[Machineit]

Normally the manufacturer will give you a GPM rating. Not sure if Haas does this or not, but it's the only way to truely rate the system. PSI will depend on tool orifice size.

That is not actually correct. Pressure and volume are not the same. You can have a pump that puts out a 1000 gallons a minute but will not make much pressure.

Pumps for through spindle use should be rated as "X" psi at a specific orifice size and distance.

Pumps for volume generally use an impeller to get the fluid moving in a circle, then offer an escape opening for it to flow into and out. Pressure pumps use other methods such as gears that mesh and force the fluids through/out, like oil pumps for car engines or hydraulic pumps.

In use, the TSC will have a lot of pressure but not much volume. Large openings will greatly reduce pressure. But, remember that the opening in the pull stud is only about 3/16ths or so, so any tool opening over that will reduce pressure.

Have fun-----Mike

[rpm3000]

That is not actually correct. Pressure and volume are not the same. You can have a pump that puts out a 1000 gallons a minute but will not make much pressure.

Have fun-----Mike

Alot of these cheaper TSC systems will push only 1-2 GPM's. You almost have to program a dwell when you kick these on so the coolant can catch up. We have some chip blaster and factory systems here that are all rated at 1000PSI, but depending on GPM they wildly vary in pressure using the same tools.

If your orifice is a mere .100" for instance, it takes almost 8GPM to hit 1000PSI.

One factory system will run the small coolant tank almost dry within a few minutes and the PSI gage drops to about 100 or throws a low coolant alarm. On our smallest orifice I've never seen over 600psi.

Another hit well over 1500psi on our smallest orifice before we adjusted it back to 1000. That system has 250 gallons under it and moves a lot of fluid.

Both are sold as 1000PSI systems... Only difference is the GPM rating on the pump.

I under stand what you are saying about pumps, but when you're looking at TSC systems PSI's are not the true way to rate the system.

Go to Chip Blaster's site and they have charts explaining all of this.

[Machineit]

Alot of these cheaper TSC systems will push only 1-2 GPM's. You almost have to program a dwell when you kick these on so the coolant can catch up. We have some chip blaster and factory systems here that are all rated at 1000PSI, but depending on GPM they wildly vary in pressure using the same tools.

If your orifice is a mere .100" for instance, it takes almost 8GPM to hit 1000PSI.

One factory system will run the small coolant tank almost dry within a few minutes and the PSI gage drops to about 100 or throws a low coolant alarm. On our smallest orifice I've never seen over 600psi.

Another hit well over 1500psi on our smallest orifice before we adjusted it back to 1000. That system has 250 gallons under it and moves a lot of fluid.

Both are sold as 1000PSI systems... Only difference is the GPM rating on the pump.

I under stand what you are saying about pumps, but when you're looking at TSC systems PSI's are not the true way to rate the system.

Go to Chip Blaster's site and they have charts explaining all of this.

I never said that GPM is not important, just that it is a different kind of pumping system and that you can't rate them by GPM only. That is why I mentioned orifice size etc. Rotary vane and gear pumps are very different from regular coolant pumps using an impeller.

Mike

[tskwara]

Thanks folks for all your helpful feedback!

The order was placed Friday for a Haas DT-1 with the 300 PSI through spindle coolant option. I was told by the factory rep that the spindle is designed to accommodate the 1000 PSI option, so upgrading to the higher pressure could be done later.

Now my attention is turning to the work holding system. I'm looking at a Chick system that includes a base plate and up to four double station vices. Pretty nice setup - I seen this system on the Haas Super Mini Mill and DT-1 and a local facility. They love it.

I'm also looking at Parlec tool holders.

Also on tap is a new Ingersoll Rand Total Air System.

Can't wait until a month from now when the chips will fly!

[haastec]

Thanks folks for all your helpful feedback!

The order was placed Friday for a Haas DT-1 with the 300 PSI through spindle coolant option. I was told by the factory rep that the spindle is designed to accommodate the 1000 PSI option, so upgrading to the higher pressure could be done later.

Now my attention is turning to the work holding system. I'm looking at a Chick system that includes a base plate and up to four double station vices. Pretty nice setup - I seen this system on the Haas Super Mini Mill and DT-1 and a local facility. They love it.

I'm also looking at Parlec tool holders.

Also on tap is a new Ingersoll Rand Total Air System.

Can't wait until a month from now when the chips will fly!

Sounds like a nice setup!

Report back when you get things running and maybe post a couple of pictures.

Good luck with everything!

[Ydna]

Rather than posting a new thread I figure I'll post it here. I was talking to the outlet recently and they mentioned that all machines now come with TSC spindle hardware, so the option is much easier to field install. (they indicated the 1/2 series mills already have all the hoses, even).

I'm not a Haas tech so I might be incorrect, but that's what I was told anyway.

The other thing is that Haas' new TSC drawbar uses a new system that doesn't have the sub-10krpm limit that the previous machines used. I assume it's the new "bearingless" fluid connection that I've noticed Haas promotions mention a few times in the last couple months. I have it on a VF2 that I bought recently and it's a very audible change from the older system.

So bottomline there's no longer an RPM cap (at least it's above 15krpm), good stuff.

[tskwara]

Given that I was so on-the-fence about TSC with the HFO, I wish they would have told me the option can be easily turned on later [assuming what you are saying is fact]. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the case though. I'm getting quotes on a new Nirvana air compressor from Ingersoll Rand where the 7.5 HP model is field upgradable to a 15 HP model, using only a software option code [for $1500 mind you].

I like hearing that maybe the spindle is being refined though. We shall see soon enough. The new machine is scheduled to ship in less then two weeks.

[Ydna]

Yeah it seems like they're boiling everything up to being as standardized as possible. There's probably more virtues to it on Haas' end compared to the user since the prices probably won't change much. I mean they might a little bit, nobody knows, but it's all up to them.

The spindles and motors recently underwent an upgrade where they now deliver more torque and a tad more RPM too. I was quite happy to receive that in my most recent machine since I wasn't aware of the upgrade until the tech pointed it out on the spec sheet....