[gar]

051128-1031 EST USA

Have you or any of your customers had any kind of HAAS control problems where you had to do a power-on reset to correct or clear the problem?

All computers require a reset function. This function forces the computer to start at some known address in the computer's program memory space. On microcomputers this will be a reset pin. When this pin is taken to a given state, typically low, it forces the processor to stop and reset and when the state changes, typically going high, then the processor is restarted at the start address.

In many cases this reset pin will be used in two or more ways. The first is where a resistor, capacitor, and diode are used to hold the pin low for a short time after power is applied. The diode is simply a means for quick discharge of the capacitor on power off. The second is where a normally open push button parallels the capacitor and is used to momentarily short the capacitor to perform reset without actually turning power off. Sometimes computers have a watchdog timer that is useful to detect hung states and force an automatic reset when the watchdog thinks the system is hung.

Of our five HAAS machines we have one, a 1996 VF3, that in the morning on first power-on the HAAS processor fails to do anything obvious (meaning nothing on CRT). Power-down once and thereafter the machine is ok for the day. Time of day or year or temperature do not correlate with the problem. This machine exhibits no other problems. This is an insignificant problem and we ignore it.

What prompted this post is that I have two different customers with similar but different RS232 problems. If the second one had not occurred I would not bring up this discussion. These relate to sending data to the CNC. The two customers have machines very different in age. One is a 1996 VF3 and the other is a new small lathe.

Customer 1's problem was a hung RS232 receiving state. HAAS would simply sit WAITING even though good data was present on the RS232 line to HAAS. Thru additional tests the problem appeared to be thermal. Namely, opening the cabinet door and using a fan to cool the processor area eliminated the error conditions. This was during hot weather this spring. The root cause has never been corrected, instead they run with the electrical enclosure door open. The problem did not appear to be at the 1488 and 1489 chip level.

Customer 2's problem is that his new CNC lathe, TL1, within warranty, will not receive data and when put into RS232 RECV it goes to WAITING and then completely hangs the HAAS processor. The HAAS front panel RESET button will not clear the problem, and it is necessary to do a power-down and a power-on to recover. Otherwise the machine works ok. Two different RS232 sources have been tried with the same result.

This seems to imply that HAAS does not reset the HAAS CNC program processor when the reset button is operated.

Just interested in other peoples similar problems.

.

[Kool Parts]

None of mine have had any of those problems (nock wood) The only data related problems have been with floppys. You can download a program to floppy, ck it, then try to load back in the machine. Half the time it will alarm out saying there is some error in the program (chair)
I fixed that by NEVER using a floppy for storage, just RS232 back to the computer in the office
Gary

[Pontiff51]

Last company I worked for had this problem with our MiniMill. The three top wizards in the IT dept.spent 2 full days trying to get the RS232 to work. No problem with our desktop, cable length, signal quality or signal strength. Our Haas just kept us all "Waiting!!!!". I moved to sunny warm FL from dark and cold MA, so I don't know if the problem was ever resolved. We just used "floppys" to move the files. Good luck to you and Happy Holidays To All.

[timf]

we have had a problem with the controller acting like it loaded the program but not really changing the one in the machine.
these programs are around 4-8 mb in size so i figured it was partly a size problem.
if we reboot the machine it works fine first try after that.

i started putting comments at the top so i know right away if it changed.
at first i thought it was a problem overwriting the old program but deleting the old one did not fix it, the old one actually came back into the buffer.
don't ask me how.

i am using the usb port to load files not the rs232 and the machine is less than a year old.(03-2005)

[gar]

051129-2013 EST USA

Thanks all.

It would be useful to others if everyone would identify their machine, date of manufacture, amount of memory, the machine's max baud rate, and the baud rate you operate at. Or whatever other communication means you use.



Kool Parts:

Some users have reported that by replacing the floppy drive with a new one (I believe they referenced Sony) that their floppy problems were corrected.

However, RS232 in my opnion is a better route. Of course I want to sell isolated interfaces. But our own experience definitely favors RS232. We transfer millions of bytes error free at 115.2 kbaud. Thousands of files. Much less hassle than using a floppy, and of course drip mode in excess of the floppy capacity is a problem.


