[jim_cliff11]

Thanks for the reply Tom.
Found the documentation for Kflop, in which it mentions power can be taken from a pc power supply:

This connector is a standard PC-disk drive power connector which makes it easy to drive the board with an inexpensive PC power supply.

https://dynomotion.com/Help/Schemati...ctorsKFLOP.htm

What do you recommend? I don't want to risk damaging the board.

I'll run power to my encoders from JP12 pins 33,34 and 35.

Does the Kflop / Kanalog have an enable / charge pump pin? Which can be attached to an emergency stop for example?

[TomKerekes]

Hi Jim,

What do you recommend? I don't want to risk damaging the board.

A PC power supply is not likely to damage KFLOP. However as I stated it usually has a connection to it's case and Earth Ground and is not isolated. This might cause noise problems and ground loops. It is also designed for high wattage like 350W not the 10W or less that KFLOP will consume.

Isolated 5V 10W regulated switching power supplies are commonly available from many sources at low cost. I find the Meanwell brand is reliable. Here is one at mouser for < $8
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail...ldxXZPuw%3d%3d

I'll run power to my encoders from JP12 pins 33,34 and 35.

That would work, but you will need GNDs also. Or use the screw terminals.

Does the Kflop / Kanalog have an enable / charge pump pin? Which can be attached to an emergency stop for example?

Yes there is a TTL signal ENABLEALL on JP12 and a relay driver output SWE. These activate after KFLOP has booted and while KFLOP is communicating with Kanalog. See:
Kanalog Hardware Info - Dynomotion

Regards

[jim_cliff11]

Thanks for the reply Tom, and thanks for your patience in general. It's much appreciated!

Ok, so I've order a mouser power supply which should be here today.
I'll be running power to my encoders from JP8 +5v and GND's to JP6 terminals.

The SWE pin on JP8 will be the GND to a 24v relay which will send the RF (enable +24v) signal to the drives. The RF line from the relay will also have the axis limit switches in series before reaching the drives. I'm guessing if the RESET button on Mach3 is triggered then the SWE will be un-grounded (disabling drives). Or if a limit switch is triggered the drives are also disabled as the RF sig is interrupted.

The drives have in-built NO switches (BB-Bb). When mains power is on, no faults exist and the RF signal is present, they become closed to signal 'ALL GOOD'. If a drive trips out or a limit switch is activated (resulting in loss of RF signal) the BB-Bb switches then open signalling an issue. I was going to run +24v or +5v through all drive's (BB-Bb) in series and back into Kanalog. Does Kanalog have a set input to halt the program / operation if a drive trips or a limit switch is activated (break in BB-Bb signal)?

Thanks,
Jim

[jim_cliff11]

Sorry Tom,

Basic questions which i can find the answer too if I look hard enough. Kanalog doesn't have a set input pin for stopping the program. Any input can be used and then its action set in software.

In my case I will run 24v to pin 1 (JP15 - Kanalog). Pin 2 will then run through all 'drive ready' Bb pins in series and then to 0v. This is then configured in software to STOP program when opto-input 1 is LOW.

[TomKerekes]

Hi Jim,

thanks for your patience in general. It's much appreciated!

No. Thanks for your patience.

I'm guessing if the RESET button on Mach3 is triggered then the SWE will be un-grounded (disabling drives). Or if a limit switch is triggered drives are disabled.

Actually no. SWE is active so long as KFLOP is correctly communicating with Kanalog. There are Axis Enable Outputs t that can be configured in Mach3 to deactivate things when Mach3 goes into its EStop/Reset mode.

In my case I will run 24v to pin 1 (JP15 - Kanalog). Pin 2 will then run through all 'drive ready' Bb pins in series and then to 0v. This is then configured in software to STOP program when opto-input 1 is LOW.

That sounds correct.

Regards

[jim_cliff11]

Instead of using SWE I’ll run the coil gnd to switch 7 (pin8 - JP8). But I’ll put another relay downstream effectively that’s triggered from SWE. That way the RF signal isn’t high until Kanalog has fully booted up and the axis enable switch is active in software.

Tom with regards to multiple supplies. Kflop / Kanalog is now powered from a 5v mouser supply as you suggested. My main control circuit is powered from a 24v transformer which I would use to supply the relays mentioned above. As the outputs in JP8 switch to ground through the Kanalog would I need to connect my 24v supply ground / 0v to a ground terminal on Kanalog?

Thanks

[TomKerekes]

Hi Jim,

Tom with regards to multiple supplies. Kflop / Kanalog is now powered from a 5v mouser supply as you suggested. My main control circuit is powered from a 24v transformer which I would use to supply the relays mentioned above. As the outputs in JP8 switch to ground through the Kanalog would I need to connect my 24v supply ground / 0v to a ground terminal on Kanalog?

