[baystard]

Hey new here found your guys site searching for some help. Hope some one here can point me in the right direction.

Here is the problem I have a 1996 torq cut-22 that was giving me an alarm (spindle not up to speed in time). I worked with a guy over the phone to diagnose the problem and he said something in the motor was bad I want to say the encoder but I know that isn't right because the I have replaced the encoder and it wasn't in the motor. Any way I sent the motor out and had it rebuilt. I put the motor back in today and tryed to start the spindle but get the same alarm. I can turn the spindle by hand and get an rpm reading. So I think the encoder is working but I don't know for sure what it could be. I know the guy on the phone said some thing about a board that goes bad when the motor goes bad. Any way thanks in advance for your help.

Aaron

[machintek]

You are on the right track. 95% of the time that I get that error it is the spindle encoder. It is belt driven to the right side of the spindle inside the head. There are variations. The best ones were made by Heidenhain. The ones I avoid were made by encoder technologies and had a silver can. The high speed spindles had a bearing housing for the pulley to protect the encoder from loads.
The fact that you can turn the encoder and see a spindle speed is very good.
Next try in MDI a S0M3. This will show you the drift in the drive. Anything greater than 2 RPM will give you that alarm and will fail in a tool change as the spindle will drift out of orient position. Even at a spindle speed of 2000, a deviation greater than 20 percent will trigger that alarm. You should have a second or two to see the actual spindle speed before it fsaults out. The screen can display either the commanded speed or the actual speed.
Thus do you have the correct encoder? And do you have the parameters set corrrectly? Both for the encoder resolution, sample rate, spindle gain etc..
Drift is set on the Yaskawa as a parameter. But will get affected by changing the spindle gain parameter 71.

George

[baystard]

Thanks I will try that when I get to the shop in the morning And let you know what happens.

Aaron

[baystard]

Ok I went in to MDI and ran a s0m3. I did it a couple times the first time the rpm jumped up to 17 then down to 3-4 rpm But never set an alarm The spindle just jumped back and forth from a clockwise to counterc clock wise rotation until I hit the e-stop.

I then went in to the parameters and looked at #71 spindle gain perameter. It is set at 3.75634 And in the manual the number shown is 23142. Is this what it should be set at? Any way some of the others are not as the book shows either like #74 is at 1 book says 1875.

I tried to edit them but it asks for a passowrd And I don't have one.

When I was on the phone with some one trying to diag. This the first time I remember him haveing me change or check some peameters but I don't know whitch ones.

Thank again
Aaron

[baystard]

Sorry for the double post.

[baystard]

Well messed with it a little more tonight after work. Still haven't got any thig figured out. I found a password to set spindle orientation and when I tried that I got a different Alarm hi/lo range switch time out during gear change.
I got both of these alarms once before when there was a bad board in the vmc. Do you guys think it could be that agian? Or do I just need to find te password to edit the parameters? Any help would be great.
Aaron

[machintek]

To set the tool change height and orient, the password is:
PASSWORD
in capitol letters.
Novel, huh!

George

[baystard]

I found that in one of your old post But I can't figure out the password to edit the parameters. I don't know for sure that is my problem but the numbers for the spindle gain is no were close to what the book says.

[machintek]

111257

[baystard]

Thank you I am going to the shop here in a few minutes to try to get this thing back up and running. Do you think I should set the spindle gain parameter to the setting in the book? It give me an equation in the book to figure the number but I don't know the values for all the things they want.

Thanks allot
aaron

[machintek]

Parameter 71 sets the spindle gain. So if you command 2000RPM and it is not there, you can adjust this to make it match. Usually I have to change this if a new BMDC is installed.
But if you adjust this, the spindle drift will also shift a bit. Then you have to adjust the Yaskawa. This goes back and forth untill you are satisfied. The spindle drift is more important. It has to be 2 RPM or less. Otherwise the tool change will fault out as the spindle drifts out of orient. Value in the book is a starting approximation.

George

[baystard]

Thaks I messed with it a little bit But now it is not wanting to shift. I was working the other day but know it dives me the hi/lo range switch time out during gear change alarm. This is the same thing it was doind last time there was a bord that went bad in the controler. So I am thinking it might be that again. But I don't know I just wanted to try to diagnose it my self and order the part but I am starting to get frustrated. We will see.

Thanks Aaron

[machintek]

All the tool change and shift functions are done by the LCTLAUF board. It has a how of solid state relays on one side of the board. They are black, about 1 inch tall, 1/4 inch wide, 2 inches long. The most common relays to short are the ones for the carosel forward/reverse. Then the carosel never stops.
Remember that in the maint page, you can specify which switches or commands you want to look at. So you could look at the shot pin switch, hi or low gear switch, sol commands, etc.
Lastly You can put the machine in E stop, (2 man operation) and while one person rocks the spindle back and forth, the other manually operates the shot pin and the hi/low solenoid. The person rocking the spindle will feel the machine going into hi or low gear. The switches can at this time be verified.
How much oil is in the transmission?
Are you using a good grade of air tool oil in the air line oiler? Marvel Mystery oil works very well.

George

[baystard]

Thanks again I will try this today after work and see what I get. I was in the maint page and I remember both the hi/lo switches were off. I will check the oil also today. The carousel seems to work and stops when I home the carousel.

Thanks Aaron

[baystard]

Alright I finaly got some free time last night to work on this some more. I got the hi/low shifting again. I just cleaned the solenoid and put some lube in the line and worked it open and closed. I think it might have just gotten gummed up from sitting for a few years with out use. I am going to do the same thing with the shot pin solenoid today. I also got the spindle encoder timed right and it will do tool changes again. So I am getting some where. I will up date later today.

Thanks
Aaron

[baystard]

Update. Well cleaned all the solenoids they all had some gummy build up in them. But they are all claen and smoth now.

I got the spindle to start up but the only way it will start is if I give it a speed higher the specified for the gear. Example gave it an s200m3 in low gear won't do any thing just gives me a spindal not up to speed in time alarm. But if I give it a s2000m3 in low gear it will speed up to 3-4000 rpm then go from an m3 to an m4 then give me a hi/lo range switch time out during gear change alarm. The second time I tried it the shot pin I tink opened and the the trans came out of gear.

And when I went to try to shift it manualy the sot pin solenoid was hot and seemed to be stuck open. So I don't know what is up. I am going to go and try to find the relays George talked about and see if they are bad.

Any one have any advice?
Aaron