[300sniper]

i'm getting tired of engraving at 4500 rpm. i want to get an auxiliary spindle setup for engraving. i'm assuming spindle runout and endplay would be the most critical things when choosing one with rpm being the next important.

i use 1/4" half round conical engraving bits and i'm usually working with 416 stainless, if any of that matters.

does anyone have any recommendations for this? the kress kit tormach offers is a bit more than i want to spend and i'm capable of making my own mount.

[zephyr9900]

Same boat here. The Kress looks pretty attractive (dual nose bearings and all) and is available for a pretty good price from many dealers.

I had retrofitted my Proxxon spindle with a hybrid ceramic nose bearing and was using it exclusively with 1/8" shank tools with distance rings for a mini-TTS experience (i.e. pre-set tool lengths in the tool table) with great results, but I was using it with coolant and apparently didn't clean it off well enough before I put it in storage, and the spindle nose rusted in the meantime. Not too badly but I will give electrolytic rust removal a try.

But I'm seriously thinking of moving up to either a Kress 850 or 1050 with a homemade bracket.

Machining with a .020" carbide endmill in aluminum at 4500rpm and 0.8ipm is for the birds...

Randy

[philbur]

I know these are UK based but I'm sure you can find the same in the US of A. Probably at $ for £ prices.

High Speed Spindles, Motors & Inverters - Arc Euro Trade

Phil

[David Bord]

I adapted a wood router that has variable rpm up to 25k rpm and 2hp using some custom er adapters. It works really good! I have the mount designed if someone wants to make one.

David

[WOTDesigns]

I just started using an AIR TURBINE SPINDLE™ 602JS 40,000 rpm on my X3 with AMAZING results. it had 3/4" shank so I added a tts kit to it and can leave my tool in it, and throw it back into the spindle later to engrave without having to zero, plug anything in, remove mounts.

Been using .0625" EM 3FL @ .02" DOC running at 30-50 ipm and the finish is great. Engraving speeds were slightly slower but only because I use single flute engravers. A multi flute could be run practically at the 1100s rapid speeds (at your own risk).

The biggest thing for me was not sacrificing table space by mounting something on the side of the head, plus having to change offsets would seem annoying. I just program the high speed spindle like any other tool... only at lightning speed.

I got a deal on two of them and did post a brand new (old stock) one on the bay with a 5 micron pre filter, oil separator, wrenches, and fitted foam lined case. if your interested pm me and I can pull it off the bay and give you a "friendlier" price. Its still the best deal I have seen, but more than I actually have into it as I don't NEED to sell it.

[Mooser]

I use a Bosch trim router.
You can buy precision collets for it, fairly industrial, variable speed
Works well for engraving and 3d surfacing (light cuts)
Mooser

[GLCarlson]

@ Mooser

Me too. Built a clamp-on-the-spindle holder, variable to 30K, but it does eat some working space. Same router was used at HSM several years ago to drive a lathe grinder. Compact, reliable, reasonable price. BTW- same hole more-or-less fits an older Dremel (280). Nothing special about the holder- 1" 6061 and a couple big holes. Early project.

Air Turbine would be nice- but for an occasional use, just too much money.

[Don Clement]

The air spindle looks like the perfect solution and for a paltry $2.2K. Wonder if any amateurs have posted plans for a DIY model perhaps modeled on a simple to build Tesla turbine.

Don

[WOTDesigns]

I tried mounting my dremel... too much vibration. Then I tried the dremel wand (below) with the body of the dremel on a pully so the whip was strait... too much run out. I was planning on getting a Kress, but then I got a deal on two Air Turbine Spindles that I couldn't pass on. I can sell the new one and end up worth a used one for $500ish - which will make me smile. I'm in the process of re-wiring the shop for 240v so I can get a compressor that can handle the spindle AND my mist system.

...giant added bonus: An 1100 will just fit in the back of my one car shop with the delux stand. When I have the power to run it I'm out of excuses not to buy one. Well, other than the $ keeper. But I've been carefully planting the seed that a larger mill with a tool changer means less time standing there, more productivity, and in turn more than one night a week I quit working befor 10:30. Down side is that night will likely be spent trying to ignore the Housewives Of Atlanta ::shudder:: Fair trade?

[zephyr9900]

A couple of posts/threads about concentric high-speed spindles (like the Speeder but independently powered):

The Home Shop Machinist & Machinist's Workshop Magazine's BBS - View Single Post - Help...High Torque small diameter elec motor needed

Good High Speed Spindle

Randy

P.S. Don, the Tesla is electric, not turbine. And it has ~80 lb-ft at 12krpm. That would be some interesting HSM...

