[dharmic]

I don't have to crank my collets down harder than what felt an easy "snug plus a bit" with normal double ended spanners. And overtightening will wreck 'em.

Example torque specs for collets here

Make sure you have a clean collet, that it's clicked into the nut, and that it's the smallest collet in the set which will take the tool you're loading. My collets will mostly hold the tool in place - just - when they're loose in the nut.

[DarbyOhara]

This thread is FAR too big to be helpful. I am interested in a CNC 6040 Chinese package and ebay has the cheapest. But every one of their ads give so little information (w/ broken English). I was hoping to learn more on this thread... after I got to page 40 and my eyes were bugging out while hitting 50... I gave up. It should be against public civility to never have a forum thread larger that 50 pages. lol. Especially if you have 60+ year old eyes. Even after reading thru 50+ pages, I don't know whether the ebay is just as good as this Omino... because I have seen many with issues that the ebay ones sometimes have. I am no electrician or engineer. But I do have other hi-tech tools that I can easily operate without issues. The few other CNC kits that are made with wood seem just too expensive for buying cut wood that I have to totally build. However, I have seen a stress test of 3/4" MDF board against 1/2" aluminum... it was a youtube of a guy pushing his weight on each... the wood didn't move, but the aluminum bowed. I was hoping to see some debate over those differences.

But it seems the Omino has pretty good customer support (from what little I got to read). Is that true? Is the X6-2200 really worth the $2k or maybe I should chance an ebay 6040 and pay $1k less.... Also, are the Omino shipped from China or are there US warehouses like many vendors on ebay? I despise paying lots of money for something that takes forever to be delivered. If I want caveman delivery, I'll move to the mountain caves.... lol.

[Mmpie]

'Better' can be subjective.

The OMIO is definitely better equipped. Proper linear rails and ballscrews, and proper motor drivers instead of those crappy 3 in 1's a lot of the eBay ones have. The rails in particular make a big difference, and the positional accuracy is really very good I must say, on my machine at least. These things give you a machine that can actually be used.

Quality is much the same.

Customer service? What's that?


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[NickB00]

Good advice, will do!

You really have to crank down on those collet nuts, a lot harder than you might think. It's difficult doing it on those spindles.

But probably not the problem, I doubt you are loading it up enough for that. Have you been clearing up all packaging oil off cutters and collets? They are usually always coated in cosmolene for rust prevention, which also lubricates them. Hit them with a degreaser first. Also make sure there's nothing stuck in the grooves and the spindle taper is clean.


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[NickB00]

Snug and a bit is what I used to do until I got a couple of failures, first 6mm Endmill in an Omio Supplied Collet, took metal from the inside of the collet and second 3mm ball end 4mm shaft on 4mm Omio Collet. I think the second failure had something to do with the dustshoe hairs as it does not look like metal fibres stuck to the bit. Anyway, where can I get a proper torque wrench for my er11 collets? I have looked on your links (very helpful) and on ebay but only found wrenches not torque wrenches. Can you show me where to get them or what you are using. thanks..

I don't have to crank my collets down harder than what felt an easy "snug plus a bit" with normal double ended spanners. And overtightening will wreck 'em.

Example torque specs for collets here

Make sure you have a clean collet, that it's clicked into the nut, and that it's the smallest collet in the set which will take the tool you're loading. My collets will mostly hold the tool in place - just - when they're loose in the nut.

[dharmic]

Snug and a bit is what I used to do until I got a couple of failures, first 6mm Endmill in an Omio Supplied Collet, took metal from the inside of the collet and second 3mm ball end 4mm shaft on 4mm Omio Collet. I think the second failure had something to do with the dustshoe hairs as it does not look like metal fibres stuck to the bit. Anyway, where can I get a proper torque wrench for my er11 collets? I have looked on your links (very helpful) and on ebay but only found wrenches not torque wrenches. Can you show me where to get them or what you are using. thanks..

I haul on a spanner and shout "CLICK" when it feels right. I have a legit torque wrench somewhere but don't drag it out of its shiny box very often. What you can do is the math that says 60 foot pounds is 25kg pounds at one foot. Spanner's about a foot long, so work out what it feels like to pick up 25kg and that's the haul on the spanner.

This thread is FAR too big to be helpful. I am interested in a CNC 6040 Chinese package and ebay has the cheapest. But every one of their ads give so little information (w/ broken English). I was hoping to learn more on this thread... after I got to page 40 and my eyes were bugging out while hitting 50... I gave up. It should be against public civility to never have a forum thread larger that 50 pages. lol. Especially if you have 60+ year old eyes. Even after reading thru 50+ pages, I don't know whether the ebay is just as good as this Omino... because I have seen many with issues that the ebay ones sometimes have. I am no electrician or engineer. But I do have other hi-tech tools that I can easily operate without issues. The few other CNC kits that are made with wood seem just too expensive for buying cut wood that I have to totally build. However, I have seen a stress test of 3/4" MDF board against 1/2" aluminum... it was a youtube of a guy pushing his weight on each... the wood didn't move, but the aluminum bowed. I was hoping to see some debate over those differences.

