[ImanCarrot]

That looks bad. Just a thought- is the tool bit straight? roll it on a surface table and see if it's bent.

I'd also stick a straight piece of rod in the collet and clock the side of it to see if the collet is actualy straight.

[Kool Parts]

HuFlungDung,
That's exactly what I thought...burnt up tooling. Everybody is giving solutions to the problem...but the post reads 3 different machines...with at least 1 of them brand new....and 2 different locations.
And to make it worse .005 deep in Alum....
I would bet that no one on that reads here regularly could replicate that with any machine in decent shape, or new, new tooling, decent coolant
That cut looks like about 5 different problems at the same time...

[Five-10]

I did a test cut on my VF6SS. I used a beat 3/16" 2 flute endmill ran it at 35 ipm 8500rpm .015 doc. I use Houghton coolant which I feel is superior in alum. The cut on right is with setting 191 set at default Medium. Cut on left is setting 191 set at Finish. It's hard to tell from picture but left is a little better but they are both are fine. I ran my pocket surf profilometer across the right one where endmill changed direction and it was still a 28 finish. So to sum it up it's not how Haas machines cut there is a problem somewhere.

[DEAN]

flatfnder, You must not be talking to the right people at HAAS factory and getting the run around from your HFO. I find it outrageous, bordering on crazy that someone at HAAS factory would tell you that your expectations are too high with that finish as an example.
Honestly, if that was just "the way a HAAS cuts" they wouldn't be selling over 10,000 machines a year.
My little desktop $2k MAXNC mill I use primarily for engraving does a better job in aluminum than that. At that DOC too!!

[Geof]

I agree with Dean. The sample below was done on a Haas GR510 with the extended Z axis. Left to right the conditions were:

10000rpm, 100ipm.

10000rpm 100ipm Single Blocking

15000rpm, 200ipm.

5000rpm, 50ipm.

[JPMach]

I know this is a really stupid question, but it has to be asked.

Are you running the same code on the Haas and the Okuma? If not is there a small glitch in the code that might set the Z down a bit and then back up?

I had to ask as everyone else is looking at the mechanical and electrical side of things, just thought I would throw another angle in the mix. It should have been the first thing any of the techs looked at but you never know these days.

I agree that is not just how a Haas cuts. Granted there are machines out there that are much better than Haas, the Haas should still cut better than that.

One other thing just out of curiousity. With power to the machine open the back cabinet. Is the Phase check light lit. The stupid power company every once in a great while has been known to switch phases when fixing storm damage and such. From what a tech told me once the machine will still run and everything but would probably have interpolating problems.

My $.02 for what its worth.
JP

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You said the HFO used the same program as you were using?

I'd guess they used different tooling/different coolant.

Can you post the program? Mabye someone else in this thread can try it out.

[flatfnder]

Wow, thanks for all the responses.

Here is a picture of a side cut using a 5/8 endmill, full depth cut in 3/4 aluminum at 60 ipm and RPM 5600 removing .015 inches of material. Side cuts always seem to be good, just bottom surface.

When my HFO ran the new machine on a solid foundation at their location I gave them a wireframe of my part and they programed it themselves. I will hopefully get my hands on a sample part cut on the new machine late today.

I will get back later today or tomorrow morning to respond with more, super busy today.

[HAILINHAAS]

Not the spindle. Would you post a picture of the tool you are using. Just curious.

[flatfnder]

Ok, I just took a cut using the same endmill, tool holder, material, coolant, mastercam program (though different post), ran at 5000 RPM at 25 imp with a .005 depth of cut.

Haas 1 is picture of cut straight out of machine.
Haas 2 is picture of cut after running scotchpad over surface
Okuma 1 is picture of cut straight out of machine.
Okuma 2 is picture of cut after running scotchpad over surface
endmill is the endmill I am using.

Does anyone get a surface finish in their HAAS like the picture of the part cut in the Okuma?

[Loading]

Wow, thanks for all the responses.

Here is a picture of a side cut using a 5/8 endmill, full depth cut in 3/4 aluminum at 60 ipm and RPM 5600 removing .015 inches of material. Side cuts always seem to be good, just bottom surface.

