[MechanoMan]

A 1HP VFD should have no problem bringing the spindle up to 8K RPM or any speed. Just can't cut super-hard.

Yes if your v/hz is wrong it will not work correctly. Also the overcurrent point is adjustable. The ramp-up speed can matter, but probably not that much.

A wire being disconnected could cause this... it can also fry the VFD.

[skmetal7]

Yeah, I have 7 different v/hz patterns, but I haven't been able to find what each does specifically. I can't get the motor to run past 11hz and changing the v/hz doesn't seem to change much. Do I need to worry about carrier frequency? There is a setting for "carrier mode" it was set to 2 phase pwm, I changed it to 3 phase pwm and it seemed to run better, but still tripped and was drawing over 7A.

EDIT: used v/hz setting 7, and raised max frequency to 400hz, Got it to run but trips due to too fast acceleration, even though it's only drawing 2.5A and I'm slowly raising the speed. The motor does draw about 6.5A untill it reaches 1000RPMs then it starts to drop. Trips at 30hz.

EDIT 2: OK got it working..... the drive has a Mid Level Frequency setting and it kept tripping at 30Hz, well that's where the setting was at, but it kept telling me OVERCURRENT IDIOT! So that's why I was so confused... Running great!

[mactec54]

Yeah, I have 7 different v/hz patterns, but I haven't been able to find what each does specifically. I can't get the motor to run past 11hz and changing the v/hz doesn't seem to change much. Do I need to worry about carrier frequency? There is a setting for "carrier mode" it was set to 2 phase pwm, I changed it to 3 phase pwm and it seemed to run better, but still tripped and was drawing over 7A.

EDIT: used v/hz setting 7, and raised max frequency to 400hz, Got it to run but trips due to too fast acceleration, even though it's only drawing 2.5A and I'm slowly raising the speed. The motor does draw about 6.5A untill it reaches 1000RPMs then it starts to drop. Trips at 30hz.

EDIT 2: OK got it working..... the drive has a Mid Level Frequency setting and it kept tripping at 30Hz, well that's where the setting was at, but it kept telling me OVERCURRENT IDIOT! So that's why I was so confused... Running great!

Your lowest setting can't be below 100Hz, or you will damage the spindle, it does not take many times of overcurrent to damage the spindle, you should not be using a pattern setup as well with these spindles

[pastormark]

Isacon A131 Inverter
Geckodrive G540 Controller
Mach 3

I thought I bought the 120V version, it came as 220V according to the "manual" but the power terminals say L & N. Hmmmm. That looks like 120V to me. Any thoughts?
Also, the Geckodrive G540 notes VFD control on pins 7-9; ground, output & +10VDC respectively. That's pretty neat and orderly.
But the Isacon A131 has sixteen terminal pins with no clear indication (to me anyway) which belong to external control.

I can provide manual images upon request.

But has anyone else done such a hook-up? I would appreciate some technical help ...

Thanx!
mark

[mhasting2004]

MArk some parts of the world...like here in Oz 220-240 is single phase

[pastormark]

Sorry about the misunderstanding, I'm not concerned about single vs. three phase. Rather, 120V vs. 220V (or 240V as the case may be). If it is indeed a 220V then I will need to stub in another circuit with appropriate power line(s) just for this unit. More conduit. Another breaker. Specialty 15A receptacle. Etc. Etc. Not such a big deal. Just more work. Was hoping to avoid that.

My confusion on this point is that the literature notes L & N as input. This typically is used for 120V. If it had said L1, L2 and N then I would be more comfortable with the setup.

However, my real concern is how to wire these units together such that Mach3 controls the spindle.

So PC/Mach3 ==> Geckodrive G540 ==> Isacon A131 Inverter (motor control)

Got any ideas?

Thanx!
mark

[mhasting2004]

I'm not familiar with your VFD so can't help there. My Huanyang is controlled via serial comms and a patched up Modbus plugin (heaps of info on the threads about this one.) What I meant to say is the L N and earth are how single phase 240 is noted here with L1,L2,L3 for our 3 phase 240 VAC

Not a sparky but if your concerned its a 220 version and you put 120 into it that should not fry anything compared to the opposite. ...maybe...

