[hughesbros]

Yes and people are pushing for backup on the user side with out having to save each files . Files used with in 15 days are keeped user side too .


Tony

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just like to add, you can increase the 15 day offline cache if you want to. Also you can import\export f3d files but it's not as straightforward as save and open. There are some restrictions with exported files though, you can't make a 2d drawing without saving to the cloud and you can't insert other parts. You can have an assembly with as many components as you like but they have to all be created in that one design.

Mark.

[magicniner]

Just like to add, you can increase the 15 day offline cache if you want to.

Can it be set to a permanent cache of all work?
On several occasions I've needed access to an old project when I had no internet access,

- Nick

[hughesbros]

It looks like the max is 360 days. In Fusion right click on your name, select Preferences and it's under general settings

Mark.

[tony978]

Just like to add, you can increase the 15 day offline cache if you want to. Also you can import\export f3d files but it's not as straightforward as save and open. There are some restrictions with exported files though, you can't make a 2d drawing without saving to the cloud and you can't insert other parts. You can have an assembly with as many components as you like but they have to all be created in that one design.

Mark.

Mark All models do not have to be created in one file , you make a part then open a new design save it then go to the file you want to insert and right click on it from there you can insert it to your curent drawing . the inserted file is linked so if you update it in other drawings that use the part you will be notified that part changed and you can update it .

tony

[hughesbros]

I was talking about files you export not ones you save to the cloud. If you go to the top component in a design you can export as an f3d file to your file system, then you can use Create Design form file to open that file. Done like this you can avoid any saves to the cloud if you need to, for NDAs for example. The only problem is like I said you can not make a 2d drawing without saving to the cloud, the same applies to inserting parts. If you start a new part and try to insert another design before a save you get an error telling you have to save the file before you can insert parts.

The files saved to your file system can have as many components as you like, they just have to be made in that design.

Mark

[SBC Cycle]

Is there No Fusion 360 Forum on the Zone??

There is but that probably isn't the proper place for this discussion either.

"Uncategorised CAM Discussion" probably is though.

Not that the discussion bothers me at all but A CAM vs. B CAM conversations can be distracting and tend to get off track when in a CAM specific sub forum. Carry on

[Jon.N.CNC]

Advantages of bobcad over fusion 360.. Fusion 360 is a pretty scaled down version of Hsm and it's free where as bobcad isn't, bobcad is more technical but then the full Hsm cam in inventor wins this argument hands down.

So if your going to pay for cam then go for inventor Hsm if you can.

[BurrMan]

Advantages of bobcad over fusion 360.. Fusion 360 is a pretty scaled down version of Hsm and it's free where as bobcad isn't, bobcad is more technical but then the full Hsm cam in inventor wins this argument hands down.

So if your going to pay for cam then go for inventor Hsm if you can.

I'm a little confused by this post. First off, Fusion 360 is a pretty bad ash modeler that blows doors on a lot of it's competition. So you MUST just be referring to its CAM implementations....

With that said, I was wondering how you get HSMWorks blows doors? WHats your experience with BobCads current CAM implementation? I have a full license which gives me access to some very powerful toolpaths and aiming them at a 3 axis machine on top of them... Would you care to discuss what you can do in HSM Works that my multiaxis toolpaths cant do? I mean, if you are comparing with only knowledge of V22 or V23 or V24 or something, like a lot of users are limited to, then I would understand.....

[hughesbros]

Advantages of bobcad over fusion 360.. Fusion 360 is a pretty scaled down version of Hsm and it's free where as bobcad isn't, bobcad is more technical but then the full Hsm cam in inventor wins this argument hands down.

So if your going to pay for cam then go for inventor Hsm if you can.

I think your info is out of date, a few month ago they leveled the playing field between the 2 versions of Fusion so now the basic version will have all the 3d toolpaths available in HSMWorks + Lathe. In the future the Ultimate version will have full 5 axis and all the other options available in HSMWorks anything that's added to HSMWorks take a couple of months before it shows up in Fusion.

Also if you qualify for the free version you get Fusion Ultimate so you will have all the features of HSMWorks. Here's a link with some info on what's available in each version.Autodesk Fusion 360 changes to benefits FAQ | Fusion 360 | Autodesk Knowledge Network

Mark

[mmoe]

I think your info is out of date, a few month ago they leveled the playing field between the 2 versions of Fusion so now the basic version will have all the 3d toolpaths available in HSMWorks + Lathe. In the future the Ultimate version will have full 5 axis and all the other options available in HSMWorks anything that's added to HSMWorks take a couple of months before it shows up in Fusion.

