[Deadwood]

I live in Ontario and am looking to go back to school for Electronics Engineering Technician....not engineering but a 2 year diploma for technician level through Second Career funding.

I want to know what educational requirements and/or experience are employers looking for when hiring? Any recommendations of courses or experience?

I have many more questions... 20 of them...before I make a career change to this field, so if anyone would like to help me that would be great.

[Deadwood]

Really, nobody? You don't have to be from Ontario.

[tobyaxis]

They probably don't know. I don't. I'm thinking about changing careers too.

[CJL5585]

I want to know what educational requirements and/or experience are employers looking for when hiring? Any recommendations of courses or experience?

Well, first of all, if you have lots of electronic experience and training, you will find out that employers are looking to hire someone for an entry level position with entry level salary.

Secondly, many employers in the US do not know the difference between an electronic technician and an electrician. They think that a technician is just a highly skilled electrician. There used to be lots of these jobs with low to medium wages. In the US that would be $8.00 to $12.00 per hour.

Well educated Electronic Engineering Techs with lots of experience can make upwards of $60,000.00 per year in the US, but only with Fortune 250 and 500 companies. Occasional jobs come open at small technology companies with very reasonable salary.

In my career in electronics, my highest paying position was working for the government in electronic security which required training and experience in microwaves, UHF, VHF, and satellite communications, pulsed laser systems, computerized and wireless remote control camera installations, electronic security fencing systems, computer controlled doors, locks, phone systems, etc. However, in this field one should be able to integrate various elements into a system, and be proficient in the installation, troubleshooting, and repair of these types of equipment.

What I would consider as an experienced electronic engineering tech would be an individual who could troubleshoot any type equipment, using almost any make or type of test equipment to the component level, and be competent in the repair of same. I realize that in today's world this is almost a lost art, being that we live in a throw-away society.

I was in this field for 40+ years until I took early retirement. Working with leading edge technology will take it's toll on one due to the fact that some companies will want equipment repaired that they only have partial schematics, and very little documentation especially when they design and build prototype units.

Training courses will consist of Fundamentals of AC and DC voltage and current, resistors, capacitors, inductors, fuses, current conductors and insulating materials. It should also include designing, building, troubleshooting of some small really simple circuits from breadboards or kits. It will include different types of motors, generators, and so forth. To specialize in certain areas, one must have training in the areas that are required, whether it is in something like a licensed function (controlled by the government or state), or in industrial electronics (robots, CNC machines, lasers, etc) or something as simple as home computer repairs.


My recommendation would be to discuss your ambitions with a college instructor who teaches electronics. Most likely they will be able to give you up to date information on the changes in the field, and can give you very good ideas on salary, benefits, and so forth.

Here's wishing you the best. Electronics is not a field for the faint hearted, nor for the individual who cannot believe solely in theory. One cannot see voltage or current, just a reading of what is present, how long it is present, how it reacts while present, and the end result. In essence, the last sentence defines the whole field of electronics.

Hope this helps.

[Al_The_Man]

Another area that potential employers look for is a proficiency in PLC control, much of factory automation has converted over to this for some years now.
One thing I see as I visit different facilities or are called in to help trouble shoot problems, is the inability to logical trouble shoot.
You often see a prevalence of hit-and-miss diagnosing, or lack of.
It is very important to know how to read prints and schematics, these are one of your most valuable tools.
Al.

[CJL5585]

Another area that potential employers look for is a proficiency in PLC control, much of factory automation has converted over to this for some years now.
One thing I see as I visit different facilities or are called in to help trouble shoot problems, is the inability to logical trouble shoot.
You often see a prevalence of hit-and-miss diagnosing, or lack of.
It is very important to know how to read prints and schematics, these are one of your most valuable tools.
Al.

I agree with Al. This is a very good field to get into these days, and some community colleges offer courses on the programming, troubleshooting methods, and repair of PLC's.

Only thing is, there are many manufacturers of PLC's and they are simular, but yet different in programming, so one would need to know something about the different models, as factories sometimes will have PLC's from several manufacturer's in-house, especially if they purchase a machine with PLC controls.

With any kind of background in PLC's, you should be able to get a job, maybe not the one you want, but be able to have steady employment in this economy.(US here)

Jerry

[Deadwood]

I agree, I do see job ads including PLCs mostly on Millwrights, which I do have a diploma in. Programming is something I'm seriously going to learn cause what is the point of having electronic components if you can't control or tell them what to do.

