[NGdriver]

Hello to all - Looks like a great, knowledgable group here so perhaps some might help steer me in the right direction.

I own a small business that makes placards out of acrylic. The business has grown to a point where the person doing the laser work for me can't meet the volume. So, I need to invest into a laser machine and begin producing the parts myself. The problem is, I don't know where to begin or what exactly I'm looking for when it comes to these machines or how they operate (especially software). I have a basic understanding but lack the knowledge when it comes to shopping for one.

I have seen many different machines on ebay, mostly "Made in China". Don't know if that is a good route to go? The machine would have to have a working area of at least 20x20 inches. My budget is in and around $10,000 - But, wouldn't mind spending more for the right piece of machinery.

Attached are some of the jobs to be done with it. Panels are constructed out of 4.6mm white acrylic and painted with about 5 coats of automotive paint.

The questions are:

What do I look for when shopping for a laser machine?
What companies would you recommend?
What type and how much maintenance is required?

Many thanks in advance!

Jorge

[Gweikelasers]

Hi, G.weike will be a good choice. Your work is quite easy. And with about 1/2-1/3 of your budget, you can buy a good machine here. Operating system is all in English and very easy for new user.

[NGdriver]

Would you mind providing me with more information on a specific machine?

Thanks.

[34ford]

Jorge,

Dont jump before listening to more suggestions. Read as much as you can. Search google. Do you want to go thru importing, or buy from dealers on your soil.
You in the US?
Dont rush, look around, think about repairs and support local or none except by phone or email.

[NGdriver]

Thanks - I've been reading about machines in my off time. Trying to educate myself the best way possible.

I used to live in the US but now working overseas in Panama - A place where only a handful of people own a laser. Although not as large work area as I'd like, the Universal VLS3.50 seem like a good candidate. They appear to offer overseas shipping and actual hands on support. Not to mention, the guy who does the work for me now owns a larger model and couldn't be happier - But then again he paid around $30K.

I'm going to give them a ring tomorrow during business hours and see what they have to offer ...

Thanks.

[RossMosh]

First, why are you using acrylic for this when laminated plastic exists? MUCH better choice for this process and is actually considered the norm in the industry.

Second, for raster engraving Chinese machines are slow. Keep this in mind. 20ipm is the fastest they go while an Epilog/Universal will hit about 80ipm and a Trotec will hit 140ipm.

I'd suggest a smaller, used Epilog/Universal or an 80w+ direct from China 24x36 machine.

[Exsecratio]

GPWS ! that brings back memories

As Ross said, give it some time and a lot of replies before jumping, what sort of numbers are you producing?

Chinaside will be cheaper but slower machines,
Western made will be faster but 2x to 4x the price.

Something to consider if going for western, when the tube needs re-gassing can you get it don't where you are?

cheers
Dave

[NGdriver]

Speed is VERY important. I'm still very apprehensive about china machines - I'd rather spend the extra dough on a US with US based customer support machine. Aside from Epilog and ULS, any other companies to look into?

[Exsecratio]

Don't "assume" incountry support is any better than China based support

have a read of this for a few ideas....

OPLaser support forum ? View topic - Buying A Laser Machine

cheers

Dave

[fixtureman1]

One of the questions is will it arrive in working order. They say that the lasers from China are packaged very well but they have no control over the shipper. The same can be said about USA made lasers. The shipper could put a fork through it or drop it bang it around you don't know what could happen in transit. When I was installing pharmacy equipment I saw all kinds of stuff even had a load that had rolled over that they delivered after it was back up.

[RossMosh]

Speed is VERY important. I'm still very apprehensive about china machines - I'd rather spend the extra dough on a US with US based customer support machine. Aside from Epilog and ULS, any other companies to look into?

If speed is your #1 priority, you have to look at Trotec.

I'm still curious why you're using white acrylic for this kind of work. IPI or Rowmark most likely have an acceptable product and I'm sure it would take a lot of time and money.

[NGdriver]

If speed is your #1 priority, you have to look at Trotec.

I'm still curious why you're using white acrylic for this kind of work. IPI or Rowmark most likely have an acceptable product and I'm sure it would take a lot of time and money.

The reason I'm producing them this way is because the panels MUST have white lettering that is BACKLIGHTABLE. Although other alternatives can be used, this is the best method for producing this product, aside from the fact that the customer looks for "laser engraved" panels - They are the best in for what we do.

In regards to speed, the ULS machines speed they are being produced on right now works well. I've been looking at the ipm at some of the china machines along with various videos of them at work and they simply do not work at the speed I need them to.