Yes. The Kanalog Relay Drivers are not isolated. The idea is that the relays should provide isolation. If you use the same power supply as used with the opto isolated circuitry you will defeat the isolation. So you really should use separate supplies.

By transformer I assume you mean DC power supply? The Relay Drivers only work with DC.

Note you should place a reverse diode right across any relay coil to limit the reverse voltage spike that occurs when a coil is switched off.

HTH
Regards

[jim_cliff11]

Hi Tom,

The machine has 2 x 240vac, 1 x 110vac and 1 x 24vac transformer. I know that the original PLC ran off 110vac and 24vdc. The majority of outputs, relays etc are either 110vac or 24vdc as I tested them when the old system was running. The only issue I have now I'm not receiving 24vdc through any of the corresponding feeds, but I am getting 24vac from the transformer. There must be a rogue rectifier hiding somewhere!!

I've just bought two 24vdc 10amp supplies so I might just wiring these in to be honest. I'll run the GND from just one of these supplies to a ground screw terminal on Kanalog. Then the second supply I'll isolate and use on opti-outputs.

Are there any functions which you'd recommend run through the opto-isolated outputs rather than the relays? Or it completely up to application and customer.

Thanks,
Jim

[TomKerekes]

Are there any functions which you'd recommend run through the opto-isolated outputs rather than the relays? Or it completely up to application and customer.

Yes it mostly depends on your system. Typical things are Spindle ON/OFF, CW/CCW, and Drive Enables.

Regards

[jim_cliff11]

Thanks Tom, nearly ready for the first firing up to test the security circuit.

Before I connect the DACs I’ve just has a thought.....

Kanalog’ DACs share a common gnd, with only 1 analog +-10v signal per drive essentially. When I tested my drives I basically put 10vdc in one drive input pin and gnd to the other pin to achieve movement in one direction. Then swapped the gnd and 10vdc inputs pins round to achieve movement in the other direction. There isn’t a set gnd pin or input pin on the drives. They work in pairs swapping polarity so it seems. In the drive manual it describes these two input pins as differential and as such resistors are in place / removes to accommodate this input type.

How will this work with Kanalog putting +-10vdc into just one pin with the other permantly connected to Kanalog gnd? I’m confused :S

Surely it can’t work?

[TomKerekes]

Hi jim_cliff11,

Before I connect the DACs I’ve just has a thought.....

Kanalog’ DACs share a common gnd, with only 1 analog +-10v signal per drive essentially. When I tested my drives I basically put 10vdc in one drive input pin and gnd to the other pin to achieve movement in one direction. Then swapped the gnd and 10vdc inputs pins round to achieve movement in the other direction. There isn’t a set gnd pin or input pin on the drives. They work in pairs swapping polarity so it seems. In the drive manual it describes these two input pins as differential and as such resistors are in place / removes to accommodate this input type.

How will this work with Kanalog putting +-10vdc into just one pin with the other permantly connected to Kanalog gnd? I’m confused :S

Surely it can’t work?

Unlike your fixed +10VDC source a Kanalog DAC output can be +10VDC or -10VDC or anything in between. So there is no need to swap the direction to change the polarity.

HTH
Regards

[jim_cliff11]

Thanks for the clarification Tom.

So it turns out the Bb relay outputs on the drives are closed when the drives receive mains power, even if the rf signal is not present. Therefore I’ve got no drive stop feedback to Kanalog.

Tom would the revised attached circuit work? Can I set opto input 1 to disable program when it recieves low AFTER sw6 is active? So when SW6 goes high (to enable drives) if opto in 1 after this point recieves a low signal then it disables the program, such as the estop will do? I appreciate this will contradict the opto-isolation, but i may use an alternative input. Just for example sake on any input would this work?

Or will sw6 not go High initially because opto in 1 will be in a low state?

The alternative is I put the limit switches on a separate circuit into their own input to disable drives when low? And not have them in the rf line.

Thanks,
Jim

[TomKerekes]

Hi Jim,

You will write a small C Program to handle all of this so you are able to handle things however you wish. You can turn SW6 on or off whenever you wish. And you can monitor Opto In1 or Opto In2 however you wish and based on its state disable whatever you want.

Possibly you might turn on SW6 as the system is being initialized. Afterward you might monitor Opto In 1 and if it ever goes low disable the KFLOP Axes and turn off W6.

HTH
Regards

[jim_cliff11]

Hi Jim,

You will write a small C Program to handle all of this so you are able to handle things however you wish. You can turn SW6 on or off whenever you wish. And you can monitor Opto In1 or Opto In2 however you wish and based on its state disable whatever you want.

Possibly you might turn on SW6 as the system is being initialized. Afterward you might monitor Opto In 1 and if it ever goes low disable the KFLOP Axes and turn off W6.