Pontiff51:

The laptop is the obvious problem. That you never got beyond "WAITING" probably means the laptop RS232 was putting out a marginal RS232 signal level. A scope looking at the signal would be very useful here. Some laptops may not use 1488 type drivers and +/-12 v source.

Our Sony FX140 laptop has a problem under XP Pro with Cimco and other software and RS232 in that it hardly sends anything and HAAS says a break signal was received. So here HAAS is receiving data and we have checked that the signal levels are adequate. The same program run under XP Pro on desktops does not have a problem. Sony tends to have at least the serial drivers (1488 type chips) turned off before data is sent.


timf:

Some background that might be useful. I believe HAAS has to have enough free memory to completely load the program you are sending and load it in the free space before it overwrites an existing program of the same O#. This is so the original is not overwritten if HAAS detects some error in the new loading.

This of course does not explain why if you first delete an O# program that the new program won't load, certainly does not explain why a deleted program should reappear.

I suspect some HAAS memory management bug is causing your problem and this is not corrected unless you power-down.

Your comment idea is a good idea. We always put part number, date, and other unique information in a comment at the beginning of a program.

I have no idea on how USB might be handled differently than RS232.


Interesting the problems people encounter.

.

[chmillman]

I have a 1999 VF-0E (now VF-2). I have had a problem in DNC mode that required a power off-restart. It would happen when I decided something was wrong in the execution of a DNC program soon after program start and hit RESET. At this point, the machine would stop, but it would occasionally (not always) also freeze at this point in DNC mode - the keypad would no longer respond, so you couldn't put it in manual, or do anything else - the only thing to do was power off.

I noticed this happened mostly when the DNC started with a toolchange and I reset near the beginning of the program. I usually hit reset twice out of habit. I never was able to reproduce the problem consistently, and although I complained to Haas, they never acknowledged that this was a known problem, they told me that they couldn't reproduce it. I am now careful to hit Reset only once in these situations, also to stop the DNC feed first, nd the problem hasn't occured lately. However, I have also changed the machine software, so the problem may also have been fixed by Haas. --ch

[richardrosario]

I'm relatively new to working on Haas lathes, but as an electrician am familiar with some similar issues in automation. From what we have here at my plant, our lathes are running GE Fanuc which is the older DOS based PLC. I have had communication issues regarding GE Fanuc and todays Windows based softwares. Another occasional issue is programming. Some programmers like to use "oneshots" when writing their logic. The problem being that if you interrupt the program after the oneshot is fired, it does not fire again unless you cycle the power, or go through the program and manually fire the oneshot. I don't know if this helps.

[haastec]

I'm relatively new to working on Haas lathes, but as an electrician am familiar with some similar issues in automation. From what we have here at my plant, our lathes are running GE Fanuc which is the older DOS based PLC. I have had communication issues regarding GE Fanuc and todays Windows based softwares. Another occasional issue is programming. Some programmers like to use "oneshots" when writing their logic. The problem being that if you interrupt the program after the oneshot is fired, it does not fire again unless you cycle the power, or go through the program and manually fire the oneshot. I don't know if this helps.

Since this thread is almost 6 years old, I would venture to say they got it sorted out by now.

[JoBwan]

Since this thread is almost 6 years old, I would venture to say they got it sorted out by now.

Haastec,
I have a 2008 VF5/50 that will not communicate via RS232. Serial # is 1072235. Software version is M16.04D, May 15,2009, 18:51:14, Mocon is 12.06. We use a memory stick to download at this time, but sometimes we need to power down...restart...and then the memory stick will read immediately. Other times it just won't read even off the stick. I currently have 20 - 30 machines hooked to wireless RS232 and everyone of them work great. This machine is my only problem child. I also tried with ethernet cable (Hard wire) and "NO GO".
I have read that this is possibly a software issue and I can't get any answers from the HFO or tech. support. Do you have any solutions to what I need to do? Getting tired of "waiting" LOL...
Baud Rate = 115200
Parity select = Even
Stop Bit = 2
Sync. = DC Code
RS232 Data Bit = 7
EOB pattern = CR-LF
Add spaces out RS232 = ON
AUX. Sync.Axis = XON/XOFF
AUX. Axis Baud Rate = 4800
Every machine is setup identically with these settings, but we are still "waiting". Thanks for any input available to get this going!