After reading more about these machines and consulting around, I've decided to stay away from china machines - For various reasons. I'm looking at either smaller Epilogs or ULS...

[RossMosh]

The reason I'm producing them this way is because the panels MUST have white lettering that is BACKLIGHTABLE. Although other alternatives can be used, this is the best method for producing this product, aside from the fact that the customer looks for "laser engraved" panels - They are the best in for what we do.

In regards to speed, the ULS machines speed they are being produced on right now works well. I've been looking at the ipm at some of the china machines along with various videos of them at work and they simply do not work at the speed I need them to.

After reading more about these machines and consulting around, I've decided to stay away from china machines - For various reasons. I'm looking at either smaller Epilogs or ULS...

Fair enough about the material selection. You should seriously look at Trotec if speed is a concern.

One other thing to mention about Chinese machines, where they lack in rastering speed they can make up in with cutting power. 80W laser will absolutely smoke a 30-40W Epilog/ULS/Trotec in cutting. Plus you can buy a Chinese machine with a large bed and process more pieces at once which can leave you to do different things while the machine works.

If I were in your position, in a foreign land, with your budget, and requirements, I'd be looking at an 80-100W Chinese laser with a 24x36 bed.

[fixtureman1]

If speed is important then for the price of a Trotec you could get 2 Chinese lasers and you would be further ahead.

[Hurricane21]

Ng,

Please consider Hurricane Lasers. We have great customer support based here in the US with English speaking reps available 9-6 PST and email most any other time. We also have 2 year warranties that cover everything including the tube. We us lenses and mirrors from Meller Optics here in the US which give you greater efficiency and last longer than chinese lenses.
We are also having our Memorial Day sale that started today. Memorial Day Sale All of our lasers are 35% OFF plus other freebies!

Thank you.

John

[MonoNeuron]

You can always give Marco a call at LightObject and see what he thinks. He travels to China quite a bit and knows the machines that are good and the ones without any support and he has invested quite a bit of time over the past 2 years getting laser parts for his site. He sells a pretty good looking laser machine but I don't know what it is like as I haven't seen it used. He knows the good companies and the bad ones.

I have bought the DSP from him and find it to be a very worthwhile bit of kit - for my machine anyway which is home built. I can push the laser head to 700+mm/sec but find that the extra room it needs to get the head up to speed is a bit of a waste of time and 500mm/sec to 550mm/sec seem to be pretty good speeds for me.

You could also buy a Zing from Epilogue as that is their budget laser.

[Exsecratio]

If you want to engrave fast then a Chinese made Galvo is the way to go (Chinese is a LOT cheaper than western made)....not much from any other companies in the way of gantry lasers will get close to the speed of a galvo.

speeds of 2,000 mm per second marking and 7,000+ mm per second linear movement makes any of the gantry machines look silly

best wishes

Dave

[MonoNeuron]

I've always wanted a Galvo head laser but you are confined to a fairly small area for the engraving. If you are only doing parts about <150mm in size the Galvo is definitely the way to go but you need to sit by it and change the parts as they are engraved unless you have auto loading and unloading. Gantry can do dozens at a time and frees you up to go off and do other things.
All depends on what you want and how versatile a machine you need.

[Exsecratio]

Chinese Galvo's run 300mm x 300mm as easily available machines and go up in industrials to huge bed sizes (1200 x 1200 isn't unusual),one of my regular products can be engraved on a 200 x 200 Galvo faster than the 2.5m x 2.5m gantry by a factor of 12 even allowing for loading and unloading and the bigger machine.The finish quality is also far superior.

cheers

Dave

[RossMosh]

Chinese Galvo's run 300mm x 300mm as easily available machines and go up in industrials to huge bed sizes (1200 x 1200 isn't unusual),one of my regular products can be engraved on a 200 x 200 Galvo faster than the 2.5m x 2.5m gantry by a factor of 12 even allowing for loading and unloading and the bigger machine.The finish quality is also far superior.

cheers

Dave

I don't know much about Galvos but I do believe he's going to have a hard time cutting with the galvo unless he ends up buying a very expensive model. You could get two machines, one to cut and one to mark but that's probably excessive unless you're doing serious production.

The reality is, a Trotec is probably the best machine for his application but it's too expensive. The alternative is to buy a low wattage ULS/Epilog and have the faster rastering but slower cutting or get a Chinese machine with the bigger bed, slower rastering, but faster cutting.