[The_Roadrunner]

I started a new job about a month ago, and for the first time I'm at a place where the company thinks the machinists should supply perishables, such as endmills, countersinks, drills, etc... to produce the company's jobs.

I've never encountered this before, and I've been in the business over 20 years.

I'm opposed to this practice. :bs:

btw, this came as surprise after I started the job, and I am looking for a new job already, lol.

[Delcamfan]

Honestly that is the most ridiculous, most absurd thing Ive ever heard......companies make damn good money in this industry and to even have the nerve to present that thought to an employee just blows my mind....where are you located and what are you job skills? Im in indiana and I know many people in this area, I may be able to point you in a direction for a new job........

[The_Roadrunner]

Honestly that is the most ridiculous, most absurd thing Ive ever heard......companies make damn good money in this industry and to even have the nerve to present that thought to an employee just blows my mind....where are you located and what are you job skills? Im in indiana and I know many people in this area, I may be able to point you in a direction for a new job........

I agree with you, it is outrageous.

One man has been with this company 19 years. He showed his pay stub last week... he's spent over $400 this year on perishables. Can you beleive it?

I'm on the IL-WI state line area near I-94.

I have over 20 years in job shops. I was a toolmaker before moving into CNC. I program/set-up machining centers and turning centers. I've got a full 1 page list of CNC equipment I can program and set-up that's attached to my resume.

PM sent.

[MrWild]

You're too close not to apply to Modine. Racine is full of tool rooms yet. I sure hope this shop isn't located here. Sounds like Haban except Haban has been gone many years.

[The_Roadrunner]

You're too close not to apply to Modine. Racine is full of tool rooms yet. I sure hope this shop isn't located here. Sounds like Haban except Haban has been gone many years.

Thanks for the input.

I haven't worked in the Racine area. I did work in the Kenosha area twice. It seemed to me to me that the pay range is substantially higher on the IL side. I really can't say much as to the character of the shops in WI, other than at least I never had to supply cutting tools. I pretty much gave up on WI because the pay was $3 to $4 less per hour.

I did take a look at Modine's website, however, I don't see any current machinist openings. Impressive company.

[The_Roadrunner]

I considered posting for a job in the RFQ area, and the replies to this poll thread are making me think that is a good idea which could very likely result in getting me placed in a good match.

I've been looking at career builder for the past 2 weeks, and I'm seeing about 99% of the ads are from agencies, which I'm trying to avoid due to some bad experiences.

It seems monster.com only gets me responses from agencies, and for that reason I haven't bumped my monster account yet.

Presently I'm looking for a job in Chicago or nearby suburbs, although I'm also open to relocating- depending on where that may be.

fyi, I design websites as a hobby, and I have a bud (my hosting partner) who moved to FL 2 years ago who has offered to help me out with a place to stay temporarily if I would relocate to his area. If I were to try that, I'd be looking for a job in Tampa, St. Petersburg, Clearwater, Lakeland, or Brandon.

Thanks for the replies so far guys.

This forum rocks!

[msomerville]

That is the craziest thing I have ever heard. You need to stop posting bs posts. I think this must be a joke.

Do you get a slice of the pie when the tools you bought perform better and make them more money?

The site owner for www.cadcamtrainer.com is from that area and I believe he owns his own shop. He would at least know of the job availability in that area.

[chip cruncher]

When I worked in a job shop (83-93) you were expected to have drill set, reamers and counterbores (just basics 1/16-1/2 drills, 1/4-1/2 reamers and cb) when you started work. Larger sizes and replacements for broken or worn tools were then furnished. Company furnished all end mills and lathe tooling.

[eorourke]

I do believe that there are some shops who lease out the equipment( lathes, mills etc) to the machinists. In that case, it may be permissible to have the machinists pay for their own tools.
It appears that the philosophy of your shop is that if you pay for your own tools then you will take better care of them and the company can hope to limit any machine tool crashes. Also, if you have to buy the tools, then you are more likely to reuse them for different jobs instead of chucking them after running each job because it is easier. They may also think that since they are paying you a premium to work there, that the cost of the tooling is made up in their hourly rate.
BTW, I voted that you shouldn't have to pay for the tooling. I am just trying to rationalize why they have that policy.

[The_Roadrunner]

That is the craziest thing I have ever heard. You need to stop posting bs posts. I think this must be a joke.

Do you get a slice of the pie when the tools you bought perform better and make them more money?

The site owner for www.cadcamtrainer.com is from that area and I believe he owns his own shop. He would at least know of the job availability in that area.

I wish it was a joke. I'll kid around a lil sometimes in posts, and I enjoy a good laugh, but I don't post shens.

I'm not buying anything for this shop. I was told during interview I'd have insurance after 30 days... after 30 days I was told no, there's no insurance until after 90 days and no holiday pay either.

Thanks for the link, I'm checking it out now

[The_Roadrunner]

When I worked in a job shop (83-93) you were expected to have drill set, reamers and counterbores (just basics 1/16-1/2 drills, 1/4-1/2 reamers and cb) when you started work. Larger sizes and replacements for broken or worn tools were then furnished. Company furnished all end mills and lathe tooling.

Thanks, I am trying to see if this is something odd or not. I certainly think it is, and it seems the majority agrees with me.