But it seems the Omino has pretty good customer support (from what little I got to read). Is that true? Is the X6-2200 really worth the $2k or maybe I should chance an ebay 6040 and pay $1k less.... Also, are the Omino shipped from China or are there US warehouses like many vendors on ebay? I despise paying lots of money for something that takes forever to be delivered. If I want caveman delivery, I'll move to the mountain caves.... lol.

Yeah, thread started off as a "here's how it worked out for me" but it's gotten a little unruly over the years.

Omio ships from China only. Omio's pre-sales support is good. Their post-sales support is utter rubbish. Once they have your money, you're on your own. This is why I paid the extra premium to have Paypal coverage in case what turned up was rubbish.

If you want to get an equivalent machine shipped from the states or if you want decent service and support (which means getting it locally, pretty much), expect to pay double because someone has to purchase and hold stock in the hope that someone like you will come along, they have to support it, and they have to earn a living doing so.

Omio's extruded aluminium section bed is quite flexible but there's nothing stopping you from replacing it or bolting down a 3/4" ply spoilboard onto the top to stiffen it up.

I bought mine because it had ballnuts instead of ACME screws, linear rails instead of curtain rods, and had a halfway decent rap from wherever I could find a reference to it. Occasionally they drop the ball and there are a couple of horror stories in here somewhere, but I've not been disappointed and it seems most people are in the same happy boat.

I would not buy or recommend something like the Omio for continuous or commercial use - unsupported downtime is too expensive. But for lightweight home / prototyping stuff I'm still really happy with mine.

[DarbyOhara]

Thank you so much for the quick replies and summary. That was what I was trying to find in the many pages of this thread. It pretty much turns me away when the vendor ships only from China. I do realize the ups /and downs of holding a USA inventory. So that may be the reason I continue leaning to ebay w/ USA inventory. Of course I am glad I waiting before pulling the trigger... so now I can be a bit more careful of what the ad says. As I said, I am not an electrician.. I didn't know the difference between .8KW and 2.2KW for spindle... but I do know the difference in getting shocked and electrocution... lol. Just jokin... But regardless of which kit I get.. it appears I will be a on a steep, long and perhaps expensive learning journey no matter which vendor and model I choose. Thanks again for replying and also allowing me to rant a bit...

[NickB00]

Hanging 25kg off a 1 foot spanner sounds like a heck of a force! Do you call that snug and a bit?

[QUOTE=dharmic;2212946]I haul on a spanner and shout "CLICK" when it feels right. I have a legit torque wrench somewhere but don't drag it out of its shiny box very often. What you can do is the math that says 60 foot pounds is 25kg pounds at one foot. Spanner's about a foot long, so work out what it feels like to pick up 25kg and that's the haul on the spanner.

[dharmic]

To be honest, I was a little surprised when I saw that. I'd say I do mine up maybe half that tight - which in hindsight is still more like "snug and then whale on it". I've not had a slip yet.

Meh. I'm not smart, but at least I can lift heavy things

It does suggest, though, that my paranoia about overtightening could be relaxed a little; I'm unlikely to ever accidentally go to that kind of torque by hand without really? meaning it.

[NickB00]

I have noticed a few times now that when my little Omio has finished a Rough Pass it goes back to 0, 0, 0 as it should.
But, as you can see in the photograph my starting 0, 0, 0 is the 2nd blue line, where I centred the bit to start the job, so it is not right.
In the other direction, the bit is at centre on the 2nd mark so thats ok, it is only in the x direction.
The Mach3 screen says it is back at 0, 0, 0 so what is going on?
This one has me baffled!

[dharmic]

You're losing steps.

Forgive me if this is overexplaining, but just in case...

Mach3 sends your stepper drivers step+direction signals. One wire is powered or not depending on clockwise or anticlockwise (direction). The other gets a pulse each time Mach3 wants the stepper to move one step in that direction. Every time it sends a step, Mach3 increments or decrements a counter for that axis. The DRO shows the counter, scaled according to your steps per unit in the motor setup, added to whatever the fixture/work offset is on that axis.

Point being: if Mach3 sends a step and the stepper doesn't for some reason, Mach3 doesn't know or care - it'll happily up the DRO.