Also if you qualify for the free version you get Fusion Ultimate so you will have all the features of HSMWorks. Here's a link with some info on what's available in each version.Autodesk Fusion 360 changes to benefits FAQ | Fusion 360 | Autodesk Knowledge Network

Mark

I don't think they are going to include all of the toolpaths available in HSM Works Pro. Most likely it will be limited to the "3+2" 5 axis plus a single 5 axis simultaneous strategy, but they haven't been specific yet. That is one of the main reasons I bought Fusion, just in case I need multiaxis down the road. I don't think there is another 5 axis software available for under $2000, even if I add that to what I pay for Bobcad, so at the introductory $300/year for Fusion I could not pass that up. Because they have bumped the entry level Fusion up to the same as Ultimate until they bring the 5 axis in, they also gave me an additional year subscription for free, so I'm now good until the end of 2016 for $300 total starting last December. I don't think they will have anything like the 5 axis options in Bobcad, though we are talking about a significant price difference there and not a very fair (for Fusion) comparison. If you need basic multiaxis or 5 axis capabilities, Fusion would have an edge in that category compared to Bobcad, but if you do primarily 3 axis work, Bobcad will probably maintain a significant edge there. If you need more advanced 5 axis strategies, I suspect that Bobcad is already more advanced than HSM Works Pro, and because HSM does not appear to use Module Works based on the fundamental differences in how the toolpaths look (InventorCAM which is Module Works based is not the same as HSM Works), they will have a hard time keeping up with Bobcad and other Module Works based applications.

When it comes to value, I think Bobcad will always have it's primary niche at the 3 Axis Pro level. Outside of Fusion, I have not found another product that has half as much capability for the money (at least as the street price for 3 Axis Pro, which is a lot less than their list price).

[hughesbros]

, but if you do primarily 3 axis work, Bobcad will probably maintain a significant edge there.

Did you mean 5 axis here.

And just a note on Module works. I've used SprutCAM and it uses Module Works as well but it's calculation times are a lot faster than Bobcad, do you think they sell different levels of their code?

Mark

[BurrMan]

I've used SprutCAM and it uses Module Works as well but it's calculation times are a lot faster than Bobcad

Mark

thats quite an interesting statement! But surely you must be reffering to stl models only. And there are reasons for that that wouldnt shine beautiful light on sprut.

[mmoe]

Did you mean 5 axis here.

And just a note on Module works. I've used SprutCAM and it uses Module Works as well but it's calculation times are a lot faster than Bobcad, do you think they sell different levels of their code?

Mark

No, I meant 3 axis. Bobcad 3 Axis Mill Pro has more 2 and 3 axis toolpath variations and features than Fusion will even when Fusion Ultimate has it's CAM fully implemented. I own both, and I can say that Bobcad is simply the more feature rich CAM product for 2 and 3 axis work. If you need 4th axis, "3+2" 5 axis or very basic 5 axis, then Fusion Ultimate is probably the best value on the planet when they get around to adding those features, but for now they don't exist. If you need high end 4 and 5 axis motion using morphing type toolpaths, then Bobcad again has an advantage as compared to Fusion, which I don't believe will have morphed 4 or 5 axis strategies, however Bobcad with 4 and 5 axis morphing toolpaths is much more expensive than Fusion Ultimate as well. I don't think they currently are available in HSM Works Pro, which has every toolpath that HSM/Autodesk has been able to develop included, so if it's not there, it won't be in Fusion for sure. If it is in HSM Pro, I'm not aware of it, but that is entirely possible, so it would be good if someone who has used HSM Pro could elaborate on the types of multiaxis strategies available in HSM Works Pro. (Edit: I just googled and it looks like HSM Pro does have a morphing feature, but I will probably have a heart attack if it shows up in Fusion Ultimate for the price they are asking! I really would not recommend anyone get their hopes up.)

Bobcad is on the slower side for calc times, but for most jobs I don't really have an issue with that. I'd like to see them implement better use of modern multicore processors. Currently, the few operations that do use multicore only do so for a small portion of the time they calculate. I'm not 100% sure, since I'm not a developer, but my impression is that Module Works is a CAM kernel that generates code based off of mesh models (I believe why it outputs STL files from the simulation), and since Bobcad is working as a solid modeler, it has to essentially create a mesh model from the solid model every time you do a calculation.

From Module Works:

The ModuleWorks 3-Axis machining CAD/CAM component provides a wide range of 3-Axis Machining toolpaths offering gouge free machining on triangle/mesh based models. Strategies include Roughing, Rest-Roughing, and [a] range of powerful finishing strategies.

