[TenSecond408]

Well over the weekend I took some machinery offsite from a bottling company. This machine had a ton a beefy linear rails and bushing (unsupported round - 50mm i think). I think this will be a decent start to a small milling machine iv been wanting to build for years.

After further investigation of this machine, I discovered it had 6 steppers motors mounted inside this hidden case area to turn the upper spindles. Four smaller steppers and two large steppers. The only issues it that they say 230VAC for the input..

(2) Sanyo Denki SM2863-5255 - SM2863-5255 SANYO DENKI - Motor:2-phase, bipolar, stepper | Transfer Multisort Elektronik
(4) Sanyo DEnki SM2861-5255 - SM2861-5255 SANYO DENKI - Motor:2-phase, bipolar, stepper | Transfer Multisort Elektronik

Both seem to be AC and high voltage!

I do have some control boards that came out of this machine, which I assume are the driver boards that would supply these power and communicate them them.

Are these a viable option to get my machine up and running? Or would I just be better off selling these off and buying some different one.

I'm pretty set that I will be using these linear guides for now, they seem like they should be plenty beefy enough to handle some aluminum milling and UHMW plastic milling. Should be enough rails there to atleast make the X and Y from these guides and may be able to get the Z also, have to study all the parts some more.

Here are the pictures of my free stuff! Let me know what yall think!

Thanks

[awerby]

This seems like a promising start on a router, although whether it will be heavy-duty enough to mill metals. Not sure about those motors, though - most steppers I've seen run on DC. If you can figure out how to get those drives to accept step/direction signals, then this would probably work with hobby-style control software like Mach3 or Linux CNC. Otherwise sell it for what you can get and buy something you know will work. See if you can mount one of those stages on top of the other (that table looks promising to build on top of), and check the assembly for rigidity. That would give you X and Y, but you'd still need something to mount your Z axis and spindle on that would hang over the table- you might start scrounging for a big arbor press or a clapped-out mill casting.

Andrew Werby
ComputerSculpture.com ? Home Page for Discount Hardware & Software

[doorknob]

My interpretation of the actual motor datasheets is that they are normal stepper motors that run on DC, not on AC. (disregard what it may say about AC- on the web pages that you linked). The datasheets include torque curves based on operation at relatively high DC voltages. The stepper drivers sold or recommended by the manufacturer have built-in power supplies that run off of AC power, however I see no indication that you could not use those motors with a different driver.

[TenSecond408]

This seems like a promising start on a router, although whether it will be heavy-duty enough to mill metals. Not sure about those motors, though - most steppers I've seen run on DC. If you can figure out how to get those drives to accept step/direction signals, then this would probably work with hobby-style control software like Mach3 or Linux CNC. Otherwise sell it for what you can get and buy something you know will work. See if you can mount one of those stages on top of the other (that table looks promising to build on top of), and check the assembly for rigidity. That would give you X and Y, but you'd still need something to mount your Z axis and spindle on that would hang over the table- you might start scrounging for a big arbor press or a clapped-out mill casting.

Andrew Werby
ComputerSculpture.com ? Home Page for Discount Hardware & Software

My plan was to use the table to build from like you talking about. Havnt had much time to put some real thought to it yet, but its very stable.

[TenSecond408]

My interpretation of the actual motor datasheets is that they are normal stepper motors that run on DC, not on AC. (disregard what it may say about AC- on the web pages that you linked). The datasheets include torque curves based on operation at relatively high DC voltages. The stepper drivers sold or recommended by the manufacturer have built-in power supplies that run off of AC power, however I see no indication that you could not use those motors with a different driver.

Looking at the Gecko540 drives, they say the can only handle 50VDC input. In the instructions it states:

Connect your power supply positive to TERMINAL 11 and negative to TERMINAL 12. The power supply voltage is determined by multiplying the square root of the motor’s inductance by 32, as in the example below for a 2mH rated motor:

32 * (√2) = 45VDC

CAUTION!
Power supply voltage in excess of 50 VDC will damage the G540.


Well my inductance on the smaller steppers are around 1.7, which equates to about 42VDC. The larger steppers have an inductance of about 3.8, which equates out to about 64 VDC.

