[tar356]

Time to start a new project.

I recently acquired this BP (not sure what year it is yet), and plan to do a mild restoration and controller upgrade. It's actually nicer in person than pics show. I've been scouring the CNCzone archives and found a lot of information about a variety of retrofit/conversions. Seems most of the threads are a few years old. Anyone currently upgrading their BP??

I don't have some lofty goal of trying to make a modern VMC (out of a 30+ year old BP) with 200ipm rapids, etc. etc... I'm fully aware of this machines abilities and inabilities, and where it's place will be within my little shop. That being said, my initial plans are:

1. A thorough cleaning/inspection - repair/replace as necessary.

2. Paint.

3. Here's the area of debate - I want to reuse the original steppers (they do work nicely), and add a new power supply and controller.

The controller I want to use is the new Centroid Acorn. That leaves drives/power supplies to be determined. Seems that some are more than happy with Geckos, others swear by these; https://www.automationtechnologiesin...stepper-drive/ ....any others?

4. Possibly replace the AC spindle motor/vari speed assembly with a servo of some sort and 1:1 pulleys - to be determined.

Any info or opinions would be appreciated!



Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

[triumph406]

I would look at Linuxcnc, mainly because of good support in the Linuxcnc community, and there's plenty of BP linuxcnc conversions out there.

Also you might want to look at AC servos, new servos from China are very cheap, and reliable enough to be worthy of attention.

Good luck!!

btw that way in the picture looks to be in mint shape, I think you've got a good machine there

[tar356]

btw that way in the picture looks to be in mint shape, I think you've got a good machine there

Thx!

Todd
Orange, Ca

[tar356]

A couple of other questions:

1. I've been searching for a parts manual online, but not having much luck...it seems these mills have various names? What is the official name? Series 1 Interact? Boss 5?

2. Until I can find a manual....Inside the front cover for the quill, I see the two limit switches on the right for the Z travel. There also looks to be a third smaller switch mounted in the upper left with an adjustable "stop"?? Here's a picture (not of my mill, but similar). What is that switch for?

Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

[mactec54]

A couple of other questions:

1. I've been searching for a parts manual online, but not having much luck...it seems these mills have various names? What is the official name? Series 1 Interact? Boss 5?

2. Until I can find a manual....Inside the front cover for the quill, I see the two limit switches on the right for the Z travel. There also looks to be a third smaller switch mounted in the upper left with an adjustable "stop"?? Here's a picture (not of my mill, but similar). What is that switch for?

Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

If you are redoing everything you only need the 2 switches, what is the Timing Pulley Ratio, this is easy to check on the Y axes, a series 1 Interact, this is it's official name Interact, most of the parts are all the same as the Boss series, so to find out what model Boss it is similar too, we would need to know the axes drive ratio, the Interacts where built by Adcock and Shipley which was a subsidiary of Bridgeport

[tar356]

If you are redoing everything you only need the 2 switches, what is the Timing Pulley Ratio, this is easy to check on the Y axes, a series 1 Interact, this is it's official name Interact, most of the parts are all the same as the Boss series, so to find out what model Boss it is similar too, we would need to know the axes drive ratio, the Interacts where built by Adcock and Shipley which was a subsidiary of Bridgeport

Thanks mactec...

Ratio is 1:1.

Todd
Orange, CA

[tar356]

Ok, am I missing something???

Trying to get the top pulley cover off of the head, and can't seem to figure out why it won't come off? I have the top bearing cover off, the 5 cap screws around the perimeter removed and the front variable speed panel removed...seems like something is still holding it...it wiggles a bit but won't come off.

Thanks...

Todd
Orange, CA

[Marty_Escarcega]

Time to start a new project.

I recently acquired this BP (not sure what year it is yet), and plan to do a mild restoration and controller upgrade. It's actually nicer in person than pics show. I've been scouring the CNCzone archives and found a lot of information about a variety of retrofit/conversions. Seems most of the threads are a few years old. Anyone currently upgrading their BP??

I don't have some lofty goal of trying to make a modern VMC (out of a 30+ year old BP) with 200ipm rapids, etc. etc... I'm fully aware of this machines abilities and inabilities, and where it's place will be within my little shop. That being said, my initial plans are:

1. A thorough cleaning/inspection - repair/replace as necessary.

2. Paint.

3. Here's the area of debate - I want to reuse the original steppers (they do work nicely), and add a new power supply and controller.

The controller I want to use is the new Centroid Acorn. That leaves drives/power supplies to be determined. Seems that some are more than happy with Geckos, others swear by these; https://www.automationtechnologiesin...stepper-drive/ ....any others?

4. Possibly replace the AC spindle motor/vari speed assembly with a servo of some sort and 1:1 pulleys - to be determined.

Any info or opinions would be appreciated!



Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

I believe your choice of Centroid ACORN CNC to be a good one. Industrial grade motion controller with true encoder input, also can control a VFD with a 0-10VDC analog output and comes with basic software for under $300.

The concern is the old steppers. If they are still in good shape, whether or not they can be used with the Geckodrive.
Acorn CNC controller, Step and Direction 4 axis CNC Control board with ethernet communication.

