[RAF.]

It seems to appear that, that little critter is still included in V27 at no extra charge.

[mmoe]

Hopefully this won't offend, but after watching the video and trying it for myself, I don't get why that would be considered a bug. It seems to me that you have to be pretty inaccurate with the mouse placement to cause the problem. If you don't have your mouse pointer inside of the snap circle (which it is clearly not in the video), you get a point outside the snap circle, which it then translates the part relative to. If you make sure you have your mouse inside of the snap circle (which is very generously sized), it snaps to the correct point 100% of the time, at least from the testing I did. This is the roughly the same as every other CAD system I've ever used (though less sophisticated) in that there is a range in which you are picking one snap, and if you snap outside of that range, you could end up with a different snap (usually something in the grid beyond). The only issue I have with it is that the snap probably should only glow red if it will lock onto it, but I really think that's being picky since you really have to have the mouse close to it and still outside of it to provoke the problem and it's a pretty small range that produces that result. After the first instance, it seems that it would be obvious that you have to be more selective about the placement of the mouse pointer when using the snaps. CAD is a precision business and a good draftsman should identify that he/she missed the snap right when it happens, and in fact Bobcad shows the snap off of the geometry which should be a major clue something is wrong. In most CAD systems, this happens several times a day and you just get used to not taking for granted that the snaps will perform perfectly the way you hoped every time.

Just like everything else that involves craftsmanship, a good drafter should constantly evaluate the quality of the work being done for fit and finish. Whether it's digital or physical, it's all quality control.

[jrmach]

I hope you know you are wrong.If need be ,BoB can log on my computer and see for themselves.Surely RAF ain't as crappy as a craftsman as me,and he gets the same stuff.Might be you have the bad ass computer and I have junk,but anyway you slice it,it is a bug.I did not say I cannot get it to work.But in this one particular situation the software fails to be reliable and easy to use,Non desirable trait to have to do the hokey pokey on something so simple.

[mmoe]

I hope you know you are wrong.If need be ,BoB can log on my computer and see for themselves.Surely RAF ain't as crappy as a craftsman as me,and he gets the same stuff.Might be you have the bad ass computer and I have junk,but anyway you slice it,it is a bug.

Obviously you did find my post offensive, but here's the video of both ways. I don't really want to put them on Youtube, so you'll have to download them. They are small, about 4mb each. The circle I draw is just under 2 inches in radius, since I work in metric, it's 50mm. Otherwise, I think I've done everything as you did. I also retested the process in inches, using the same 2 inch radius and had exactly the same results as these videos (I could make more videos, or you can take my word for it).

In this first video, I do pretty much the same as you did, but I make sure my mouse pointer is inside of the snap circle. A dot appears at the end of the arc, exactly on the end. I then do the same for the destination. As you'll see, they align perfectly:

https://files.secureserver.net/0sbloJa0X4lrch

In the second video, I do as you did in the video you posted, but you will notice that I intentionally back out of the snap circle just enough that it remains highlighted, but with the tip of the mouse pointer not within the snap circle. A dot appears to the right and below the end of the arc. I then select the destination snap point within the snap circle and the part is moved so that the dot generated previously aligns with the destination snap point, but the ends of the arcs do not align, just as you showed in your video.

https://files.secureserver.net/0soGelepOyuewd

While I did not make a video of it, if you select the part as in the second video (and your video), and then further select the destination snap point with the mouse outside of the snap circle, the part is translated so that the dot generated then matches up with where a dot would have been generated outside of the destination snap circle, compounding the inaccuracy of the translation (at least to the naked eye it appears that way, I did not take a measurement). You will see by selecting with the mouse pointer just outside of the snap circle in different ways at both the part and the destination, the result varies to match the way you chose the snap point. However, when I keep the tip of the mouse pointer inside of the snap circle, it always, 100% of the time, puts the snaps together the way they should be. I cannot reproduce the problem unless I make a bad selection outside of the snap circle. Do a test where you are more specific about your selection keeping the tip of the mouse pointer completely inside the snap circle and then let me know if you still have problems. I don't think it should have anything to do with my computer vs. yours, but if it does, then that is important for the developers to know. The thing is that they probably have similar computers to mine (better even), and if they can't make it work incorrectly, it gets scratched off the bug list as a bad report.

[jrmach]

I have seen bugs defended before.And yes I can make this work,,,BUT
https://video.search.yahoo.com/video...myy-t-999&tt=b

[RAF.]

Hopefully this won't offend, but after watching the video and trying it for myself, I don't get why that would be considered a bug. It seems to me that you have to be pretty inaccurate with the mouse placement to cause the problem. If you don't have your mouse pointer inside of the snap circle (which it is clearly not in the video), you get a point outside the snap circle, which it then translates the part relative to. If you make sure you have your mouse inside of the snap circle (which is very generously sized), it snaps to the correct point 100% of the time, at least from the testing I did. This is the roughly the same as every other CAD system I've ever used (though less sophisticated) in that there is a range in which you are picking one snap, and if you snap outside of that range, you could end up with a different snap (usually something in the grid beyond). The only issue I have with it is that the snap probably should only glow red if it will lock onto it, but I really think that's being picky since you really have to have the mouse close to it and still outside of it to provoke the problem and it's a pretty small range that produces that result. After the first instance, it seems that it would be obvious that you have to be more selective about the placement of the mouse pointer when using the snaps. CAD is a precision business and a good draftsman should identify that he/she missed the snap right when it happens, and in fact Bobcad shows the snap off of the geometry which should be a major clue something is wrong. In most CAD systems, this happens several times a day and you just get used to not taking for granted that the snaps will perform perfectly the way you hoped every time.

