[Xnaron]

Sure were, seem to be better than the ones I bought from sports authority. The ones from the store had the slightest amount of side to side movement, where as these seem right on. I'm attaching some pictures of them. He sold me some 608zz's and half inch one's too along with other items. Really gave me a good deal. Threw in some energy chain for free. Makes me regret not buying the 200oz motors he had but I wanted the highest amount of torque I could get.

Also check out the elcheapo bearing block I just made. Once the CNC is made, I plan to make a more legit bearing block setup but this will do for now. I just Basically drilled a hole to fit the bearing in snugly on the top and bottom. The two bolts on the side hold it tight and square. I'll need to make 5 more, 2 per axis. But I have to say I'm really tempted to order these off of ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/2-1-2-UCP201-8-P...%3A1|294%3A200



I also got my steppers, powersupply, and a few others in from Keling. Very fast shipping.

I'm posting an update of my sketchup design with the z axis that nearly kicked my butt. I hope to have all that is in that picture done this upcoming weekend.

Those pillow block bearings are pretty common. You should be able to find those locally for much cheaper.

[FandZ]

Really? Great, do I try a hardware store or automotive? Man, that would be great.

Those pillow block bearings are pretty common. You should be able to find those locally for much cheaper.

[chrugel]

Hey Chris. Long time no chat. If I remember correctly you had some issues with racking and scared me silly about racking..lol Have you decided how you are going to fix it? I'd imagine it's just a case of having to slap on some more metal.

I really didn't get as much done as I had hoped this past weekend. Plus I have guests coming around the 20th, So I'm thinking it'll be around the first of march.

I was really stressing about the bearing blocks. But now that I have that behind me, maybe I can make faster progress. I'll be happy if I could get the X axis and Y axis fully done, with motors mounted, this weekend.

My racking problem is still there but since my Y and for that matter X axis is center driven i can do simple cuts with very low cuttingforce without problems. My problems first occur at about 10N of force at the tool when it is close to the edges of the x axis.
The solution on the gantry racking will be a cross wire "thing", but the bending of my x axis screw i have no solution for at the time.


I really like your design, simple and effective! (opposed to mine, complicated and ineffective! )
Keep up the good work!

regards
Chris

[Xnaron]

Really? Great, do I try a hardware store or automotive? Man, that would be great.

If you live in a city you will be surprised at just how many bearing supply companys there are. At least where I live there are lots. I am not sure if you would find these in a hardware store. In Canada we have a store called Princess Auto. They sell tools, surplus electronics, stuff for welding, hydraulics, pretty much anything cool. I think they used to cater to farmers at one point. I even bought some surplus stepper motors from them. I built a fullsize hovercraft and got the pillow block bearings from them. I would phone around. Its surprising sometimes how much of this stuff is available locally.

[FandZ]

I called around a good bit at work today. I found about 6 places that had pillow bearing blocks but they were all too big. But searching online I found these 3. I'm trying to decide which to get

http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/se...-Pillow/Detail

http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/se...-Pillow/Detail

http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/se...Bearing/Detail

The third one sounds the best but I don't know what a cam lock is. The secound one is the winner so far.

If you live in a city you will be surprised at just how many bearing supply companys there are. At least where I live there are lots. I am not sure if you would find these in a hardware store. In Canada we have a store called Princess Auto. They sell tools, surplus electronics, stuff for welding, hydraulics, pretty much anything cool. I think they used to cater to farmers at one point. I even bought some surplus stepper motors from them. I built a fullsize hovercraft and got the pillow block bearings from them. I would phone around. Its surprising sometimes how much of this stuff is available locally.

[Xnaron]

I've been thinking of building a machine that utilizes the same slide mechanisms as yours. I drew a picture of it as my sketchup skills are 5 minutes old. I am planning on a bigger machine maybe 2'x4' or 4'x4' My gantry would be supported by 1/2" aluminum plate. I would secure the plates to the bottom slides using the existing bolts in the slide mech but flip one set of bolts around so they both go in the same way on the side top and bottom. I will cut some HDPE to fit inside square alum so it doesn't squish when I torque the bolts down. The gantry rails are attached to the gantry sides with angle aluminum, 2" if I can get it. I chose to seperate the rails and use two slide bearing units to support the z axis. I think I would attach a 1/2" aluminum plate to the upper and lower gantry slide. Not sure yet what the z-axis will look like.