I refitted a knee mill with a VS head, and just used a Teco VFD and set the speed at about 1:1. Let the control take it from there.

I have a freind with an older BOSS Stepper driven mill. He fitted it with Acorn, but I can't remember if he was using different Stepper motors. I will check.

Marty

[Marty_Escarcega]

Time to start a new project.

I recently acquired this BP (not sure what year it is yet), and plan to do a mild restoration and controller upgrade. It's actually nicer in person than pics show. I've been scouring the CNCzone archives and found a lot of information about a variety of retrofit/conversions. Seems most of the threads are a few years old. Anyone currently upgrading their BP??

I don't have some lofty goal of trying to make a modern VMC (out of a 30+ year old BP) with 200ipm rapids, etc. etc... I'm fully aware of this machines abilities and inabilities, and where it's place will be within my little shop. That being said, my initial plans are:

1. A thorough cleaning/inspection - repair/replace as necessary.

2. Paint.

3. Here's the area of debate - I want to reuse the original steppers (they do work nicely), and add a new power supply and controller.

The controller I want to use is the new Centroid Acorn. That leaves drives/power supplies to be determined. Seems that some are more than happy with Geckos, others swear by these; https://www.automationtechnologiesin...stepper-drive/ ....any others?

4. Possibly replace the AC spindle motor/vari speed assembly with a servo of some sort and 1:1 pulleys - to be determined.

Any info or opinions would be appreciated!



Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

I believe your choice of Centroid ACORN CNC to be a good one. Industrial grade motion controller with true encoder input with software for under $300.
The concern is the old steppers. If they are still in good shape, whether or not they can be used with the Geckodrive.
Acorn CNC controller, Step and Direction 4 axis CNC Control board with ethernet communication.

I have a freind with an older BOSS Stepper driven mill. He fitted it with Acorn, but I can't remember if he was using different Stepper motors. I will check.

Marty

[Marty_Escarcega]

I checked with my friend, here is what he had to say:
" The old ones may work well if they didn't get too hot over the years.
Mine were weakened and sometimes stalled. If he has the Gecko drives, just try them out and see how well they work."

He replaced his motors.

Marty

[SchortBus]

Just finished and successfully tested my BOSS 4 retrofit using OEM steppers, outside of terrible abuse - they should be fine. Gecko 203v matched with proper power supply can get the steppers moving with plenty of torque / holding power. Odds are most BOSS mills spent most of time broken down, unused thanks to worst OEM controls ever foisted upon the free world.

Built using Antek 56v 1500w power supply w/ 24v addon, Gecko 203v drives and MASSO controller. Plan to post pics, show off the MASSO soon - highly recommend that device over mach. MASSO blows mach away, set it up in few hours really - no programming / macros required. Subroutines supported if desired, yada, yada, yada. Their support was great - although biggest issue was not believing it really was that easy, it is. The invert option for axis setup / homing is freakin awesome.

[Marty_Escarcega]

Just finished and successfully tested my BOSS 4 retrofit using OEM steppers, outside of terrible abuse - they should be fine. Gecko 203v matched with proper power supply can get the steppers moving with plenty of torque / holding power. Odds are most BOSS mills spent most of time broken down, unused thanks to worst OEM controls ever foisted upon the free world.

Built using Antek 56v 1500w power supply w/ 24v addon, Gecko 203v drives and MASSO controller. Plan to post pics, show off the MASSO soon - highly recommend that device over mach. MASSO blows mach away, set it up in few hours really - no programming / macros required. Subroutines supported if desired, yada, yada, yada. Their support was great - although biggest issue was not believing it really was that easy, it is. The invert option for axis setup / homing is freakin awesome.

Good to hear. Do you have a drawing of how you hooked up your original steppers from the G203V drives? I seem to recall there are terminals under the cover on the Boss steppers.
Nice to hear you had good luck with Masso

Marty

[tar356]

Good to hear. Do you have a drawing of how you hooked up your original steppers from the G203V drives? I seem to recall there are terminals under the cover on the Boss steppers.
Nice to hear you had good luck with Masso

Marty

Thanks for the replies Marty and Schortbus...

I would like to see a wiring diagram too.

I’m open to other drivers as well, just seems that the two I mentioned are the most common I’ve read about. With regards to Gecko, there appears to be a few models that would work?? Maybe a call to Gecko tomorrow.

Appreciate the info and keep it comin, i’m gonna need it!

Todd
Orange, Ca

ps - Marty, great videos about the Acorn, thx.

[SchortBus]

Good to hear. Do you have a drawing of how you hooked up your original steppers from the G203V drives? I seem to recall there are terminals under the cover on the Boss steppers.
Nice to hear you had good luck with Masso

Marty

Quick explanation of 6-wire BOSS Steppers with OEM wires to 4-wire drive - use wires 1 (solid white) 3 (white/red) for step and wires 2 (white / green) and 4 (white / black) for direction. Cap wires 5 and 6 - white w/ blue and white w/ yellow stripes individually.