Just like everything else that involves craftsmanship, a good drafter should constantly evaluate the quality of the work being done for fit and finish. Whether it's digital or physical, it's all quality control.

Maybe it should just be called a ( Remember to be aware that at the 0 and 180 deg. of Arcs pay close attention to Highlighted Snap points when selecting ) , also from what I have found is that if the Arc is rotated, the area of paying closer attention to also rotates.

On my big monitor and with my 3d mouse and my glasses on, this does not really create much of a problem, after all it only has given me something to be aware of from the experimenting that I done at those snap points at those areas of an Arc.

On my old smaller monitor, I would just have to remind myself to zoom much closer on those areas.

The older I get, the remember to remember is becoming -- what was I saying

PROBLEM SOLVED (at least for me)

RAF.

[BurrMan]

I would classify that as something you can report jr... There is no technical explanation other than it is different than the way it has always worked and the way it behaves in other areas.... (BobCads snaping system)

mmoe is correct in his description and what he is describing, but I think the issue is that the snap circle has "dramatically shrunk" in this instance...

If the little blue snap point turns red, then BobCad has been pretty lax about a sloppy pick. I think that is intended.... In this "one case", it seems to be wanting very precise picking... Something the devs should look at...

It works as intended if you don't make visible the snap points and just do normal snap picking.....

So mmoe, as you are correct with the ability to make a good snap point pick, the failure jr is showing is inconsistent with the way it works in most other areas, leaving the door open for "missing" the miss....

I would think they want to take a look at this case and video......

[BurrMan]

BTW jr,
There's also something you can do about it, but I don't know how it will affect the rest of your workflow in other areas..

Move your selection area setting to about the half way point.... This pretty much will eliminate it in this particular case, but you can still "try" and succeed in creating a bad selection....

[BurrMan]

I have seen bugs defended before.And yes I can make this work,,,BUT

By definition it's not a "bug"... It's sloppy picking manifesting itself in the system.... the selection area by default is set very small. Precise picking works with snaps as intended... If you are a sloppy picker, raise the selection area...

[jrmach]

First off I have never got "bitten" by this "non-bug".I was simply raising awareness to an inconsistency and/or failure of the software to pick snap points correctly.I have known about this for over 5 years.Most of the time the software behaves as expected.I was just showing an instance that it does not.Remember,some of us are using laptops with small screens.Not only that,when %99 1/2 of the time snap points work like a no brainer,just select and go.Then you get this instance that it doesn't work worth a darn ,"oh,you are just a sloppy Picker" I call BS
Enough said,I hope I save somebody hours of headaches.
RAF's post hit it on head.

[BurrMan]

I call BS
.

OIC.

,"oh,you are just a sloppy Picker"

Well jr, your video "IS" a video of sloppy picking... I can perform that same action and get precise picking everytime (Need a video?)

However, I can be lax and recreate it.... (Lax being a code word for sloppy)...

If I want to fly around and be lax, I can move the tolerance of my selections down a bit, and never see it.........

It's kindof straight forward...

But you can call that bullsh&& if you like I guess...

[jrmach]

You even said "I would classify that as something you can report jr... There is no technical explanation other than it is different than the way it has always worked and the way it behaves in other areas.... (BobCads snaping system)"

Honestly,I care no less,it has never,ever bitten me.Just showing awareness to something potentially troublesome.

[BurrMan]

You even said "I would classify that as something you can report jr... There is no technical explanation other than it is different than the way it has always worked and the way it behaves in other areas.... (BobCads snaping system)".

Well, yes I did say that.. I said it was something I think the devs would like to look at.... "A bobcad user is confused about what's happening here"....

mmoe explained to you "you are clicking outside of the selection circle" (A setting you can adjust)

Try the setting I suggested. See what you get....

I guess you could call the 2 responders bull****ters.... But that doesn't make it a "Bug".... You could just call the software "Buggy, full of workarounds" (oh that's right), Or, take note of how you work, adjust the user interface with controls they've provided, and understand what just happened...

.Just showing awareness to something potentially troublesome

Yes! I can dig it..... You are a very helpful and giving person.....

[jrmach]

BTW,I turned the "select" up all the way and that helped a little.I don't know what consequences that shall bear though.I am sure something will change or there is a trade off ???

[BurrMan]

I don't know what consequences that shall bear though.I am sure something will change or there is a trade off ???

For me, half way made it completely go away..I would say you wont notice anything... what it does is make the "tip of the pointer" bigger, so to speak...(Imagine a circle around the tip of your pointer....

The only trade off is some people don't like large selection areas... but BobCad is not loaded with various pick options for viewport or entities anyway... Maybe if you import a spline with 300 pick points in a very small area, you will have to zoom very close to get the one you want... Or if you are picking in a large mess of entities, it will start "jumping" to endpoints, unless you are very precise......

[Steve244]

Does anyone have a recovery disc for a Brother HS70A? My back up battery dies and I lost my software.