[BrassBuilder]

I have a part that I want to try to make by stamping it out of thin copper. I was going to make a die with a corresponding piece that it would insert into (the mold). The die would be slightly smaller than my actual part and the mold opening would be slightly bigger (enough clearance for the copper).

I have my part drawn to the size that I need it. Is there any way to scale this so that I do not have to redraw it twice (once slightly smaller and once slightly larger)?

Thanks
Mike

[metalworkz]

Hi Mike,
In Partmaster CAD open your part and select View from main toolbar, then Properties, and set the scale accordingly at the bottom of the Properties popup window.
Regards,

[BrassBuilder]

Hi Mike,
In Partmaster CAD open your part and select View from main toolbar, then Properties, and set the scale accordingly at the bottom of the Properties popup window.
Regards,

That was easy. Now I just need to figure out the scale that I need. Guess it is time for experimentation!
Thanks!
mike

[metalworkz]

Hi Mike,
Is this going to be a blanking die for a flat piece or is going to do some forming also? For a flat part blanking of this material say up to .060 a clearance of 10 percent is good, so about a .006" clearance between the punch and the die would be good. If the material is thinner you can just use the 10 percent formula to figure the correct clearance:
(EX: .1 x .032" material = .003" clearance) You would make the punch the same as the final shape and size of the part and make the die say .006" bigger for clearance. Keep in mind if there are flanges there will be some shrinkage and the part size may need to be enlarged to compensate for it.
If forming it will it have 90 degree flanges or are the flanges curved? Straight flanges would not be hard to figure but curved flanges will take more work. I am not a tool and die maker but I was a die setter and have a lot of experience working with blank & form tooling and high production hard tooling in punch presses up to 600 tons capacity. Now I mainly s/u & operate CNC turret punches.
Regards

[BrassBuilder]

Thanks Wes!
This gives me a good start. I attached a dxf of my part. It is rather curvy. There is going to be around a 1/16" flange all the way around the part. i was hoping to take my copper, anneal it, and then place the copper between the die and mold and squish it together with some light hammering to form it. I would then trim the flange to the desired height.
This was the best idea I could come up with for now.
And if worse came to worse, I could just make the part flat and leave the flange off. It just adds that little detail that I am striving for. I attached a pic of what I am trying to duplicate. The center, raised portion will be a separate piece.
Mike

[metalworkz]

Hi Mike,
Now that I see the part it looks like you could possible do a rough cut with snips etc. for the blank size and shape leaving enough material to trim the flat flanges as you mentioned after forming it. The closer to the final correct size you can make the flat blank the better it will form as excessive material will probably wrinkle during the forming operation and prevent you from achieving a good form of the shape. I have a chart of bend allowances for various materials and I will see if I can get you a rough idea for figuring the overal size. The bend allowances are for 90 degree bends but it should provide a way to get a "ballpark" size and you could just add a little more material to be sure you have some to trim? Give me a lil time to find my chart and I will see if you have replied to this message. I have not looked at the .dxf yet but will peep it soon as I find my chart of allowances.
Regards,

[metalworkz]

How high is the raised area of the cover? Guessing from the picture is looks to be approx. .375" to .50" high? Also how thick is the material going to be? My chart only goes down to .125" copper so not much help. I have complete aluminum and steel charts down to.015" thick and from 1/64 thru 1/4 bend radiuses.
I think you can get a close estimate of the overal size from the original by measuring. Once you get the dies made you can use a piece of thin cloth between the dies to mark the outside perimeter and come up with a close blank size when it is removed. Hope I have helped in some way. I suppose you got the other parts done already? It will be cool to see this when done!!
Regards,

[BrassBuilder]

I think it was around .375 high. It does not have to be scale perfect, getting the detail in is more important.

I checked my copper stock. It is about .011 thick. Some places measure .010 and others measure .012.

I also have some brass stock that is .005. That might be even a better alternative.