[haastec]

Haastec,
I have a 2008 VF5/50 that will not communicate via RS232. Serial # is 1072235. Software version is M16.04D, May 15,2009, 18:51:14, Mocon is 12.06. We use a memory stick to download at this time, but sometimes we need to power down...restart...and then the memory stick will read immediately. Other times it just won't read even off the stick. I currently have 20 - 30 machines hooked to wireless RS232 and everyone of them work great. This machine is my only problem child. I also tried with ethernet cable (Hard wire) and "NO GO".
I have read that this is possibly a software issue and I can't get any answers from the HFO or tech. support. Do you have any solutions to what I need to do? Getting tired of "waiting" LOL...
Baud Rate = 115200
Parity select = Even
Stop Bit = 2
Sync. = DC Code
RS232 Data Bit = 7
EOB pattern = CR-LF
Add spaces out RS232 = ON
AUX. Sync.Axis = XON/XOFF
AUX. Axis Baud Rate = 4800
Every machine is setup identically with these settings, but we are still "waiting". Thanks for any input available to get this going!

If your settings are identical to other machines that work, then the problem would most likely be with the software or hardware involved; even more so since you are having trouble with usb also.

Sorry, I don't have much help for you. Reach out to KenFaulks or Bryan33 here on the forum, both are at Haas Oxnard and may be able to offer more detailed help. Ken is in applications, and Bryan is in service.

Good luck!

[Haas__man]

Jobwan,
I think you need to order a keypad interface PCB from your HFO. The part number is 93-0627. This should be a fix for the USB problem.
With your RS232 problem - do you have other HAAS machines that work with wireless? also - have you tried communication using rs232 cables intead?

Hope this helps

[JoBwan]

Haastec,
I have a 2008 VF5/50 that will not communicate via RS232. Serial # is 1072235. Software version is M16.04D, May 15,2009, 18:51:14, Mocon is 12.06. I currently have 20 - 30 machines hooked to wireless RS232 and everyone of them work great. This machine is my only problem child. I also tried with ethernet cable (Hard wire) and "NO GO".

You must have missed this when reading the post.

[John Crawford]

Since this came to the top I thought I'd share a problem that occurred a few weeks ago on my TM-1 (December 2007 model with maybe 600 hours spindle time on it). I was using the mill in manual mode to face the top of a work piece. As I was turning the jog handle to move the table in the X direction the table suddenly stopped moving and the control panel went dead. The spindle was still spinning and the display was working, but none of the buttons on the control panel worked. I tried hitting all the buttons including Reset and Power Up/Restart and they had no effect. I finally hit the Power Off button and the machine shut off and the spindle slowly spun down. The spindle didn't lower after the machine was shut down, which was a good thing.

I restarted the mill and played around with it a bit and everything seemed to be okay. I returned to manually facing the work piece and when moving the table in the X direction the same thing happened again close to the X location where it happened the first time. I tried the buttons on the control panel and none of them responded so I hit the Power Off button again. The machine shut down and the spindle slowly came to a stop.

Since both incidents occurred at about the same X location while I was moving the table in the X direction I thought the problem might be related to that. I looked under the table to see if there was a position sensor somewhere but didn't see one. For lack of anything else to do I used an air nozzle to blow are all around the underside of the table. I poked it in all the nooks and crannies and didn't spare any air. I also took the back of the control pendant off and checked all the electrical connectors to see if any where loose. They were all okay. I jiggled all of them and put the back cover on.

I decided to think about it a bit more that evening and the next day I restarted the mill and everything worked okay. I've run the mill maybe 10-20 hours since then and the problem hasn't returned.

Any thoughts as to what might have happened? Did I do something that fixed the problem or was it just a coincidence? Has anyone else experienced this problem, and if so was a cause identified?

