[diyengineer]

Hi folks,
I just want to thank all of you hard working people for sharing your experiences with these spindles and VFD's. I firmly believe that without reading every one of the pages and pages of valuable information, i would not have been able to buy, set up and operate one of these chinese spindles correctly. Thank you.

David

[Oaktreeman]

Hi, I have the 1.5kw chinese water cooled spindle and vfd setup from keling and it came with no info at all about how to set it up or anything. I found the online manuals for it and got it up and going, It runs and works great, all but the rpm on the vfd only climbs up to 11,520 rpms @ 400hz. I have checked all the settings that i know to check on the vfd but cant figure this out to save my life. Im new to the vfd and spindles so not sure what im doing with it all yet. If anyone has had this same issue or may know what im doing wrong please share helpful info. Thanks
Michael

Before you go changing Poles, check actual speed. The speed on my VFD shows about half of what it actually is. I got a laser tachometer & proved it. The VFD shows about what yours does, but the laser shows within 3RPM of 24,000.

[BigKahunasigns]

Checked the pole settings p143, it was set for 4 (factory settings) I changed it to 2 pole, started it up and im getting the same prm readings, 11520. Seems nothing changed. I do not have a way of checking actual rpms at the tool but while cutting it sounds as if its cutting at the same speed as the 30,000 rpm router it replaced. If it is cutting at the right speed, im just wondering why it would be reading 11520 and not 24000.
Thanks for your help with this, hope i can get it sorted out. If it wasnt for this forum i wouldnt have gotten it going this far... Thanks guys!!

[diyengineer]

Checked the pole settings p143, it was set for 4 (factory settings) I changed it to 2 pole, started it up and im getting the same rpm readings, 11520. Seems nothing changed. I do not have a way of checking actual rpms at the tool but while cutting it sounds as if its cutting at the same speed as the 30,000 rpm router it replaced. If it is cutting at the right speed, i'm just wondering why it would be reading 11520 and not 24000.
Thanks for your help with this, hope i can get it sorted out. If it wasn't for this forum i wouldn't have gotten it going this far... Thanks guys!!

whoa wait. You you claim your getting 11,520 rpm. Then you just say you have no way of checking it?

Then you say its reading 11,520 and not 24,000.

Do you think it sounds like half speed??. Rpm can be calculated mathematically as dave22 expressed:

Motor RPM = (programmed frequency * mains power fequency) / number of pole pairs

eg. For a 4 pole motor
Motor RPM = (400hz*60hz)/2=12,000

eg. For a 2 pole motor
Motor RPM = (400hz*60hz)/1=24,000

This would be a wise investment
Digital Photo Sensor Tachometer

Changing the poles from 2 to 4, or vise versa should net a significant change in noise. Video tape each starting @ 0 hertz and crank the knob to full. If you have the acceleration constant one should take twice as long to spool up (to max speed). If you change your poles from 2-4 or 4-2 and your not noticing any difference in time, noise, or speed. Something is up...

I had mine set to 4 poles and it ran half speed. Changed it to 2 and she really toooook off! haha

[BigKahunasigns]

Im just baffled at this, I recorded and timed the spindle spooling up on both settings 2 and 4 poles, same time spooling up, sounds and cuts the same both ways....Any ideas???? must be something i have set wrong or maybe wired wrong??? seems like there should be some change when changing the settings from 2 to 4 and back...

[BigKahunasigns]

OK OK OK,,, Got it fingered out now!!! , PD144 Factory setting was still set for 1440,
PD144 = 3000 (not 1440) this will get the speed display right, so it was runing at 24000...
Thanks for all your help guys, I hope this will help others also.

[gearsoup]

Dumb quick question:

the 2.2kw spindles are listed as being three phase. Does the Hitachi output 3 phase power while only needing single phase input? Or do I need to consider a phase converter as well?

[ger21]

Does the Hitachi output 3 phase power while only needing single phase input?

Yes, but you probably need 220V single phase.

[gearsoup]

220 single phase isn't much of a problem. I've got a wash and dryer hookup very close to my garage. Just was afraid I would need to spring for a phase converter as well, since I'm quite a ways off from 3 phase service

[diyengineer]

Dumb quick question:

the 2.2kw spindles are listed as being three phase. Does the Hitachi output 3 phase power while only needing single phase input? Or do I need to consider a phase converter as well?

Yes it uses 220-240V AC single phase input. (it also accepted 3 phase input).

The VFD converts the single phase to 3 phase output for the spindle.

The manual recommends 30 amp breaker, and 10 gauge wire to the unit. Hope that helps!