[mactec54]

Isacon A131 Inverter
Geckodrive G540 Controller
Mach 3

I thought I bought the 120V version, it came as 220V according to the "manual" but the power terminals say L & N. Hmmmm. That looks like 120V to me. Any thoughts?
Also, the Geckodrive G540 notes VFD control on pins 7-9; ground, output & +10VDC respectively. That's pretty neat and orderly.
But the Isacon A131 has sixteen terminal pins with no clear indication (to me anyway) which belong to external control.

I can provide manual images upon request.

But has anyone else done such a hook-up? I would appreciate some technical help ...

Thanx!
mark

No you can not use the N terminal for USA unless the VFD Drive is for 120V, you need to check this and Know for sure what the Input Voltage is, if the drive for sure is 220v then you connect to the R/L1 & T/L3 2 Hot wires & a Ground wire to the Ground Terminal

[crob09]

My confusion on this point is that the literature notes L & N as input. This typically is used for 120V. If it had said L1, L2 and N then I would be more comfortable with the setup.
However, my real concern is how to wire these units together such that Mach3 controls the spindle.
So PC/Mach3 ==> Geckodrive G540 ==> Isacon A131 Inverter (motor control)
Got any ideas?

Thanx!
mark

For this there's one thing you need to figure out and that is.... How does the VFD connect to the Computer. Is it "Serial" or "Parallel"?

If it's a Serial Connection you will need to configure MODBUS in Mach3.

If the VFD is Parallel then you configure Mach3 based on the VFD output.

<== Geckodrive G540
<== Isacon A131 Inverter (motor control)
<== Position Sensor
PC/Mach3 <== RPM Hall Sensor
<== LED Lights
<== Other sensor. | Controller | Thing.

You get the idea... Configure the software to recognize the device.

Serial Devices have "Firmware" so a "Driver" or "API" are needed to communicate with them, for Mach3 Software you interface with external devices by configuring MODBUS.

[crob09]

Just one thing more related to the input you where asking about.
"L & N as input. This typically is used for 120V. If it had said L1, L2 and N then I would be more comfortable"

If you see "L1 L2" it just means there are two Outputs instead of one, if you have a "L&N" only it will work unless you have other devices to connect.

Now I say "Output" because the VFD is Driving the Motor, it is a Power Output that's Modulated (PWM, Pulse Width Modulation).

[mactec54]

Just one thing more related to the input you where asking about.
"L & N as input. This typically is used for 120V. If it had said L1, L2 and N then I would be more comfortable"

If you see "L1 L2" it just means there are two Outputs instead of one, if you have a "L&N" only it will work unless you have other devices to connect.

No this is not Correct

If he has L1/L & L2/ N it can still be 230v VFD for use in other Countries that have 230v Single Phase ( 1 ) Hot Neutral & Ground, it also means he may have the wrong VFD Drive for use in the USA

His VFD would have to be labeled for 120V use, or instructions with the VFD to say that it can use 120V, the 120V VFD drives have a Doubler built in to the Drive so that users can drive a 220v spindle and only have 120v power supply

So if his VFD does not have the Doubler built in it will not drive his 220v Spindle

[crob09]

What's incorrect about what I stated?
Check the rating of the VFD, it's a no brainer.... Don't plug 220 into 110V, also if it's 220VAC vs 110VAC it has nothing to do with a "Doubler" it's a Coil.
Also I didn't say "L1/L & L2/ N " Did I? BTW that is related to RMS power.
I said, quoted "L1 L2"...... Semantics....

So Correct! Don't plug in 220VAC into a device that requires 110VAC. Not hard to figure that one out for Most people.
Now... Same thing with Frequency, Don't plug it into a power source giving 60Hz if the device is made for 50Hz.