HTH
Regards

Thanks Tom,

I’m away skiing at the moment but when I get back I’ll crack on and get it going.

[jim_cliff11]

Ok, the wiring is all done for limits, relays, axis brakes, power supply and drive requirements.
I will post a complete schematic up when I confirm it all works.
Quick question though Tom:

Using the opto-inputs on Kanalog, see the circuit below:

The SPDT switch is to over-ride the limits when needed.



If I test continuity between the +ve & -ve of the 24v supply the multimeter beeps (minimal resistance as we'd expect). There's not actually any load present on the circuit. Surely in practice this would effectively short out the supply and blow a fuse (like putting a jumper wire from + to -)? This may seem like a dumb question, but its been puzzling me the last week or so.

Thanks

[TomKerekes]

Hi Jim,

It isn't clear to me where you are measuring and what is connected while you are measuring.

But the circuit looks like it would work to me. The Kanalog Opto Input has a high resistance and will only allow a very small current to flow. Think of it like a tiny 24V light bulb. it is ok to connect it directly to the 24V supply.

Actually I don't see any need for a SPDT switch. You could just use a SPST switch. When it shorts across the other switches it doesn't matter if the other switches are disconnected or remain connected.

HTH
Regards

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[jim_cliff11]

Hi Tom,

Things progressing well. I’ve powered up the 3 phase and 240vac. Kanalog is alive as well as the servo’s and my security circuit seems to be working. Although I need to do the C programming to switch on / off relays as and when I need.

I’ve wired in my servo and spindle drive. All of which I can control with my 9v battery and POT when I enable the SWE7 relay output manually on the I/O screen. I now need to setup the drives through the config program.

Few questions regarding encoders:

1. I have A+, A-, B+, B-, Z+, Z-. A and B channels are wired into JP1 chan A and chan B accordingly. X axis encoder Z+ and Z- are wired into JP2 cha-diffplus4 and cha-diffminus4 correspondingly. Y axis Z+, Z- to cha-diffplus5, cha-diffminus5. Spindle axis Z+, Z- to cha-diffplus6, cha-diffminus6. Is this right?

2. Encoders have vcc (5v) and 0v supply pins. These are wired into Kanalog. Encoders also have VCCsense and 0Vsense pins. I’ve simply tied these into the VCC and 0V pins. I’m guessing this is right? Or should I cut the sense lines?

Thanks,

[TomKerekes]

Hi Jim,

I’ve wired in my servo and spindle drive. All of which I can control with my 9v battery and POT when I enable the SWE7 relay output manually on the I/O screen. I now need to setup the drives through the config program.

Cool

Few questions regarding encoders:

1. I have A+, A-, B+, B-, Z+, Z-. A and B channels are wired into JP1 chan A and chan B accordingly. X axis encoder Z+ and Z- are wired into JP2 cha-diffplus4 and cha-diffminus4 correspondingly. Y axis Z+, Z- to cha-diffplus5, cha-diffminus5. Spindle axis Z+, Z- to cha-diffplus6, cha-diffminus6. Is this right?

Yes. Differential Index pulses can be connected to any spare differential input. Your homing code will eventually make use of them if you wish to use them.

2. Encoders have vcc (5v) and 0v supply pins. These are wired into Kanalog. Encoders also have VCCsense and 0Vsense pins. I’ve simply tied these into the VCC and 0V pins. I’m guessing this is right? Or should I cut the sense lines?

It would probably work either way but I think those are better off left disconnected (no loop to pick up noise?). They are probably connected internally. I think those are to allow you to read back and measure the Vcc that is actually getting to the Encoder. At a Hengstler site I found this:

Attachment 390622

[jim_cliff11]

Thanks for the reply Tom.
Encoders wired in and working!

Looking at programming, few questions:

1. In the axis config screen I’ve set +/- limit switches on all axis as bit #?? (Can’t remember off the top of my head). When selecting the appropriate action, how does Kanalog know which output to disable (to halt drives)? I want the triggering of a limit switch to disable SWE7.

2. To apply changes in the axis config screen before I even contemplate C coding do I click upload channel button? I want settings I change on screen to be saved even after I close KMotion.

3. Which tuning screen takes care of axis distance travelled per encoder revolution? Is there any tutorials on this?

4. On the axis config screen I’m guessing for input and output channels I can leave gain at 1 and offset at 0? Then I select the corrosponding input channel (encoder) and output (DAC pin) for an axis. Is there a channel reference to pin?

I’ve already done a hell of a lot of reading, and to be fair there is a hell of a lot of information from many different sources. So much in fact that my head feels mashed tonight. I’ve probably already read the answers for the above questions lol :/

I just need a strong coffee and a heads up on where to start with configuring these axis.

Thanks,
Jim