Sorry for the crappy drawing.

about the bearings... did you uses 609zz on the slides like this http://cgi.ebay.com/20-Bearing-609ZZ...3A1%7C294%3A50

[Xnaron]

I called around a good bit at work today. I found about 6 places that had pillow bearing blocks but they were all too big. But searching online I found these 3. I'm trying to decide which to get

http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/se...-Pillow/Detail

http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/se...-Pillow/Detail

http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/se...Bearing/Detail

The third one sounds the best but I don't know what a cam lock is. The secound one is the winner so far.

A cam lock will lock the shaft into the bearing so the it does not spin inside the bearing inner ring and forces the bearing to function as it should. On pillow block bearings the cam loc is a ring that fits over a collar on the bearing and you twist the collar over the cam which tensions the it on the shaft. The cam is basically an off center circle on the inner bearing ring. Sorry for the lousy explanation.

The middle bearing uses set screws to stop the shaft from rotating inside the bearing. The last bearing uses the cam lock. It is the black ring you see. The black ring is removeable from the bearing.

The nice thing about a pillow block bearing is that the bearing kind of floats in the block and will adjust itself to make itself perpendicular to the shaft (within reason of course).

[FandZ]

Looking good man. I think you will really like the roller assemblies. With one that big I'd go with steel rails for sure. You can get 8ft sections for under 15 bucks. Also on your Y axis, I would go with 2 rails. Since you are going big why not go all out I can't tell you how many sketches I made at work during meetings and over breaks. Just wish I could draw as well as you.

When you first put your rollers together, you are going to be tempted to run your bearings down the center. Having them on the edge and catercorner to each other is what you want. That way, up and down loads turns into a twisting force, which further strengthens it. Also you will be running on the strongest part of the extrusion. It's a win win situation.

Also I just redid my my rollers with steel instead of aluminum. I thought they were great before, but now they are awesome.Since the steel doens't give they are perfectly square and roll even smoother. I was surprised

X axis: I know it seems like spacing the rails further apart is ideal but it is not. The problem you run into, is at the center, you will have a biting force squeezing them together which will cause racking. With the rails together they are solid as a rock. Also, the twisting forces that help on the Y axis still apply when the are together given you even greater strength. If you really want them apart, then I'd sugest you use 4 bars. Two high butted together and two low. A roller assembly on each.

Sh!t!.. if you do two sets of rails and two rollers, one high and one low, you can use A vertical bar to connect them and run a roller assembly down it for a Z axis! Why did I not think about that sooner? I'll sketch up what I'm talking about and post it. I have the daunting realization that'll I'll be redoing my gantry this weekend. Thanks a lot bud...

Last but not least, avoid the angle. It looks sexy but it is a pain. things end up cheaper useing square tubing. A lot less holes to drill too. If you must use angle check out this thread with my original designs. There may be some Ideas in there that you like. http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...t=69385&page=3

Please don't take any of my suggestions the wrong way. It's has just been a long road and I still have a ways to go. I'll do whatever I can to help someone else trying to build a cnc. This stuff aint easy Of course, it's all cake and pie if you have a cnc.

I've been thinking of building a machine that utilizes the same slide mechanisms as yours. I drew a picture of it as my sketchup skills are 5 minutes old. I am planning on a bigger machine maybe 2'x4' or 4'x4' My gantry would be supported by 1/2" aluminum plate. I would secure the plates to the bottom slides using the existing bolts in the slide mech but flip one set of bolts around so they both go in the same way on the side top and bottom. I will cut some HDPE to fit inside square alum so it doesn't squish when I torque the bolts down. The gantry rails are attached to the gantry sides with angle aluminum, 2" if I can get it. I chose to seperate the rails and use two slide bearing units to support the z axis. I think I would attach a 1/2" aluminum plate to the upper and lower gantry slide. Not sure yet what the z-axis will look like.

Sorry for the crappy drawing.