[Greolt]

Motor RPM = (programmed frequency * mains power fequency) / number of pole pairs

eg. For a 4 pole motor
Motor RPM = (400hz*60hz)/2=12,000

eg. For a 2 pole motor
Motor RPM = (400hz*60hz)/1=24,000

Mains power frequency has nothing to do with it.

Could read,

"Motor RPM = (programmed frequency * 60) / number of pole pairs"

Or probably should read,

"Motor RPM = (programmed frequency * 120) / number of poles"

eg. For a 2 pole motor
Motor RPM = (400hz*120)/2=24,000

The fact that your mains frequency is 60hz is just a coincidence in this case.

Our mains frequency is 50hz. Does not mean we get a different RPM from 400hz.

Greg

[diyengineer]

Mains power frequency has nothing to do with it.

Should read,

"Motor RPM = (programmed frequency * 60) / number of pole pairs"

eg. For a 2 pole motor
Motor RPM = (400hz*60)/1=24,000

The fact that your mains frequency is 60hz is just a coincidence in this case.

Our mains frequency is 50hz. Does not mean we get a different RPM from 400hz.

Greg

Sorry i copied that quickly without fully reading it, figuring it would be right since its been talked about numerous times on the forum.. The constant should be 120, not 60. The math was wrong.

The speed of a AC induction motors depends upon 2 things.
A. Number of poles.
B. Frequency of applied power to the motor.

RPM= (120XFrequency) / (# of poles)

Our 2.2Kw spindles are 2 pole, and the Hitachi VFD puts out a max 400Hz.

(120x400)/(2)= 24,000 rpm max. Any speed can be calculated using this formula.

[Alphonsus]

I'm planning to buy a 1.5kw chinese air cooled spindle and got a doubt.

In the country I'm in, residential phases are 115V and 3phase 230V = 3 x 115 V phases. Can I feed this spindle with this phases or I need 1 or 3 x 220V phases to feed it?

Before asking here, I, ve asked a chinese ebay seller and he couldn't answer.

Thanks, in advance!

Alphonsus

[Oaktreeman]

I'm planning to buy a 1.5kw chinese air cooled spindle and got a doubt.

In the country I'm in, residential phases are 115V and 3phase 230V = 3 x 115 V phases. Can I feed this spindle with this phases

I phoned my electrician friend. He said "220 three phase is called 220 because measuring from leg to leg will give you 220". That is what you have, it should work just fine.

He did say some places have "high leg three phase". With that one leg to ground reads about 190 volts and the other two about 115V. You could still use it, but in a different circumstance you'd have to be careful if you had a 110V device that ran off one leg.

[Alphonsus]

Thnks, Oaktreeman!

In Brazil we also have 190 and 220V phases, but they're available to comercial and industrial uses only and, since you can feed these spindle matching inverters with 1 x 220V phase, this doubt has came out.

[Nadiel]

Hello everyone. I have a great Request. I want to buy a spindle and an inverter on eBay, with 2.2 kW or 1.5kW power but must have collets ER16 or ER20 and do not know where to order. I'm afraid to order something to be damaged. We ask those who have bought something to me and guide me to a serious seller and quality products. Thank you very much. Regards.
P.S. My English is translated by Google Translate.

[nick mulder]

Hello everyone. I have a great Request. I want to buy a spindle and an inverter on eBay, with 2.2 kW or 1.5kW power but must have collets ER16 or ER20 and do not know where to order. I'm afraid to order something to be damaged. We ask those who have bought something to me and guide me to a serious seller and quality products. Thank you very much. Regards.
P.S. My English is translated by Google Translate.

CTCtools.biz - collets made in china also - they both arrive and work...

Probably not much use spending top dollar on collets for the spindles discussed here... Unless of course you have a mind to upgrade

[Oaktreeman]

I bought a 2.2kw spindle with matching inverter from LoveHappy (Lovehappyshopping?) on eBay. No problems. Honest people and packaged well, BUT, everyone that orders from China takes a small risk of damage in shipping. Cross that bridge if you come to it.

If you can afford it, get the 2.2. The larger collet is handy and the extra power can't hurt.

[diyengineer]

I bought a 2.2kw spindle with matching inverter from LoveHappy (Lovehappyshopping?) on eBay. No problems. Honest people and packaged well, BUT, everyone that orders from China takes a small risk of damage in shipping. Cross that bridge if you come to it.

If you can afford it, get the 2.2. The larger collet is handy and the extra power can't hurt.

Agreed. I bought from love happy also.

[Nadiel]

Thanks for the replies, I would like a link (Lovehappyshopping) if possible (I want to order) and another link from where can I get a complete set of colets ER20, waterpump and radiator.
Thanks again.