[Jeff E.]

Go to ebay and search for "spindle motor and inverter". You will get lots of high speed chinese spindles to choose from - both air and water cooled.

Jeff

[MichaelHenry]

The air spindle looks like the perfect solution and for a paltry $2.2K. Wonder if any amateurs have posted plans for a DIY model perhaps modeled on a simple to build Tesla turbine.

Don

You have a very dry sense of humor - almost no vermouth at all.

[MichaelHenry]

P.S. Don, the Tesla is electric, not turbine. And it has ~80 lb-ft at 12krpm. That would be some interesting HSM...

I suspect that Don was referring to the Tesla turbine.

[Don Clement]

P.S. Don, the Tesla is electric, not turbine. And it has ~80 lb-ft at 12krpm. That would be some interesting HSM...

Tesla is also a rock group and an SI unit of magnetic field strength. Here is an example of a home built Tesla turbine that does 30K rpm: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owB7jIvkmrU&feature=related]Tesla Turbine ( Carbon Fibre Disks) - YouTube[/ame]

Don

[zephyr9900]

Go to ebay and search for "spindle motor and inverter".

Yes, I have a couple of questions into the seller of 260824491201. Namely, are there double bottom-end bearings or just one at each end of the spindle, and is the bottom end of the spindle resistant to water-based coolant splashes/sprays. It's almost cheap enough to not care... EGAD: I just noticed the $199 shipping...

Especially if just used as the "sidewinder" drive for a concentric spindle. The attraction for me there is not having to program in a G54 when I go from primary spindle to auxiliary, as I've done for the Proxxon. Just pop in the auxiliary spindle shank and use preset tool table length entries. I've already shown that simple 1/8"-shank tools with distance rings in even the Proxxon collet are repeatable to .001" length or better. While my Proxxon was running, it was cool to start with 1/4" rougher in the primary spindle, and continue down to a .009" ball-end in the auxiliary spindle in the same program...

Randy

[zephyr9900]

I suspect that Don was referring to the Tesla turbine.

Let me explain "", Michael...

My post was as tongue-in-cheek-less as Don's, I'll have you know!

Randy

[zephyr9900]

Here is an example of a home built Tesla turbine that does 30K rpm

When it's not bogged down with lighting THREE FLASHLIGHT BULBS!!!11! Just what I want to do with 10cfm of compressed air...

Randy

[Don Clement]

When it's not bogged down with lighting THREE FLASHLIGHT BULBS!!!11! Just what I want to do with 10cfm of compressed air...

Randy

I believe those "flashlite bulbs" were three 50W halogens.

Do you have any imagination? Notice that this particular Tesla Turbine used only three discs with spacers in place of the rest. How much power does an engraving bit really need? My air compressor puts out 17 SCFM @ 100 PSI so it could run a full disc compliment home built Tesla turbine @ 30K rpm. I would be happy to have a 30K rpm concentric Tesla turbine air spindle for engraving. IMO the air spindle has many advantages including coolant proof operation unlike many of the electric spindle designs. The Tesla turbine would be easy to build since the discs are round and smooth that could be easily made on a manual lathe. The Tesla turbine could also be easily made concentric, no offset bracket needed.

Don

PS Too bad that Tesla electric car isn’t a hybrid using an gas powered Tesla turbine to supplement the batteries then perhaps it might an unlimited range instead of a range of just a couple hundred miles. As it is now the Tesla is no more than an electric golf cart on steroids.

[zephyr9900]

I do have a good imagination, Don. But my wife's favorite nickname for me is "Monkey Boy" (cf. Buckaroo Banzai) for my sense of humor. I hope you know that I was just doing a little leg-pulling! From what I "know" about the Tesla Turbine it sounds like a torque converter that uses air as the working fluid. But I don't know enough about the energy conversion efficiency to know if it would be reasonable compared with the standard stator-rotor axial turbine... There have been large advances in aerodynamic knowledge since Tesla's day, after all.

Maybe I'm just biased, but it would take a lot to convince me that any air-driven device could have anywhere the efficiency and controllability of a decent electric motor...

How much power does an engraving bit really need?

Nah, what I want to do is run a 1/8" carbide endmill in aluminum and/or brass at the RPM it deserves, much less the .009" ballmill I was contouring with, with my Proxxon...

Randy

[MFchief]

Does anyone have experience with water cooled turbines? I'm assuming this means circulating water, with reservoir, pump, etc? Ebay shows other similar power/rpm units that are air cooled, if that works it would seem that an air cooled unit would be much easier to use in a home shop environment.
Terry