I'm not electrician but there is a way to determine this on own with multimeter if needed - not hard, don't overthink it. Basically 1/3 and 2/4 should have equal OHMs (15ohm IIRC) 1/5 and 2/6 OHM reading will be halved (7.5 iirc), Check by validating 'OL' between 1/2 and 1/4 (check for OL between the two sides / coils) - about only thing can do wrong here is cross poles - that makes the magic $moke. Always ensure OL between coils before applying power - beyond that any stepper error would only affect the movement / direction.

Thats 1/3 to step and 2/4 to direction. That's it really - for any 4-wire drive. With the MASSO doesn't matter if travel goes wrong way, just hit spacebar to invert in setup. Others may require flipping wires 1/3 or 2/4. Apologies - I'll be posting pics and and description of my mill rebuild soon. Pretty busy - damn thing was down for 3 months after mach crashed.

[Jim Dawson]

The small switch should be the Z home switch. The other two are the travel limits.

I agree with Mactec54, nothing wrong with Windows for the CNC operator interface. However, using Windows for direct machine control, like Mach3, is not the best system. Windows needs to communicate with a dedicated controller (motion controller/PLC) that actually runs the machine.

[tar356]

Ok, time to start thinking about a power supply for the steppers...

Antek seems to be the brand of choice for most of the project/builds I've read about. Heading over to the Antek site, under 1500 watt supplies, they list quite a few. Is it safe to say that as long as I stay under the voltage limit of the driver (80v), I can choose any of the voltages shown? They list; 77, 73, 70, 67, 63, 56v, etc. They all seem to have enough amperage.

Thoughts??

Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

[Marty_Escarcega]

Ok, time to start thinking about a power supply for the steppers...

Antek seems to be the brand of choice for most of the project/builds I've read about. Heading over to the Antek site, under 1500 watt supplies, they list quite a few. Is it safe to say that as long as I stay under the voltage limit of the driver (80v), I can choose any of the voltages shown? They list; 77, 73, 70, 67, 63, 56v, etc. They all seem to have enough amperage.

Thoughts??

Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

What is the current draw of the stepper motors in the configuration you plan to drive them at? I would think staying near 70-73 would be fine. 77 might be a little close.

Marty

[tar356]

What is the current draw of the stepper motors in the configuration you plan to drive them at? I would think staying near 70-73 would be fine. 77 might be a little close.

Marty

This is the area where I need some education/advice...there is a lot of debate whether to wire the Sigma steppers in series or parallel.

If I understand correctly, the motors are currently wired in series drawing about 8.2 amps at 56v????....that sound about right anyone???

So, it seems that those using Gecko drivers set them at their max of 7 amp and roll with it. I noticed that "Schortbus" mentions he used a 56v power supply, another used 70v.

I would really like to see more of the various set ups that people have used (videos would be great!), and what sort of overall performance they are getting.

Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

ps - After posting this, I remembered this driver power supply combo...maybe this might be a better option?

https://www.automationtechnologiesin...stepper-drive/

[Marty_Escarcega]

This is the area where I need some education/advice...there is a lot of debate whether to wire the Sigma steppers in series or parallel.

If I understand correctly, the motors are currently wired in series drawing about 8.2 amps at 56v????....that sound about right anyone???

So, it seems that those using Gecko drivers set them at their max of 7 amp and roll with it. I noticed that "Schortbus" mentions he used a 56v power supply, another used 70v.

I would really like to see more of the various set ups that people have used (videos would be great!), and what sort of overall performance they are getting.

Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

ps - After posting this, I remembered this driver power supply combo...maybe this might be a better option?

https://www.automationtechnologiesin...stepper-drive/

You know what? I would buy one of those drives from Automation Technologies and try it on an axis. If it works, buy the other 2. Money ahead, no external power supply.
That would interface well with Centroid's Acorn motion controller too. :-)

[SchortBus]

This is the area where I need some education/advice...there is a lot of debate whether to wire the Sigma steppers in series or parallel.

If I understand correctly, the motors are currently wired in series drawing about 8.2 amps at 56v????....that sound about right anyone???

So, it seems that those using Gecko drivers set them at their max of 7 amp and roll with it. I noticed that "Schortbus" mentions he used a 56v power supply, another used 70v.

I would really like to see more of the various set ups that people have used (videos would be great!), and what sort of overall performance they are getting.

Thanks,

Todd
Orange, CA

ps - After posting this, I remembered this driver power supply combo...maybe this might be a better option?

https://www.automationtechnologiesin...stepper-drive/

Yup - run mine parallel at 56v - pull is about 6.5a during max accel / rapid way mine are set up. 2x accel and 100ipm max. Missed some steps at 120 ipm w/ microstep drives - dialing it back smoothed it out, improved finish and actually sped things up - so best result wins. Antec is the place for cnc power supplies - save time, buy once. They make hookup / install as easy as possible too. Those all in one drives are highly input voltage sensitve and seem to be a little light duty for heavy duty machine like BOSS IMO. Antec supply can easily handle normal ups / downs of input voltage and output demands of the steppers. Antec is also Made in USA, so are Geckos. Just my .02

The ball screws on x,y,z are 5:2 - 5 twists per inch w/ 2 balls (starts) = .200 per revolution. Fine calibration may result in 0.199874, 0.200013, etc.