[jalessi]

Using an independently powered fan to cool the motor. as Instructor37 suggested is standard practice on many higher end machines equipped with a VFD due to insufficient cooling at low r.p.m.'s

See attached link for a motor mounted forced ventilation unit.

forced ventilation units / external air cooling

Jeff...

A better and simpler option is to get one of those computer style fans- they make them in 110 and 220 volts about 5" square- bolt it to the original fan housing and wire it to the motor power supply so it comes on whenever the motor is running. They put out a lot of air and the volume of air is not dependent on the speed of the motor. A big improvement in cooling when you are running the motor at low speeds for things like tapping. Here's a link
110V 2Wire Brushless Computer Cooling Fan 8cm Fan 80mm 80x80x25mm Sleeve Bearing | eBay

[GITERDUN]

Since the fans efficiency is related to the clearance to the fan shroud/guard, when it is in the later position it would recirculate a lower percentage of its air, being a constant speed motor hooked to a variable speed drive, at slower speeds at high constant torque it will need the best available cooling. I have tried to research the motor and I have been unable to find a fan that takes up the full shaft that would have deeper blade patterns to move more air. Perhaps the narrower fan was chosen by the motor factory to prevent the power absorbed by the fan from dropping the actual shaft Kw output below the design rating. There are two options make a sleeve to keep the fan in the first position shown above, or take the same sleeve and keep the fan in the second position and drill new cover retaining holes to move the shroud/cover close enough to have a 1mm Fan blade gap against the cover face and also drill a hole for the shaft to protrude through the cover. I am leaning towards the latter as extending the cover over the TEFC motors fins further will aid in the cooling.

After reading up on fans in " Fans and efficiency 3rd edition", I realized the fan is actually designed to move on the shaft. It is the classic turboencabulator design
with an inner sleeve of prefabulated amulite, surrounded by a malleable logarithmic extrusion in such a way that it creates a linear spurving bearing in a direct line with the pentametric fan. The primary rotation is of the normal lotus-o-delta type relying on the panendermic semi-boloid slots in the stator, making every seventh rotation a nonreversible tremie pulse to the differential pressure metric, creating a high velocity vortec flow which can be measured by a series of grammeters.

But on second thought, just a dab of red loctite and that fan ain't going nowhere.

[n1tr0]

Here I was all worried about the mill throwing chips into the back of the lathe spindle motor. Looks like there's nothing there to worry about. I don't think that fan's really moving any air. The electric fan sounds like a much better idea or maybe 3d print a replacement.

[BIGBLOCK1965]

After reading up on fans in " Fans and efficiency 3rd edition", I realized the fan is actually designed to move on the shaft. It is the classic turboencabulator design
with an inner sleeve of prefabulated amulite, surrounded by a malleable logarithmic extrusion in such a way that it creates a linear spurving bearing in a direct line with the pentametric fan. The primary rotation is of the normal lotus-o-delta type relying on the panendermic semi-boloid slots in the stator, making every seventh rotation a nonreversible tremie pulse to the differential pressure metric, creating a high velocity vortec flow which can be measured by a series of grammeters.

But on second thought, just a dab of red loctite and that fan ain't going nowhere.

That's funny- you actually had me going for a second.

[chuckorlando]

After reading up on fans in " Fans and efficiency 3rd edition", I realized the fan is actually designed to move on the shaft. It is the classic turboencabulator design
with an inner sleeve of prefabulated amulite, surrounded by a malleable logarithmic extrusion in such a way that it creates a linear spurving bearing in a direct line with the pentametric fan. The primary rotation is of the normal lotus-o-delta type relying on the panendermic semi-boloid slots in the stator, making every seventh rotation a nonreversible tremie pulse to the differential pressure metric, creating a high velocity vortec flow which can be measured by a series of grammeters.

But on second thought, just a dab of red loctite and that fan ain't going nowhere.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Norton_BMW]

After reading up on fans in " Fans and efficiency 3rd edition", I realized the fan is actually designed to move on the shaft. It is the classic turboencabulator design
with an inner sleeve of prefabulated amulite, surrounded by a malleable logarithmic extrusion in such a way that it creates a linear spurving bearing in a direct line with the pentametric fan. The primary rotation is of the normal lotus-o-delta type relying on the panendermic semi-boloid slots in the stator, making every seventh rotation a nonreversible tremie pulse to the differential pressure metric, creating a high velocity vortec flow which can be measured by a series of grammeters.

But on second thought, just a dab of red loctite and that fan ain't going nowhere.