Losing steps on one axis is going to be caused either by
- a programming issue (your feed rate is too high for the steppers on some part of the job, or you're maybe doing a small rapid whilst still engaged with the workpiece);
- a configuration issue (in particular look at the acceleration settings on the motors. You should be able to put your hand on the top of the spindle and apply a little braking whilst doing a jog from side to side without it skipping).
- a mechanical issue (if there's any tight spots or debris on the X screw or rails it can cause skipping).

Based on the litany of niggles you seem to be having, it might be worth considering abandoning carving all manner of pretty for a while and instead grabbing some stock, learning some basic G and M-codes (in particular G00, G01, G90/91, G3 and G5 with their associated parameters eg S and F) and using the MDI interface in Mach3 to do some systematic testing of loading it up in each axis and seeing where things are going wrong. Just a slightly more systematic approach, trying one thing at a time, is going to highlight issues faster than running a full job and getting to this fairly unhelpful (to you) point of "something went wrong but I've no idea of what actually caused it)".

[NickB00]

Wow thats the best answer to a question ever!
I did notice my X axis (the one in question) had a couple of tight spots when I first got it.
It made a little clunk sound in a couple of spots as I moved it back and forth. You have got me thinking.
I will pursue this issue as a first step and see what I can find, maybe there is an issue here causing some skipping..that makes sense.
My feed rate is not high as I run it at a slowish speed and I have put a little force on the spindle a couple of times as it was working and it did not skip, felt good and strong..
I have been studying Fusion 360 and have made some basic models for aluminium and have learnt a little G Code on the way. What is the MDI Interface you mention and how do you use it for testing??
Thanks heaps, again!

You're losing steps.

Forgive me if this is overexplaining, but just in case...

Mach3 sends your stepper drivers step+direction signals. One wire is powered or not depending on clockwise or anticlockwise (direction). The other gets a pulse each time Mach3 wants the stepper to move one step in that direction. Every time it sends a step, Mach3 increments or decrements a counter for that axis. The DRO shows the counter, scaled according to your steps per unit in the motor setup, added to whatever the fixture/work offset is on that axis.

Point being: if Mach3 sends a step and the stepper doesn't for some reason, Mach3 doesn't know or care - it'll happily up the DRO.

Losing steps on one axis is going to be caused either by
- a programming issue (your feed rate is too high for the steppers on some part of the job, or you're maybe doing a small rapid whilst still engaged with the workpiece);
- a configuration issue (in particular look at the acceleration settings on the motors. You should be able to put your hand on the top of the spindle and apply a little braking whilst doing a jog from side to side without it skipping).
- a mechanical issue (if there's any tight spots or debris on the X screw or rails it can cause skipping).

Based on the litany of niggles you seem to be having, it might be worth considering abandoning carving all manner of pretty for a while and instead grabbing some stock, learning some basic G and M-codes (in particular G00, G01, G90/91, G3 and G5 with their associated parameters eg S and F) and using the MDI interface in Mach3 to do some systematic testing of loading it up in each axis and seeing where things are going wrong. Just a slightly more systematic approach, trying one thing at a time, is going to highlight issues faster than running a full job and getting to this fairly unhelpful (to you) point of "something went wrong but I've no idea of what actually caused it)".

[dharmic]

No worries.

The MDI interface is the second tab on Mach 3's standard screens. Down toward the bottom is a big text box where you can enter G codes directly. VERY handy for manually positioning the tool, restarting the spindle after a panic stop before you restart the job from a particular line, blah blah blah. I even use it in incremental mode (ie the coordinates you enter in the G codes are distances to travel rather than absolute positions) to do swim-lane style surfacing sometimes when I can't be bothered using the Mach3 wizard or using CAM to generate the tool paths.

[Sterob]

IMHO, fix mechanical issues first, then look everywhere else....
Sometimes Chinese machines don't run the steppers at their optimum voltage.
At stepper can run at 48 V and yet they only use a 24V power supply.
The closer to max voltage you run, the more positive each' step' is and least chance of missing any.

[Mmpie]

My PSU was at fault for a few unexpected gdhdkdksndhdjsk (I could swear just thinking about it)

I do have a few tight spots along the travels but the stock PSU just wouldn't deliver the power to move over them, until it eventually set on fire. Replaced with an 800w 48v supply and all problems magically disappeared. Well they didn't, the underlying issue is still there but doesn't cause any trouble now at all.

The few issues I do still have, which are very rare, are interference/ground loop or some other Harry Potter type wizardry which I don't really understand. They're few and far between and particularly since I've got this skyfire the OMIO is only doing very simple and basic stuff now so I've opted to just live with them.

Also the X axis ballscrew was seriously overtightened on mine from factory and loosening that off a bit made the whole thing a lot smoother. But the damage to the keeper bearing had been done, still not got around to swapping it yet.