[FandZ]

Fantastic. 6 Cam lock pillow block bearings are ordered. :banana: You have been a big help. Thanks so much for posting.

BTW my Mother lives in Calgary. She high tailed it up to Canada when Bush got reelected.lol

A cam lock will lock the shaft into the bearing so the it does not spin inside the bearing inner ring and forces the bearing to function as it should. On pillow block bearings the cam loc is a ring that fits over a collar on the bearing and you twist the collar over the cam which tensions the it on the shaft. The cam is basically an off center circle on the inner bearing ring. Sorry for the lousy explanation.

The middle bearing uses set screws to stop the shaft from rotating inside the bearing. The last bearing uses the cam lock. It is the black ring you see. The black ring is removeable from the bearing.

The nice thing about a pillow block bearing is that the bearing kind of floats in the block and will adjust itself to make itself perpendicular to the shaft (within reason of course).

[Xnaron]

Looking good man. I think you will really like the roller assemblies. With one that big I'd go with steel rails for sure. You can get 8ft sections for under 15 bucks. Also on your Y axis, I would go with 2 rails. Since you are going big why not go all out I can't tell you how many sketches I made at work during meetings and over breaks. Just wish I could draw as well as you.

When you first put your rollers together, you are going to be tempted to run your bearings down the center. Having them on the edge and catercorner to each other is what you want. That way, up and down loads turns into a twisting force, which further strengthens it. Also you will be running on the strongest part of the extrusion. It's a win win situation.

Also I just redid my my rollers with steel instead of aluminum. I thought they were great before, but now they are awesome.Since the steel doens't give they are perfectly square and roll even smoother. I was surprised

X axis: I know it seems like spacing the rails further apart is ideal but it is not. The problem you run into, is at the center, you will have a biting force squeezing them together which will cause racking. With the rails together they are solid as a rock. Also, the twisting forces that help on the Y axis still apply when the are together given you even greater strength. If you really want them apart, then I'd sugest you use 4 bars. Two high butted together and two low. A roller assembly on each.

Sh!t!.. if you do two sets of rails and two rollers, one high and one low, you can use A vertical bar to connect them and run a roller assembly down it for a Z axis! Why did I not think about that sooner? I'll sketch up what I'm talking about and post it. I have the daunting realization that'll I'll be redoing my gantry this weekend. Thanks a lot bud...

Last but not least, avoid the angle. It looks sexy but it is a pain. things end up cheaper useing square tubing. A lot less holes to drill too. If you must use angle check out this thread with my original designs. There may be some Ideas in there that you like. http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...t=69385&page=3

Please don't take any of my suggestions the wrong way. It's has just been a long road and I still have a ways to go. I'll do whatever I can to help someone else trying to build a cnc. This stuff aint easy Of course, it's all cake and pie if you have a cnc.

Thanks for the detailed reply! I thought the steel rails would probably be required. One thing I've noticed with steel square tube as opposed to aluminum square tube is that the edges are rounded on the steel tube. Did this cause a problem at all? Also steel can be pretty banged up as it gets thrown around a lot when handled. Did you find it hard to find some steel in good shape nice and smooth (straight too)?

I'll definitely go with your bearing config and keep them in the opposite corners.

For x-axis when you say rails together you mean relativley close? Is that why you have the spacers on the sides? I guess I am not perfectly clear on what you are suggesting. I will have to re-read and think about it more.

Sorry to make you rethink your y-axis design. I am anxious to see more progress pics.

When you say avoid the angle you mean the gantry side plate angle? I've seen other machines use it and I wasn't exactly clear why. I thought it might help centering the load on the gantry by moving the spindle closer to the center and offsetting the twisting force?

Hey your suggestions are awesome. I have experience at designing and building quite a few things but this is my first cnc.

Small world... we are just north of Calgary as you probably already know.

[FandZ]

It is the Z axis that I've found a new simple solution for. It's so simple it is brilliant. Thank you I'm tinkering with it now in sketchup. I should have it posted in 20 minutes or so.

[FandZ]

Here she is. You may notice the round spacers under the Z axis rails. Those could be a bolt or washers. There just needs to be a spacer to clear the X axis roller assemblies to get the most travel.