If SprutCAM is a mesh-based system (I think it is?), it would eliminate the need to translate solid to mesh on demand, which would seem like it would speed the calculation process up quite a lot. However, you would be stuck with the resolution of the specific model as you imported it only, or a lesser resolution. If you needed to tighten up a tolerance, you'd first have to go back to your source, export a higher resolution mesh model, then bring that into Sprut. With Bobcad, you are working off of solid models that have not been dumbed down into meshes yet, so I believe that the tolerance of the mesh used to calculate the toolpath remains a variable until the last moment, when the calculation occurs. By not working in Module Works native mesh, Bobcad is making the translation more difficult and therefor more time involved, but they are also leaving the system a true solid modeling format. I'm not super familiar with Sprut, but when I was looking into it, I recall having to do a lot of translating to meshes. I don't recall being able to bring a solid in directly, but I could be wrong or my info could be out of date as it's been a while.

Calculation of toolpaths in Fusion seems to be similar in methods to Bobcad, but I have to admit that I like the speed of Fusion a lot and hope Bobcad gets there someday. A calc that takes 5 minutes in Bobcad (that's a pretty major calc on my computer) only takes about 30 seconds in Fusion and is done in the background anyways so you can continue working. In reality, that's not a huge difference in your daily routine, but it does feel snappy. I doubt I'd get any more actual cutting done in a day if Bobcad were faster, with the rare exception when I throw something exceptionally difficult at it that currently takes hours to calculate, but that really is a rarity (once every few months).

[hughesbros]

Sprut works with surfaces or meshes. When you set an op up you have 2 options 1 fast calculation where it converts the surfaces to a mesh, you can set the tolerance for each op. The second is supposed to work directly off the NURBs surfaces and takes longer to calculate. The fast calculation is quite accurate and fast. The surface version takes a bit more time but it's still fast.

What I didn't like about Sprut is if you have a part that you need to turn, mill and wire erode you have to have a file for each so keeping all the files up to date was a nightmare. When Bobcad v27 came out I bought that as you can do it all in one file. It Just seems odd that setting up the same part in both, Sprut calculates the tool path quicker, may be I've got something set different some where.

Mark

[BurrMan]

Did you know you can change the tolerance of the calc in BobCad? The default is pretty tight. Taking a look at the model at hand, a 2 hour calculation can be dropped to seconds with a very small change in that number......

[Jon.N.CNC]

I'm a little confused by this post. First off, Fusion 360 is a pretty bad ash modeler that blows doors on a lot of it's competition. So you MUST just be referring to its CAM implementations....

With that said, I was wondering how you get HSMWorks blows doors? WHats your experience with BobCads current CAM implementation? I have a full license which gives me access to some very powerful toolpaths and aiming them at a 3 axis machine on top of them... Would you care to discuss what you can do in HSM Works that my multiaxis toolpaths cant do? I mean, if you are comparing with only knowledge of V22 or V23 or V24 or something, like a lot of users are limited to, then I would understand.....

Why so confused burr? This post is comparing a piece of cam software with a cad cam, so yes I'm comparing the cam. Cad is not being compared here as far as I'm aware?

Why Hsm pro (not 360) beats bobcad? Well I'd say it's much faster to create toolpaths, learning curve is about 1/8th of bobcad, simulation crash detection is much better, tool library/setup is better layed out, it creates professional looking setup sheets and most of all it is user friendly and looks great on screen. But this is my opinion, Bobcam may be your preference but end of the day a cad cam solution will always potentially be a faster route from idea to part if that is ever a requirement, purely due to better intergration, with no translation of formats, Switching of software etc

Fusion 360 ultimate, ok I hadn't heard of this but I can say I regularily have conversations with my autodesk representative about saving money who will openly tell me that if I do not require certain functions to close the membership and go with the free version of fusion 360, but he makes it pretty clear that if I want these functions it is autodesks business model to offer the free versions to increase interest in the full version. giving away full functionality for free isn't going to happen, infact I would be fuming if they did having spent a lot of money on it. So keep on dreaming guys.

I think your info is out of date, a few month ago they leveled the playing field between the 2 versions of Fusion so now the basic version will have all the 3d toolpaths available in HSMWorks + Lathe. In the future the Ultimate version will have full 5 axis and all the other options available in HSMWorks anything that's added to HSMWorks take a couple of months before it shows up in Fusion.

Also if you qualify for the free version you get Fusion Ultimate so you will have all the features of HSMWorks. Here's a link with some info on what's available in each version.Autodesk Fusion 360 changes to benefits FAQ | Fusion 360 | Autodesk Knowledge Network

Mark

Hi mark, thanks for the link, yes it says it has some of the functionality of Hsm works being added and list of just a few gives it away really as what it doesn't tell you is that there are infact many versions of hsmworks, I'm now on my third version, the pro version.