[Machineit]

Since this came to the top I thought I'd share a problem that occurred a few weeks ago on my TM-1 (December 2007 model with maybe 600 hours spindle time on it). I was using the mill in manual mode to face the top of a work piece. As I was turning the jog handle to move the table in the X direction the table suddenly stopped moving and the control panel went dead. The spindle was still spinning and the display was working, but none of the buttons on the control panel worked. I tried hitting all the buttons including Reset and Power Up/Restart and they had no effect. I finally hit the Power Off button and the machine shut off and the spindle slowly spun down. The spindle didn't lower after the machine was shut down, which was a good thing.

I restarted the mill and played around with it a bit and everything seemed to be okay. I returned to manually facing the work piece and when moving the table in the X direction the same thing happened again close to the X location where it happened the first time. I tried the buttons on the control panel and none of them responded so I hit the Power Off button again. The machine shut down and the spindle slowly came to a stop.

Since both incidents occurred at about the same X location while I was moving the table in the X direction I thought the problem might be related to that. I looked under the table to see if there was a position sensor somewhere but didn't see one. For lack of anything else to do I used an air nozzle to blow are all around the underside of the table. I poked it in all the nooks and crannies and didn't spare any air. I also took the back of the control pendant off and checked all the electrical connectors to see if any where loose. They were all okay. I jiggled all of them and put the back cover on.

I decided to think about it a bit more that evening and the next day I restarted the mill and everything worked okay. I've run the mill maybe 10-20 hours since then and the problem hasn't returned.

Any thoughts as to what might have happened? Did I do something that fixed the problem or was it just a coincidence? Has anyone else experienced this problem, and if so was a cause identified?

On a Mini Mill I ran I had that issue. It turned out to be a bad low voltage power supply. It was replaced and that was all it needed.

Mike

[Haastec2]

I would disconect the rs-232 cable from the machine & see if the problem re-occurs, a bad rs-232 cable or bad grounding can cause the system to lock up.

[John Crawford]

I would disconect the rs-232 cable from the machine & see if the problem re-occurs, a bad rs-232 cable or bad grounding can cause the system to lock up.

I don't have the machine connected to a PC so maybe the low voltage power supply is the cause. Now that I think about it, I had a faulty USB thumb drive plugged in when the mill locked up. (Maybe putting it through the laundry a few times didn't help it much.). I've always run programs from the mill's memory, not the thumb drive, but it was plugged in at the time. I've been using a different USB thumb drive to transfer programs since then and the machine has worked fine. Cause or coincidence? I have the feeling the mill will let me know sooner or later.

[JoBwan]

Jobwan,
I think you need to order a keypad interface PCB from your HFO. The part number is 93-0627. This should be a fix for the USB problem.
With your RS232 problem - do you have other HAAS machines that work with wireless? also - have you tried communication using rs232 cables intead?

Hope this helps

Haas_man,
Is thre any way to check out the keypad Interface PCB before I spend $1200.00 and realize that it doesn't fix my problem. Can anyone out there verify that the PCB is actually the problem?? I really do appreciate any & all input. Thanks Haas_man!!

[haastec]

Haas_man,
Is thre any way to check out the keypad Interface PCB before I spend $1200.00 and realize that it doesn't fix my problem. Can anyone out there verify that the PCB is actually the problem?? I really do appreciate any & all input. Thanks Haas_man!!

Any chance you have another machine you can swap the PCB with for troubleshooting or is this the only Haas?

[JoBwan]

Haastec
I should have thouhgt of that!! Where is this PCB Located? I have a couple other machines close to the same setup (Vintage). Could you post a picture of what the board looks like and its location. I can definitely swap it out!! Great Idea!!!!!!!!!!!!(chair)

[haastec]

Haastec
I should have thouhgt of that!! Where is this PCB Located? I have a couple other machines close to the same setup (Vintage). Could you post a picture of what the board looks like and its location. I can definitely swap it out!! Great Idea!!!!!!!!!!!!(chair)

I can't get you any pictures right this minute, but it's located behind the monitor.