If I go with the large steppers, I would be well over what the gecko540 drive could handle.

What do you guys recommend for high voltage drives for these steppers in my situation. I did see some other stuff the gecko offers in the 80VDC - 7AMP range? G201X Digital Step Drive, G203V Digital Step Drive, G210X Digital Step Drive, and the G213V Digital Step Drive. Any of these any good?

Thanks for the help everyone!

AJ Newman

[awerby]

They're all good. The G540 is nice because it includes a breakout board and 4 drives in a package that's easy to install, but as you've noticed its power is limited. It's best used for smaller machines than the one you're contemplating here. Some 203Vs would probably work fine for your motors, assuming that they really run on DC. (The V is for "Vampire", because they were trying to come up with an un-killable drive, which wouldn't expire even if mis-wired.) You'd need a breakout board as well - PMDX and Sound Logic are two good alternatives.

Andrew Werby
www.computersculpture.com

[TenSecond408]

Just got off the phone with the manufacturer of these steppers. The guy said this is a High Voltage AC Stepper and takes AC power to run. So i guess these are going on ebay Now its time to find some more for the project ...

Thanks guys

[doorknob]

Are you certain that they were referring to the stepper motors themselves, and not to the stepper motor drivers (which input AC and generate high DC voltages)? The recommended driver is the X-MIND-B6 which is apparently a bipolar driver. Bipolar implies DC.

Did you speak with an application engineer or someone else?

But maybe they know something that I don't.

[TenSecond408]

Are you certain that they were referring to the stepper motors themselves, and not to the stepper motor drivers (which input AC and generate high DC voltages)? The recommended driver is the X-MIND-B6 which is apparently a bipolar driver. Bipolar implies DC.

Did you speak with an application engineer or someone else?

But maybe they know something that I don't.

I spoke to a technical engineer (at least that is who i asked to speak to) He said these are custom steppers that are made for the machine manufacturer that I got the equipment from. I asked him why i could search the part number on Google and find tons of other companies selling these same steppers. He didn't really have an answer for me, he said he actually couldn't get me info on them because they were custom. Then I pointed out that the technical data manual i have for each one list which drives were recommended for use with these, and he just mumbled some stuff. Then he spouted out that these are European, and that input voltage was 100-230 VAC, at that point I was tired of dealing with the guy and took his word. I guess another call is in order so confirm what he said. I don't know much about steppers and drives, so its a bit hard for me to act like I know and try to ask technical questions to people who actually do know what their doing haha.

[doorknob]

Input voltage of 100-230 VAC sounds to me like a description of the power requirements for the drive, not for the steppers themselves.

It sounds like you may not get much help from the manufacturer.

I think that you will be OK using those steppers with the Gecko drive(s) that you mentioned with appropriate power supplies, but then I'm just a guy on the Internet who is reading some spec sheets, so YMMV...

[TenSecond408]

Well just spoke to another application engineer and received completely different information. I started off by asking about the X-Mind B6 Driver that they recommend for the stepper at 315V. I asked what the output voltage was on that unit, he said it depends on what VAC you input, which has a 1.414 multiplier from AC to DC. He did confirm that these drives output DC voltage. He also confirmed that these units were custom manufactured for a private label company ( the machine manufacturer) and that he couldn't give me any specs because the info is proprietary. He did confirm that the X-Mind B6 would work with this. What I don't understand is that he said these steppers were "big" enough to accept AC or DC voltage.... Is that possible?

Whats y'alls take on all this conflicting info from the two different guys?

[doorknob]

What I don't understand is that he said these steppers were "big" enough to accept AC or DC voltage.... Is that possible?

Unless I'm missing something, that statement sounds like gibberish to me.

When I look at a different motor vendor's site (scroll down to the section titled "Difference Between AC Input and DC Input Characteristics":

VEXTA Stepper Motors, Drivers and Controllers

my interpretation is that they are taking a "system-level" view rather than a "component-level" view, in that they seem to be comparing a 24-volt DC input system with one that runs the drivers off of 110 volt AC power and which outputs a higher DC voltage than 24 volts. That's the only way that I can make sense out of it.

Maybe someone who has dealt with those industrial automation vendors can jump in and either agree with my interpretation or claim that I'm all wet.