[mactec54]

What's incorrect about what I stated?
Check the rating of the VFD, it's a no brainer.... Don't plug 220 into 110V, also if it's 220VAC vs 110VAC it has nothing to do with a "Doubler" it's a Coil..

A no Brainer
You really do keep getting things messed up, the problem he has with his VFD is he brought it as a 120v VFD, but it is marked for 220v, they do not mark these cheap VFD drives that they are for 120v use, so how is he to know what he has, the only way is for him to contact the seller to make sure it is for 120v, or he can wire it for 120v & see if it will run his Spindle and give him max power that the spindle needs if it does then he will know that he has a 120v Drive, His 120v supply will need also to be able to handle the Amps needed to run correctly

Just one thing more related to the input you where asking about.
"L & N as input. This typically is used for 120V. If it had said L1, L2 and N then I would be more comfortable".

This is not typically used for 120v, this is Standard for 230v and 120v, it will depend on what country it has been configured for

Now... Same thing with Frequency, Don't plug it into a power source giving 60Hz if the device is made for 50Hz..

This is also not correct if a device is made for 50Hz, in most cases the only difference is there will be a 10% difference in the speed it runs at, if it's a motor, and in some cases will run slightly hotter have been doing this for 40 years on equipment with zero problems, now if it is made for 60Hz then you try and run it on 50Hz you will have a problem

If you see "L1 L2" it just means there are two Outputs instead of one, if you have a "L&N" only it will work unless you have other devices to connect.

L1 & L2 Terminals are the same as L & N Terminals or also called R & S just depends on the manufacture nothing else this is why you see them listed like this L/L1 N/L2 it can also look like this R/L1 S/L2 T/ L3

[crob09]

A no Brainer
You really do keep getting things messed up, the problem he has with his VFD is he brought it as a 120v VFD, but it is marked for 220v, they do not mark these cheap VFD drives that they are for 120v use, so how is he to know what he has, the only way is for him to contact the seller to make sure it is for 120v, or he can wire it for 120v & see if it will run his Spindle and give him max power that the spindle needs if it does then he will know that he has a 120v Drive, His 120v supply will need also to be able to handle the Amps needed to run correctly



This is not typically used for 120v, this is Standard for 230v and 120v, it will depend on what country it has been configured for



This is also not correct if a device is made for 50Hz, in most cases the only difference is there will be a 10% difference in the speed it runs at, if it's a motor, and in some cases will run slightly hotter have been doing this for 40 years on equipment with zero problems, now if it is made for 60Hz then you try and run it on 50Hz you will have a problem



L1 & L2 Terminals are the same as L & N Terminals or also called R & S just depends on the manufacture nothing else this is why you see them listed like this L/L1 N/L2 it can also look like this R/L1 S/L2 T/ L3

Wow you have some reading to do Mactec54

Think about what is transpiring in a Mechanical (Electrical) sense, do you think that VFD is supplying the Motor with AC Voltage? Think about that first then look into how that AC is converted into DC.

You will always supply a higher power rating to the motor, this power is measured in Wattage, we get Wattage by multiplying Amperage * Voltage, so, if we always supply a higher Wattage than necessary what part of that equation causes damage? Voltage or Amperage?

The answer is Voltage, so we need to supply a higher Amperage; now how doe we make a motor go faster!..? The answer we regulate the Voltage, this is what the VFD is for...

So.... I'm mixed up you say?

Connect it however you like! Live and learn folks. Listen to Mactec54 and plug 220Vac into a device that works with a 110Vac supply, and don't worry about frequency, 60Hz is fine with a 50Hz device... Nothing bad will happen!

Good luck!

[daniellyall]

ok Mactec did not say run it on 240 check first before connecting is what he was driving at. to person with problem ask first before connecting if not sure take it to some one who will back up his words

[mactec54]

Wow you have some reading to do Mactec54

Think about what is transpiring in a Mechanical (Electrical) sense, do you think that VFD is supplying the Motor with AC Voltage? Think about that first then look into how that AC is converted into DC.