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[DarbyOhara]

I have a few newbie questions I hope someone can help me with. Apologize if they are really elementary, but hey, we all started somewhere... lol. I purchased a Chinese CNC6040 off of ebay and I am patiently waiting for it to arrive. I am new to CNC routing and this will be my first encounter. Of course many of the ebay ads are limited in info or broken english. So I am working through many issues that I need to know prior. So here are my few questions:

1. The CNC6040 I purchased comes with a ER11 collet. I google this and I can't seem to get an simple answer. Is it my understanding that the ER11 can accept either or both a router bit that is 1/8 or 1/4 inch shaft? Or do I need to acquire different collets for different shaft sizes?

2. As we know these chinese kits come with a pirated copy of Mach3. A few folks suggest to scrap that and purchase a registered copy of Mach3 (which I think is around $175). If I do that, then I must setup the program for my controller. But researching, each controller may have different settings. Can someone tell me which controller I am getting and where to find those Mach3 settings. Here is my ebay purchase:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1500W-VFD-4...53.m2749.l2649

3. Lastly, is anyone using Vetric Vcarve Desktop for their creation with their chinese CNC. I realize that Vcarve creates toolpath files. My additional question is, can Mach3 read those toolpath files and must a create Mach3 settings in addition to what the Vcarve toolpath settings were? Or do I just open the toolpath file in Mach3 and hit "go"? I am a little confused on that. I plan to invest in Vcarve Desktop since many are using it and it looks so great to work with.

Any help would be greatly appreciated....

[Mmpie]

1. ER11 can hold up to 7mm I think. The collets snap in the nut and hold the tool. They come in half sizes from 1mm to 7mm.

2. I'm still running the version I got, no problems at all. But if you want your own then you just install mach3 the way the instructions tell you to with all the settings and then just put your licence code in.

3. Never used any vectric software but yes that's the idea. V-carve will create the code and Mach3 will read that code and tell the machine what to do. As a simple analogy, think of it like a barcode. Some software (vectric) creates the barcode, the scanner (mach3) reads the barcode and tells the till (machine) what's what.


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[Sterob]

3. You can use Vetric Softare to create the drawing AND produce 1 or more Tool Paths for each job. You then send the Tool Path(s) to Mach 3 which creates the G Codeto drive the Router.
You can start with simpler software like Cut 2D and when you get a handle on that and/or you outgrow it, you can upgrade relatively cheaply to more sofisticated incarnations.
I've been playing for 4 years and have not outgrown Cut2D yet.....

[DarbyOhara]

1. ER11 can hold up to 7mm I think. The collets snap in the nut and hold the tool. They come in half sizes from 1mm to 7mm.

2. I'm still running the version I got, no problems at all. But if you want your own then you just install mach3 the way the instructions tell you to with all the settings and then just put your licence code in.

3. Never used any vectric software but yes that's the idea. V-carve will create the code and Mach3 will read that code and tell the machine what to do. As a simple analogy, think of it like a barcode. Some software (vectric) creates the barcode, the scanner (mach3) reads the barcode and tells the till (machine) what's what.


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Thanks so much for the fast reply.... a followup

1. So again, I would need to acquire a different collet for 1/8" shaft bit and a different one for a 1/4", or am I confused more?

2. If the Mach3 that comes with mine work out of the box.. I see no sense in purchasing a registered copy.

3. Perhaps I should take this question to the vectric forum or the gurus... but I was hoping for a bit more understanding of the programs. Again, if I create a toolpath file(s) in Vcarve and open it in Mach3... would I still need to set anything in Mach3, or is the Mach3 program totally reliant on the toolpath file(s)? Looking at screenshots of the Mach3, it looks very complex and I'd rather just open the file and hit go and expect everything set from the vcarve toolpath file. The only thing I would need is to zero the X Y & Z and ensure the proper tool bit is installed. Is this all correct?

[DarbyOhara]

3. You can use Vetric Softare to create the drawing AND produce 1 or more Tool Paths for each job. You then send the Tool Path(s) to Mach 3 which creates the G Codeto drive the Router.
You can start with simpler software like Cut 2D and when you get a handle on that and/or you outgrow it, you can upgrade relatively cheaply to more sofisticated incarnations.
I've been playing for 4 years and have not outgrown Cut2D yet.....

Great point about the upgrade... I will look into that. However, my understanding is that the Cut2D can't do 3D carvings. I am looking forward to doing these as I learn (and make mistakes... lol.)

Ok, so when I open a toolpath file in Mach3, it creates the Gcode... which has ALL the settings from the Vcarve I created? If that is correct, great! Thanks again so much. I did try to use the search on this forum, but when it found threads of my search words, it showed me the thread, but some threads are so large, it was impossible to find what I search for page after page. So I thought I'd ask here. Appreciate your help and patience.