When my HFO ran the new machine on a solid foundation at their location I gave them a wireframe of my part and they programed it themselves. I will hopefully get my hands on a sample part cut on the new machine late today.

I will get back later today or tomorrow morning to respond with more, super busy today.

Ahh, this is a long shot, but the only thing I can think of.

Possibility of the wireframe having small 'dips' in it. And the reason they'd show on the Haas, and not the other machines is a different post file?

Not sure if you have tried this, but try hand coding a "V" give it a try, and post the code here, then we can fully discount the program.

[HAILINHAAS]

Is the machine set up with the factory parameters for the axis or have they been adjusted to try to fix issue? Also, try shortening that end mill up and see if you get the same results. You shouldn't have to .. but it is worth seeing if it gets better. Try a four flute and see if any difference is made.

[CNCADEPT]

Flatfnder,

I apologize for the problems you have been having with your HAAS VMC. I am replying to this thread to offer you my professional assistance regarding this matter. At Haas automation, Inc. we take pride in satisfying our customers expectations. We have great confidence in our machines are and very satisfied with the worldwide contribution we are making to the machining industry. Please contact me directly so we can fix your problem and point you towards the right direction in the least time possible. Hoping to hear from you soon.

Best regards,

[Kool Parts]

You cant beat an offer like that
I will be interested to see what ends up being the problem...or problems

[flatfnder]

Ok, here are two pictures from the brand new VF3SSYT that my HFO set up on their solid foundation floor at their facilities. Their programer set up using their own tooling and came up with these results. I sent the piece out for a surface finish test and the result came back as a RA of 36.

Thank you Milton for offering your services, I am going to call you right now. I hope we can get the problem worked out because I love every other machining aspect of the machine.

[davereagan]

Flatfndr,
I just want to applaud you for not falling for the same line of bull twice. Making the dealer spend the money on their pet ideas and experiment was wise. I have a Taiwan machine with box ways, but the head is a bit light and I have learned a bunch of tricks to compensate for that; one of which is always use an endmill with a 40 degree helix or more, except for the new variable helix types, which are great. Another is using the shortest possible holders, preferably with 1.75" gage length. I would try .001-.002" depth on the final cut. The cutter is deflecting a little bit, and with a less rigid machine, the head is moving a little bit too. It takes so little to show up on the surface. Even though the Haas machine is the cause, tooling changes may make the problem go away. Are you choked up on the endmill as much as possible? Can you use a shorter collet chuck? Bigger diameter endmill? Even to .250" ?

[flatfnder]

Should I really have to resort to such tricks to get a nice surface finish. There is nothing complicated or crazy about this cut in the picture, just a simple pocket needing a surface with no swirl marks that a scotch pad can't wipe out. I am sure that if I spent a few days tweaking the tooling and programing I can minimize the swirl marks for this one part but what happens when I need to use a standard or, heaven forbid, a long length endmill on a part.

I spoke with Milton at HAAS and have sent my parameters along with my program to him. He is going to set up and cut the part on a machine at the factory and get back to me. I want to belive that it is possible for my machine to cut the way I want.

Thanks again to Milton for responding and offering to help.

[Perp]

I hope you get this resolved.

Would you (anyone) mind telling me what the scotchbrite pad is for. Is it only used in analysis of a bad finish or do you "clean up" all of the machined surfaces this way? I have no VMC experience and am only asking to help myself understand this as I follow the conversations in this thread.

Thanks
Doug

And good luck.

[flatfnder]

I quite often use scotchpads to clean up and debur parts. 95% of what I machine are aluminum castings so I don't usually machine the whole part. The scotchpad works great to clean up the transition areas from machined to cast so I sometimes us it as part of my deburing process.

In this case I was using the scotchpad to see how deep the "coining" marks where on the floor surface. In my opinion if you run a scotch pad over the machine surface it should take out all cutter marks without much difficulty.

[dcoupar]

Flatfnder,

I know it's late in the game, but have you checked the middle levelling pads? I've seen problems like this after the machine has settled.