You will always supply a higher power rating to the motor, this power is measured in Wattage, we get Wattage by multiplying Amperage * Voltage, so, if we always supply a higher Wattage than necessary what part of that equation causes damage? Voltage or Amperage?

The answer is Voltage, so we need to supply a higher Amperage; now how doe we make a motor go faster!..? The answer we regulate the Voltage, this is what the VFD is for...

You obviously have not knowledge, what's so ever, about VFD Drives, and how they work ,I'm not sure how people can come up with information like what you have just posted, you are lucky I'm being nice

We manufacture the Power modules ( The Heart ) that is used in VFD Drives and Servo Drives

I also repair VFD Drives after guys like you destroy them

[daniellyall]

good boy mactec

[A_Camera]

Wow you have some reading to do Mactec54

Think about what is transpiring in a Mechanical (Electrical) sense, do you think that VFD is supplying the Motor with AC Voltage? Think about that first then look into how that AC is converted into DC.

You will always supply a higher power rating to the motor, this power is measured in Wattage, we get Wattage by multiplying Amperage * Voltage, so, if we always supply a higher Wattage than necessary what part of that equation causes damage? Voltage or Amperage?

The answer is Voltage, so we need to supply a higher Amperage; now how doe we make a motor go faster!..? The answer we regulate the Voltage, this is what the VFD is for...

So.... I'm mixed up you say?

Connect it however you like! Live and learn folks. Listen to Mactec54 and plug 220Vac into a device that works with a 110Vac supply, and don't worry about frequency, 60Hz is fine with a 50Hz device... Nothing bad will happen!

Good luck!

I think you are confused AC motors with DC motors. A VFD is of course providing AC voltage, but the frequency is variable, that is why it is called VFD, it stands for Variable Frequency Driver. Speed is of course regulated by the output frequency. Yes, current (what you call "amperage") is calculated by P / V = I or the other way, V * I = P to calculate power. All that is important for the theory, but when it comes to RPM, it is actually no longer relevant because while the speed of a motor can be regulated by voltage, it can also be done by frequency. A VFD is for providing three phase output, which is of course AC voltage but with a frequency varied between for example 0.5 and 400Hz. Check this picture as example:

Attachment 315452

It is pretty clear that you are wrong, even by looking at the label. It says that the output is 0.5-400 Hz, 3 phase 200-240V. The output voltage is dependent on the input voltage, which in this example it can be between 200 and 240V but the motor RPM is not dependent on the output voltage, only on the output frequency. The input frequency can be 50 or 60Hz, but the output frequency is independent of that. For this VFD, and as far as I know, for every other one as well, it doesn't matter if you drive it with 50 or 60Hz, so that is the only thing you are right about.

I am no VFD expert and in fact not even having one yet, but I am in the process of buying one, which is why I am looking at it and check how it works and what is what. One thing was though VERY clear to me, even before looking at any specs, was that the RPM is NOT regulated by the voltage, but the frequency. That's the very idea behind VFD use. Otherwise you could not pull out the power your are getting at any speed. Look at Ohms law, if you reduce the voltage you will lose power.

[aarggh]

I am no VFD expert and in fact not even having one yet, but I am in the process of buying one, which is why I am looking at it and check how it works and what is what. One thing was though VERY clear to me, even before looking at any specs, was that the RPM is NOT regulated by the voltage, but the frequency. That's the very idea behind VFD use. Otherwise you could not pull out the power your are getting at any speed. Look at Ohms law, if you reduce the voltage you will lose power.

If you can, I'd recommend gettig a vectorless one, it will allow the spindle to retain torque at lower speeds. Much better, especially doing aluminium work.

cheers, Ian

[A_Camera]

If you can, I'd recommend gettig a vectorless one, it will allow the spindle to retain torque at lower speeds. Much better, especially doing aluminium work.

cheers, Ian

Thank you very much... Now you gave me a new headache... have to look up what is a "vectorless VFD" and check out the specs of my VFD alternatives again...

Just when I thought that EVERY VFD, including the cheapest one, provides constant torque at any RPM, or at least down to fairly low, like 5-6k...