If I find the same functionality is one day made free, I for one would cancel my license imediately, and pretty sure many would follow suit so it would be pretty poor business sense.

[jrmach]

what version of BoB are you basing your statesmen on?
Also are using 3 axis pro with the multi axis add on ?
It is unclear what kind of Apples you are comparing.

[Jon.N.CNC]

what version of BoB are you basing your statesmen on?
Also are using 3 axis pro with the multi axis add on ?
It is unclear what kind of Apples you are comparing.

Wow just looked at their website, bobcam seems to have moved on a fair bit since I trialed, with intergrated cam. Sorry guys didn't think it was that long ago.

Well ignore my statements up to now but I'd say for learning if you have neither, autodesk products give explanations of what each function does on a mouse over which is real handy. Does anyone know if bobcam now does this?

[jrmach]

yeah,it's not your grandfathers oldsmobile anymore

[BurrMan]

Why so confused burr? This post is comparing a piece of cam software with a cad cam, so yes I'm comparing the cam. Cad is not being compared here as far as I'm aware?
.

Well, a couple reasons. First, the thread is comparing Fusion 360 with BobCad. So CAD is most definitely being compared here. But since, you have made a post that had me re-read your original post, which tells me you are comparing a separate program in the mix (Although Fusions CAM is HSM Works.) So more confusion there

Then this:

Advantages of bobcad over fusion 360.. Fusion 360 is a pretty scaled down version of Hsm and it's free where as bobcad isn't, bobcad is more technical but then the full Hsm cam in inventor wins this argument hands down.

So if your going to pay for cam then go for inventor Hsm if you can.

So again, kindof mixing 3 different applications threw me, because the initial start of that sentence is "advantages of BobCad over 360" then it mentions costs, then it suggests buying 2 completely separate programs (Which by the way, throws any cost scenario out the window,,,,lol)

Then followed by:

Why Hsm pro (not 360) beats bobcad? Well I'd say it's much faster to create toolpaths, learning curve is about 1/8th of bobcad, simulation crash detection is much better, tool library/setup is better layed out, it creates professional looking setup sheets and most of all it is user friendly and looks great on screen. But this is my opinion, Bobcam may be your preference but end of the day a cad cam solution will always potentially be a faster route from idea to part if that is ever a requirement, purely due to better intergration, with no translation of formats, Switching of software etc

Fusion 360 ultimate, ok I hadn't heard of this but I can say I regularily have conversations with my autodesk representative about saving money who will openly tell me that if I do not require certain functions to close the membership and go with the free version of fusion 360, but he makes it pretty clear that if I want these functions it is autodesks business model to offer the free versions to increase interest in the full version. giving away full functionality for free isn't going to happen, infact I would be fuming if they did having spent a lot of money on it. So keep on dreaming guys.



Hi mark, thanks for the link, yes it says it has some of the functionality of Hsm works being added and list of just a few gives it away really as what it doesn't tell you is that there are infact many versions of hsmworks, I'm now on my third version, the pro version.

If I find the same functionality is one day made free, I for one would cancel my license imediately, and pretty sure many would follow suit so it would be pretty poor business sense

It's a nice opinion, and valid for you.... But, you having an opinion as to what you like doesn't mean "BobCad doesn't have that"..... So, it appeared to me you were basing your statements and comparison out of a lack of knowledge of one of the party's being compared?

I mean, Simulation? Mine is pretty powerful! (I don't think you have experience with BobCads new sim) Crash detection etc, etc..... I think "PREFERENCE" comes into play here. But "Pretty" isn't a hands down.....Just a preference.

Easy to create toolpaths? Not sure whats so hard about creating toolpaths here.... I guess we could count clicks? I can create all my toolpaths and boundries and depths right off the 3d model... It's not going to be much different....

Pro setup sheets? Huh? I can generate setup sheets and they are XML and Stylesheet based. Can make them look any way I want... Nothing "Amateur" about the default one though... Maybe we should compare setup sheets?

So then this:

Bobcam may be your preference but end of the day a cad cam solution will always potentially be a faster route from idea to part if that is ever a requirement, purely due to better intergration, with no translation of formats, Switching of software etc

Confusing again because BobCad "IS" a cad/cam solution, but everything about your post seems to be saying "Buy this 3rd party CAM solution, and this separate CAD solution, at the end of the day"...... So again, it's a curious and confusing post for me....

But it seems like maybe you were just going off of memory of some trial years ago?

Or if its just a preference on how things "look", well that's a factor for everybody. But that again isn't a "hands down". Like you said, it's just your personal preference....