Now that will be freaking solid. I'll be building it this weekend. May start cutting it tomorrow night.

Man now I'm all excited. I won't get any sleep tonight. lol

[FandZ]

I havn't posted my latest gantry design. You'll see what I mean in the sketchup file I just posted.

There is zero problems rolling on steel even though it isn't as square as aluminum. The corners don't come into play they actually roll just past them. It isn't, however, as flat as aluminum. You can adjust for the 1 or 2 mm dips throughout the metal by tightening the roller assemblies a little tighter. But you have to realize, the law of averages comes into play. It may dip 1mm here or there but you are rolling on 8 bearings so it is 1mm divided by 8 once it reaches the cutting tool. Atleast I think so. It isn't somethign to worry about. If it is, once your machine is built you could use it to take a mm off of your rails corners. Then swap them in and out till you get them perfect. Know what I mean?

Now, you can actually tighten it so much that you can't roll it. What I've done is make a set just to make really tight and roll it back and forth a few times and it makes a flat track. It preps the rail for my permanent rollers.

I just found the angle a pain to wok with. Plus you'll be securing it near its weakest/most flexing point, meddle to the edge. But if you use square steel or aluminum, everything squares itself up.

Every few years I make up to Canada. Peoples nice, airs nice, nice place all around. If I wasn't so stuck on driving fast and Cajun food, I could see myself moving there. :P

Thanks for the detailed reply! I thought the steel rails would probably be required. One thing I've noticed with steel square tube as opposed to aluminum square tube is that the edges are rounded on the steel tube. Did this cause a problem at all? Also steel can be pretty banged up as it gets thrown around a lot when handled. Did you find it hard to find some steel in good shape nice and smooth (straight too)?

I'll definitely go with your bearing config and keep them in the opposite corners.

For x-axis when you say rails together you mean relativley close? Is that why you have the spacers on the sides? I guess I am not perfectly clear on what you are suggesting. I will have to re-read and think about it more.

Sorry to make you rethink your y-axis design. I am anxious to see more progress pics.

When you say avoid the angle you mean the gantry side plate angle? I've seen other machines use it and I wasn't exactly clear why. I thought it might help centering the load on the gantry by moving the spindle closer to the center and offsetting the twisting force?

Hey your suggestions are awesome. I have experience at designing and building quite a few things but this is my first cnc.

Small world... we are just north of Calgary as you probably already know.

[chrugel]

WOW ,i must say it has happend a lot here while i were sleeping!

Looks like an interesting Z axis design FandZ, but how are you going to drive it? did not quite understand that. I cant see you have mentioned it anywhere.
Bearing blocks surely makes the job a lot easier! I made mine in HDPE plastic, probably not ideal, but that part of my design seems to be working rather well. I have no detectable backlash anywhere. Using ABEC7 scatebearings and Thrust bearings. Turned out to be a rather complicated setup but it works.


regards
Chris

[Scott_M]

Hi Chris (FandZ)
It's Scott from Icrontic. I hadn't seen an update to your blog in awhile so I came looking for you. Looks Like you got it beefed up pretty good ! And I feel much better about the switch to steel.
I am not sure if you ever got the PM I sent you but the offer is still good. I just know you are gonna need a part - you need your finished machine to make - to finish your machine....( Wow that was confusing ) Let me know If I can be of assistance.

I know this is a bit out of the scope of your design but I thought it was a pretty cool idea. It'll get your head going.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59630

Good luck

Scott

[FandZ]

Woa, I just checked out the video on your vertical lathe. This really is your world and we are just playing in it. That was impressive. And yea, it has me thinking...lol

I struggled some with the design (still am but it's getting easier) and kept changing my mind on things and I never got around to committing to one tool or another. I'm sorry I never replied to your PM. It's really been a lot of trial and error. Thank you for being gracious and keeping your offer open.

Last weekend I made a gantry but never mounted it. It looks like I'll be making another one this weekend. I've been waiting till I had my gantry mounted before I made another blog post. Just wish I could take a week off of work to get it all done.

I'll be in touch. I'm trying to stick with my goal and build a fully hardware store cnc but your probably right, it could come down to one part where I'll need it made.