If I recall correctly, I was required to have OD mics up to 3", ID mics up to 6", tenths indicator, travel indicator, caliper, a 100ths scale, tape measure, drill sharpening gauge, etc... measuring instruments.

I don't recall having to supply perishables. I do have some of my own endmills, high speed lathe bits and a drill set up to 1/2"... I've made misc items for myself and friends when I have access to manual machines and a need arises.

This shop does supply inserts for the Okuma tools, however, everything is KC850, only .031 radius, and there is a serious lack of tooling. I have no ID groove tool for example, so twice I've run 50 and 60 piece jobs which I had to borrow a homemade bar from the manual lathe hand using high speed. The bar is 3/4 diameter and 8 inches long, so it's no use to me on the Okuma and I have to go to a manual lathe and groove the parts. The only ID profile tool I have is a 55 degree 1/2" bar, and my foreman thinks I can make a 45 degree chamfer at the back end of a part with it. Pretty stupid.

I haven't had time to make my own ID groove tool yet.

[eorourke]

It appears to me that the shop you are at is in a time warp. They are still using tools and machines that were developed over 20 years ago. If they are not careful, KC 850 will be obsolete pretty soon.

[The_Roadrunner]

I do believe that there are some shops who lease out the equipment( lathes, mills etc) to the machinists. In that case, it may be permissible to have the machinists pay for their own tools.
It appears that the philosophy of your shop is that if you pay for your own tools then you will take better care of them and the company can hope to limit any machine tool crashes. Also, if you have to buy the tools, then you are more likely to reuse them for different jobs instead of chucking them after running each job because it is easier. They may also think that since they are paying you a premium to work there, that the cost of the tooling is made up in their hourly rate.
BTW, I voted that you shouldn't have to pay for the tooling. I am just trying to rationalize why they have that policy.

Thanks for the feedback.

As I understand it, this shop has been in business over 30 years, it's a 5 man shop. The founder died several years ago, and what I was told was that since the owner's daughter has taken over, she won't spend money and the guys are silly enough to have gone along with that.

I also have been told they have had not been able to keep anyone new there. Pretty obvious why, lol.

I was told during my interview by the owner (the lady) that she wanted to buy some new machines, etc...

So imagine my surprise when I started there and I couldn't find a single decent endmill. I've been using my own, I only have a couple, and I'm not happy about it.

Even funnier, one of my first Okuma jobs there was a 1600 piece order from 2" stock. A bar job. I saw the job coming up, proposed that she buy a bar puller so the CNC can run automated and I would be free to work on other jobs.

She liked that idea until she saw the cheapest bar puller I could find was about $500 from Royal

So I pulled the order by hand. It took me 5 days. The bar puller would've just about paid for itself on that job alone.

There's a ton of junk tooling lying around, broken endmills and drills mostly, the remnants from the past 30 years when her father had the shop.

The lady is really nice, but I have lots of bills and I'm not inclined to start buying cutting tools for this shop. And I am not making big bucks either.

Sorry for the length of my post, I tend to babble on sometimes.

[The_Roadrunner]

It appears to me that the shop you are at is in a time warp. They are still using tools and machines that were developed over 20 years ago. If they are not careful, KC 850 will be obsolete pretty soon.

I agree.

[The_Roadrunner]

That is the craziest thing I have ever heard. You need to stop posting bs posts. I think this must be a joke.

Do you get a slice of the pie when the tools you bought perform better and make them more money?

The site owner for www.cadcamtrainer.com is from that area and I believe he owns his own shop. He would at least know of the job availability in that area.

I see I'll have to send him an email.

Thanks.

[RICHARD ZASTROW]

Roadrunner, I've worked and lived in Wisconsin for 66 years. You are the first person I've heard of to be told to buy his own perishables. I had to spend time in a few "pergatory" type shops on occaision where the consumables were in poor shape etc. but never was told or asked to supply my own perishables. I have brought tooling to the job but was always compensated for it.

As far as the pay goes, you are correct. Generally Wisconsin lags the area in pay but seems to have slightly less ups and downs in employment. (It stays low)

Good luck on your next job.

[InspirationTool]

That's whack.

Sounds like a clear case of "people who can't do math".

If you buy carbide tooling to run a job faster will they pay you a higher hourly rate?

-Jeff

[The_Roadrunner]

Roadrunner, I've worked and lived in Wisconsin for 66 years. You are the first person I've heard of to be told to buy his own perishables. I had to spend time in a few "pergatory" type shops on occaision where the consumables were in poor shape etc. but never was told or asked to supply my own perishables. I have brought tooling to the job but was always compensated for it.

As far as the pay goes, you are correct. Generally Wisconsin lags the area in pay but seems to have slightly less ups and downs in employment. (It stays low)

Good luck on your next job.

Thanks for the reply and the Good Luck wishes.

It seems I'm not in purgatory, but rather in the first level of hell, lol.

The only problem I had with WI jobs was the lower pay. All the tax breaks businesses are getting in Kenosha-Racine has brought a lot of industry up there.

[The_Roadrunner]

That's whack.

Sounds like a clear case of "people who can't do math".

If you buy carbide tooling to run a job faster will they pay you a higher hourly rate?

-Jeff

That's a good question.

I doubt it. Maybe I should ask, I don't have much to lose at this point.

[ataxy]

Wow unless they pay you 70$/hr and even then