I'll post pics once I get one made.
Thanks
Mike

[MIKE JEFFERS]

correct term is punch and die
or top and bottom form tools

[BrassBuilder]

correct term is punch and die
or top and bottom form tools

LOL. Thanks Mike.
I knew I wasn't using the correct term for the "mold" part, but I couldn't think of what it was called.
Mike

[BrassBuilder]

Hi Mike,
In Partmaster CAD open your part and select View from main toolbar, then Properties, and set the scale accordingly at the bottom of the Properties popup window.
Regards,

Wes,
I finally had a chance to try this tonite and nothing is changing. I tried inputting 1.5 and I then printed my drawing to full size. It was the same size as before. I then entered .5 and tried it again. Same size as the original.
Any idea why?
Mike

[metalworkz]

Hi Mike,
Did you save the file after changing the scale? Look at the X or Y coordinate reading( mouse over the end of the part etc) and take note of the size. Then change the scale and check it again, but you may have to save the file(give it another name) before it will print diferently. Not sure but that's my guess.
Also maybe changing the sacle is not changing the print image size, so try looking at the actual dimensions or coordinate readings on the drawing after changing the scale.
Regards,

[BrassBuilder]

Hi Mike,
Did you save the file after changing the scale? Look at the X or Y coordinate reading( mouse over the end of the part etc) and take note of the size. Then change the scale and check it again, but you may have to save the file(give it another name) before it will print diferently. Not sure but that's my guess.
Also maybe changing the sacle is not changing the print image size, so try looking at the actual dimensions or coordinate readings on the drawing after changing the scale.
Regards,

Wes,
Yes, I saved the drawing after changing the scale size. I noticed the rulers along the edge changed sizes, but when I printed it out on paper, it was still the same size that I started with.

I figured up an alternative that worked.

I set up the cam portion with a 3/32" bit, but when I did the machining, I cut it with a 1/8" bit to give me the clearance that I needed. I thought it was going to be too big, but it was right on for the copper sheet. I got one part made tonite. I'll get a picture posted of everything, but I want to get a part in the fabrication stage first. Then you will be able to see what is going on pretty much from start to finish.
Thanks
Mike

[metalworkz]

I'm glad you were able to find a work around, and it will be good to see the final parts.
I'm thinking the physical size of the part will not change but the dimension of the part will be bigger or smaller after scale is applied, so maybe the printed image is not changed as far as the size on paper goes.
Regards,

[BrassBuilder]

Here are some pics of the process.

At the top are the pieces that the valve covers actually sits on.
Below that is the die.
To the right is the punch.
To the right and below is the raw stamping.
Above that is a cleaned up stamping.

The last picture are three of the valve covers with the details soldered on.

It was really easy to make this. I cut the copper in a rectangle shape with about an 1/8" overlap. I heated it up to almost red (annealed) and cooled it. This made the copper really soft and pliable. I then just laid it over the die, lined up the punch and smacked it a few times with a hammer. I trimmed the excess off to the top of the die using a dremel tool and files and viola...finished parts!

I screwed up the parts though. The bottom right side should have been the same as the bottom left (symettrical). Due to a lack of attention to detail, I made the parts wrong. (It should have been obvious, but I missed it.) I am eventually going to do them correctly, but for now, these will work to get the rest of the parts fitted.

Mike

[metalworkz]

The parts turned out very good and look like the original picture you posted. How much more do you have to finish the model?
Regards,

[BrassBuilder]

The parts turned out very good and look like the original picture you posted. How much more do you have to finish the model?
Regards,

A LOT! LOL. I still need to make the turbocharger and exhaust system, the electrical system (generator/starter...), the fuel system (fuel injectors, fuel pumps, lines...), the pulleys for the front and gobs of detail parts. I am hoping the parts fabrication will start going a little faster since I am getting better at drawing parts and running the CNC mill. I figure I have a few months of work on the engine and then I'll start on the transmission. And then the rest of the truck.
Thanks for all the help.
Mike

[MIKE JEFFERS]

superb m8
now your a toolmaker

[BrassBuilder]

superb m8
now your a toolmaker

Thanks!

I cannot believe how much stuff I have learned on this in just a matter of a few weeks. I never believed I would have been this far along in this short of time.
Mike

[MIKE JEFFERS]

bet the wife still thinks your just messing about in the shed