Chris

Hi Chris (FandZ)
It's Scott from Icrontic. I hadn't seen an update to your blog in awhile so I came looking for you. Looks Like you got it beefed up pretty good ! And I feel much better about the switch to steel.
I am not sure if you ever got the PM I sent you but the offer is still good. I just know you are gonna need a part - you need your finished machine to make - to finish your machine....( Wow that was confusing ) Let me know If I can be of assistance.

I know this is a bit out of the scope of your design but I thought it was a pretty cool idea. It'll get your head going.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59630

Good luck

Scott

[FandZ]

I drew up two Ideas for driving it. There's akethup file too. I like the double rail Idea better but I could see me sticking with doing just a one sided drive. I'll probably try it with one and if I don't like it move on to two.

I need to google Thrust bearings. I keep seeing that phrase and am not sure what they are. Sounds like something I could use.

WOW ,i must say it has happend a lot here while i were sleeping!

Looks like an interesting Z axis design FandZ, but how are you going to drive it? did not quite understand that. I cant see you have mentioned it anywhere.
Bearing blocks surely makes the job a lot easier! I made mine in HDPE plastic, probably not ideal, but that part of my design seems to be working rather well. I have no detectable backlash anywhere. Using ABEC7 scatebearings and Thrust bearings. Turned out to be a rather complicated setup but it works.




regards
Chris

[FandZ]

Besides my pillow bearing blocks, I think all of my parts have arrived. I think I went a little overboard with 30 feet of the shielded wire for my steppers. I may just have to try and use that for all my home switches and limit switches. Not sure how that'll work out on the limit switches since they have 3 connections. Only thing left to get are some 1/4watt 1k resisters. Not sure where the resisters go in the line with the steppers but Hopefully I can bug CR a little for the answer.

My only concern is with my Gecko order. I noticed one of the corners is bent and there are some light scratches on the back of the G540.I'm wondering if it may be a returned unit. I've only heard outstanding things about them and their customer service. If I run into any troubles I will see if their reputation holds true. I may send an email, just to let them know in case I run into any problems.


I hope to make big progress over the weekend. It won't be actual go time till next weekend (if I'm lucky). I'm going to try my hardest to stay offline to save all my energy and focus for the final leg of the build. So if you post and I don't reply Friday onwards please forgive me.


Hope you enjoy the pictures.

[Crevice Reamer]

I'm glad to see this really coming together for you!

Micro switches either have Normally Closed or Normally Open contacts. Micro switches with 3 connections have BOTH and a common, so they can be wired either way. Homes are often wired NO and limits are often wired NC in series. So three inputs on the G540 will be used for NO home switches and one input for all of the series wired NC limit switches. Of course the second wires of these circuits return to one of the ground terminals.

It is also possible to forego limit switches entirely and just set up software travel limits in Mach3:

http://syilamerica.com/docs/Homing_V...%20Limits.html

Wire the Estop switch on the Red side.

If you look at the motor connectors on the G540, each one shows where the resistor goes. Also in the manual:

Gecko G540 manual:

http://geckodrive.com/upload/G540%20REV3%20MANUAL.pdf

Setup guide:

http://geckodrive.com/upload/G540InitialSetup.pdf

CR

[FandZ]

Yep, I see how obvious the resisters are now. Stamp a big doh on my forehead. lol

I'm glad to see this really coming together for you!

Micro switches either have Normally Closed or Normally Open contacts. Micro switches with 3 connections have BOTH and a common, so they can be wired either way. Homes are often wired NO and limits are often wired NC in series. So three inputs on the G540 will be used for NO home switches and one input for all of the series wired NC limit switches. Of course the second wires of these circuits return to one of the ground terminals.

It is also possible to forego limit switches entirely and just set up software travel limits in Mach3:

http://syilamerica.com/docs/Homing_V...%20Limits.html

Wire the Estop switch on the Red side.

If you look at the motor connectors on the G540, each one shows where the resistor goes. Also in the manual:

Gecko G540 manual:

http://geckodrive.com/upload/G540%20REV3%20MANUAL.pdf

Setup guide:

http://geckodrive.com/upload/G540InitialSetup.pdf

CR