Loctite Red 271 offers the following caution:

Loctite Threadlocker Red 271 from Loctite Adhesives

Not Recommended For

Use in pure oxygen and/or oxygen rich systems and should not be selected as a sealant for chlorine or other strong oxidizing materials
Use on plastic parts, particularly thermoplastic materials where stress cracking of the plastic could result

[BIGBLOCK1965]

Loctite Red 271 offers the following caution:
Loctite Threadlocker Red 271 from Loctite Adhesives
Not Recommended For Use in pure oxygen and/or oxygen rich systems and should not be selected as a sealant for chlorine or other strong oxidizing materials
Use on plastic parts, particularly thermoplastic materials where stress cracking of the plastic could result

Yeah, but I'll bet it works great on that prefabulated amulite. :stickpoke

[Norton_BMW]

I am curious how many reading this post have actually measured of verified the tolerances of their machines?
http://shopmasterusa.com/wp-content/...12/03/shee.jpg

Or have any of you actually measured the deflection of the milling spindle under various loads in the X & Y Direction?

[BIGBLOCK1965]

[QUOTE=Norton_BMW;1939750]I am curious how many reading this post have actually measured of verified the tolerances of their machines?
http://shopmasterusa.com/wp-content/...12/03/shee.jpg
Or have any of you actually measured the deflection of the milling spindle under various loads in the X & Y Direction?

I think there have been a couple of questions, mostly on tailstock alignment, but my guess is that most people are like me, they just set the machine up and start in on a project. If the result is within their expectations, then there is really no need to be making a lot of measurements.

[Norton_BMW]

[QUOTE=BIGBLOCK1965;1939754]

I am curious how many reading this post have actually measured of verified the tolerances of their machines?
http://shopmasterusa.com/wp-content/...12/03/shee.jpg
Or have any of you actually measured the deflection of the milling spindle under various loads in the X & Y Direction?

I think there have been a couple of questions, mostly on tailstock alignment, but my guess is that most people are like me, they just set the machine up and start in on a project. If the result is within their expectations, then there is really no need to be making a lot of measurements.

Ok so that is one opinion, I wonder how many people will machine anything on a new or used machine for the first time without for example checking the run-out?

I am also curious as to what the actual setup time has been for people before making their first chip.?

[BIGBLOCK1965]

[QUOTE=Norton_BMW;1939764]

Ok so that is one opinion, I wonder how many people will machine anything on a new or used machine for the first time without for example checking the run-out?
I am also curious as to what the actual setup time has been for people before making their first chip.?

Set up time will probably take an afternoon to get it uncrated, on the bench, moved in place, leveled and cleaned up and test run. Probably a few more hours to do the final setups like steps per inch and backlash compensation. I'll bet most guys make their first chips running the machine in manual mode before they feel comfortable trying a CNC operation. Usually you start with some scrap material, make some cuts and then compare your results with the DRO reading . As I said before, that is where you would find any thing that is obviously out of spec, and then start looking for the cause.

[Norton_BMW]

[QUOTE=BIGBLOCK1965;1939770]

Set up time will probably take an afternoon to get it uncrated, on the bench, moved in place, leveled and cleaned up and test run. Probably a few more hours to do the final setups like steps per inch and backlash compensation. I'll bet most guys make their first chips running the machine in manual mode before they feel comfortable trying a CNC operation. Usually you start with some scrap material, make some cuts and then compare your results with the DRO reading . As I said before, that is where you would find any thing that is obviously out of spec, and then start looking for the cause.

While the attached article is 60+ years old, I believe that its just as valid for a modern CNC machine as it was then:
"Now it might be thought that the quickest wat to test a lathe for truth would be to check the work produced, but anyone who has tried this way will agree that it is slow and unreliable"

https://concretelathe.wikispaces.com...r+accuracy.pdf

[BIGBLOCK1965]

While the attached article is 60+ years old, I believe that its just as valid for a modern CNC machine as it was then:
[B]/B] https://concretelathe.wikispaces.com...r+accuracy.pdf

The article makes some good points, especially the first sentence. But it was written in a different time and context. In 1955 there was not a huge hobby market in machining, that was only brought about by the influx of low cost imports in the last 35 + years. A lathe with 17" swing and 30" centers in 1955 would have cost around 700.00, and a milling machine around 1200.00, which was equal to the price of an average family sedan. In today's dollars you would be talking about a 33000.00 machine investment, so the guy in 1955 with that much invested would have been very very careful about his testing as a guy today would be if he had purchased a new Haas. For me, my machine worked fine right out of the box, and as time passed I made some upgrades of my own liking, but I never did any highly technical testing beyond adjusting the tailstock when I got some taper in turning, and tramming the mill head when I was getting a little pattern across the surface of a milled piece.

[timshufflin]

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

[timshufflin]

Dear GITERDUN;
I find it interesting that you are questioning my integrity? "Frankly, nothing in any of your pictures could be certified as a defect beyond your word for it. A tapered tap set cockeyed in a hole, and bolts of unknown origin, a mill casting supposedly machined, but could be just belt sanding away the paint."

There is an old latin saying "Cui Bono"

So who really benefits by you challenging the veracity of my statements?

There is one thing that could have convinced him either way... did the machine work or not?

[Norton_BMW]

There is one thing that could have convinced him either way... did the machine work or not?

