupi

You'll normally find the heli actually flys a little smoother in ground effect as it acts like a little bubble that helps the heli "float" more smoothly.

What you normally find with these little helis is they're very twitchy. My 60 sized Tsurugi is a weighty machine but it's as stable and as gentle as a mouse even in a stiff breeze when hovering because it has a lot more mass.

These little helis suffer like all little helis from turbulance and rotor wash. Hovering indoors in one spot can cause the blades to stall if the air is still (rotor downwash), making it jerky and unstable. I find it much eaiser in a room with ducted aircond. moving the air around or better yet flying outside in a genle breeze gives the best hovering performance.

I've got a little contra-rotating heli (EZ-ski) that I picked up in HK which flys much nicer outdoors than it does in still air indoors.

Also I'd attach a few landing legs on the bottom of the chopper if you're learning. That way the landings don't have to be perfect and you're less likely to damage the heli. A small "tee-pee" type arrangement attached to the under-carriage via rubber bands helps a heap!

Good flying,
Alan.

[JFettig]

Mr Bean,what heli is that?---nevermind, I read the first post
is it decent?

itsme, a friend of mine who flies rc heli says its much easier to fly around than hover, I guess hovering is quite a big harder?

Jon

[Garfield2]

itsme, a friend of mine who flies rc heli says its much easier to fly around than hover, I guess hovering is quite a big harder?

Yeah I agree but landing would be *very* interesting if you can't bring it back to the hover!

Crawl before you can walk and all that. If you can get it back to a basic hover and land fairly gently forward flight is a bit easier than hovering, but then the other normally problematic issue with R/C models is when the model is side-on or coming head on toward you :-

Normally: Left is left, Right is right, Forwards is away, and Back is towards you
Side on right : Left is towards you, Right is away, Forward is left, Back is right
Side on left : Right is towards you, Left is away, Forward is right, Back is left
Nose in: Right is left, Left is right, Forward is towards you, Back is away.

Some people have no problem grasping this, but others it can be the death of any model.

Let's not even mention inverted flight! (Down is up, Up is down, Left is Right, Right is Left, Forward is back, Back is forward so on and so on and so on....)

Persist with the tail-in hover and as you progress slowly start to turn the hover side-on so you can see the side of the heli and get use to it (do it both ways else you'll get one-sided!). Then you can start doing forward flight figure 8's where the heli never presents you with it's nose in a turn. Eventually in the figure 8's you can start turning nose-in and continue the circuit. Once you've mastered that you're off with no issues.

Cheers,
Alan.

[MrBean]

Mr Bean,what heli is that?---nevermind, I read the first post
is it decent?

That depends on your interpretation of "decent"

For the money I spent, and the amount of fun I'm having, it's well worth it.

It seems "twitchy" to fly, but then I'm no expert and have never flown anything before. I've had about 40 mins of actually trying to fly, well, hover really.

It's very addictive. Trying to hover for longer each try.
The most fun I've had in a while.

Regards Terry.

[CNCRob]

It seems "twitchy" to fly, but then I'm no expert and have never flown anything before. I've had about 40 mins of actually trying to fly, well, hover really.

What I seen on the video was actually a pretty good job in the small space for a beginner.

[CNCRob]

I was just wondering, What version of Dragonfly did you get MrBean?

[Garfield2]

It seems "twitchy" to fly, but then I'm no expert and have never flown anything before. I've had about 40 mins of actually trying to fly, well, hover really.

It's very addictive. Trying to hover for longer each try.
The most fun I've had in a while.

Good onya Terry!

Have you tried it outside in more open space? You'll find when you don't have to worry about hitting the ironing board or the coffee table you'll keep it in the air a bit longer. Also a training under carriage made from dowels and rubber bands helps *so* much (eg.. opps loosing control, pull back throttle, drop back safely to the ground).

Heli flying is so much fun, and I'm really glad these much cheaper helis exist. As a teenager working in a Hobby shop that specialised in helis, selling helicopters was always the hardest because the initial investment was huge (heli kit, motor, gyro, radio, starting gear, batteries, fuel, etc etc) but now with these $100 specials with everything it's a no brainer for most people.

Cheers,
Alan.