The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend - Robertson Davies

When it arrived it did not work, Missaligned Vertical (z) Axis motor/pulley, hole drilled in (z) axis Belt that made it skip when cranking it manually, Idler Pulleys that had bearings destroyed by the sholdered bolt having too short a shoulder causing severe side-load when it was tightened and a computer that was prone to crashing and had none of the alleged files on the hard drive, All that was even before I lifted the unit into the base frame. The parts that I ended up changing or upgrading are here:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/11263776233...84.m1558.l2649


There are many shill accounts on here that defend Shopmaster/Shoptask and many negative comments get pulled by moderators.

https://en.industryarena.com/forum/mill-turn-owner-feedback-prospective-buyer--328284.html

[timshufflin]

The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend - Robertson Davies

When it arrived it did not work, Missaligned Vertical (z) Axis motor/pulley, hole drilled in (z) axis Belt that made it skip when cranking it manually, Idler Pulleys that had bearings destroyed by the sholdered bolt having too short a shoulder causing severe side-load when it was tightened and a computer that was prone to crashing and had none of the alleged files on the hard drive, All that was even before I lifted the unit into the base frame. The parts that I ended up changing or upgrading are here:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/11263776233...84.m1558.l2649


There are many shill accounts on here that defend Shopmaster/Shoptask and many negative comments get pulled by moderators.

https://en.industryarena.com/forum/mill-turn-owner-feedback-prospective-buyer--328284.html

Wow Norton, I'm sad you had such a terrible experience. Actually it sickens me. I'm, as of right now, in the market for a small CNC lathe for my gun business. I currently do barrel re profiling work on a WT 11x26 and I'd like to free myself up from the drudgery of that task. I am looking hard at everything in the $6000 to $12,000 class and I'm frankly scared sh$tl$ss. I have never ran CNC, I just turn the knobs and have all my life. I have always been pretty computer literate but half the terms you all throw around about these CNC's are greek to me and I don't have the time or aptitude to learn this thing as well as fix it. I have to have that small footprint and that's why the shopmaster appealed to me along with the microkinetics. I can't seem to find anyone else with something less than 68" long and 30" deep.


I ramble on. The law of merchantability clearly states that something must be able to be used for what it was marketed for. I can only say that if I sent a firearm out and it didn't work as it was intended I'd be ashamed. The CNC world seems to operate on a different standard because from what I read... They all suck! I just need to find the one that sucks the least

[n1tr0]

If you don't need a tail-stock, you can probably get it to eventually turn. My tail-stock is so wobbly and mis-aligned, I have never gotten it to a useful point. The centerline of the tail-stock is at least 2mm lower than the centerline of the chuck.
I'm about 2 years in with mine and I've certainly learned how to better spend my money next time. The owner still has never made an effort to make things right with my purchase and I boxes of the junk I've had to strip off and replace. Fortunately I continue to have access to real CNC machines at work to machine the band-aids for my Mill Yurn.
You'll find the only positive reviews on this forum come from guys who all use the same style of writing and the same all-caps user-names, shill reviews on Amazon are less obvious :P

[Norton_BMW]

Wow Norton, I'm sad you had such a terrible experience. Actually it sickens me. I'm, as of right now, in the market for a small CNC lathe for my gun business. I currently do barrel re profiling work on a WT 11x26 and I'd like to free myself up from the drudgery of that task. I am looking hard at everything in the $6000 to $12,000 class and I'm frankly scared sh$tl$ss. I have never ran CNC, I just turn the knobs and have all my life. I have always been pretty computer literate but half the terms you all throw around about these CNC's are greek to me and I don't have the time or aptitude to learn this thing as well as fix it. I have to have that small footprint and that's why the shopmaster appealed to me along with the microkinetics. I can't seem to find anyone else with something less than 68" long and 30" deep.


I ramble on. The law of merchantability clearly states that something must be able to be used for what it was marketed for. I can only say that if I sent a firearm out and it didn't work as it was intended I'd be ashamed. The CNC world seems to operate on a different standard because from what I read... They all suck! I just need to find the one that sucks the least

In mine I had to fix the alignment and had the surfaces precision ground and then use a precision shim. The GIB retention plate was also too flimsy.

[timshufflin]

If you don't need a tail-stock, you can probably get it to eventually turn. My tail-stock is so wobbly and mis-aligned, I have never gotten it to a useful point. The centerline of the tail-stock is at least 2mm lower than the centerline of the chuck.
I'm about 2 years in with mine and I've certainly learned how to better spend my money next time. The owner still has never made an effort to make things right with my purchase and I boxes of the junk I've had to strip off and replace. Fortunately I continue to have access to real CNC machines at work to machine the band-aids for my Mill Yurn.
You'll find the only positive reviews on this forum come from guys who all use the same style of writing and the same all-caps user-names, shill reviews on Amazon are less obvious :P

Yes n1tr0 I do need the tailstock. Now my search continues to find the small CNC lathe package that sucks the least. I will not buy from a company that does not back their customers and product. I have read enough on just this thread to rule out shopmaster and it's a shame. The footprint and theory of the shopmaster design seemed to be best suited for my needs.