The problem with the 2 years of schooling I'm looking at is it is basic/introductory knowledge in areas like programming. It is however strong in areas of troubleshooting, diagnosing, component theory/fundamentals, process control and automation( I believe that covers PLCs).

I'm not interested working as a sales representive, satellite installer, or telecommunication...which are areas that are increasing.

What I want to do or will have to do at start is be an electronics assembler in a company that will support continuous education....I'll go back part-time to become a Technologist so I can work more with engineers assisting in testing, designing and developing subassemblies, prototypes and what have you....I think I will be comfortable in this postion....more paperwork though...

If I chose to I could step it up to engineering level...though I doubt this due to expense and length.

What I would like to know is do you find your career field challenging and personally satisfying? Why?

And ofcourse, what is the future outlook in this occupation? New development/technology?

I know it involves continuous education, but what other areas are needed other than what has been covered...programming, troubleshooting, PLC...seems like to me TELECOMMUNICATIONS field will continue to change and is a large industry...CJL5585 has been very helpful pointing this out.

Thanks to everyone so far :cheers:

[Deadwood]

One more thing.

I'm also going to be relocating in an area referred to as "Tri-Tech", consists of some cities in very close proximity to each other...Waterloo Region, Ontario....which is close to the GTA(greater toronto area)

This will get me into the technology hub where innovation takes place....MAXIMIZE job opportunities...RIM who created the Blackberry is located here.

[Al_The_Man]

What I would like to know is do you find your career field challenging and personally satisfying? Why?

And ofcourse, what is the future outlook in this occupation? New development/technology?

I developed an interest in Electrical/electronic technology at an early age and have seen the changes from tubes to transistors to IC's, and have been fortunate enough to work in many fields of electronics, if you work hard at it, and get good at it, it is rewarding and trust me, you will be in demand.
I always say, I didn't work a day in my life, because when it became 'work' I moved on to other areas.
If you end up in a position where you can design or retro-fit systems, it is especially challenging as you rarely cover the same ground twice.
If you have the required aptitude for a particular career, then you are on your way to 'not working a day in your life'.
Many people have not figured out what Einstein meant in his quote in my sign off.
Al.

[ViperTX]

Not to discourage you, but personally I see anything related to manufacturing as future unemployment.

Personally, if I were entering the job market in the next few years I would focus on courses and work related to computer forensics, computer security, the type of work which can't be outsourced because of National/State/Province security concerns.

Paul

[Deadwood]

That brings up a question about specializing.

Should I look at being an electronics technician in:

Computers
Communications
Broadband Cable
Industrial Controls

These are being offered at colleges.

Or should I stick with Electronics Engineering Technician as a whole...it does cover the above...just not in such detail...more repairing, troubleshooting, analyzing...personally I think this will be a strong foundation upon which I could build on later as I see a need or interest.

[Al_The_Man]

Once you have a solid general background then you can look for the field that interests you the most.
Al.

[KIMFAB]

I have to agree with Al on this one. Get real good at something you enjoy while you are young and have the energy to dig a little harder than the next guy. The Navy was kind enough to give me training in electronics with specialties in radar, communications and instrumentation.
When I slid into the world of telefonery (you won't find that on GOOGLE) I found it only took 8-10 hrs a week to keep ahead of the pack. I too tried work a couple of times - didn't like it.

You want to get paid for what you know not for what you do. Above all stay away from the TV.

[Deadwood]

lol..telefonery?....ya, I hardly watch TV anymore, useless garbage...I spend most of my time on the computer researching, learning

Al_The_Man....what title did/do you hold?

I'm curious, what problems do you see working in this field?

ViperTX Not to discourage you, but personally I see anything related to manufacturing as future unemployment.

I see Ontario becoming a larger manufacturer of "Green Energy Technology" in the future...we don't need so much cheap labour, but highly skilled workers to automate and monitor the manufacturing process...hell, we already have the natural resources that we export to countries like China, India, etc....being an export country actually hurts us right now.....but that's getting alittle off topic:nono:

Was there any experience or special knowledge that you found helped you with employment?

[Al_The_Man]

I started out as an Industrial Electronic Technician, later went on to start my own business in machine design and CNC retro-fits etc.
Early on, I guess a couple of things that helped me get a foot in the door was ability to diagnose problems and PLC experience.
During the 80's there were alot of industrial automation lines that still used relay logic that had to be converted over to PLC.
There is much to be gained by putting together small projects using micro sytems PicMicro for e.g.
They offer the development software and application notes free and the programmer does not cost much.
It is a way to develop hardware and software skills as well as the ability to develop and debug logic.
Al.

[CJL5585]

Deadwood,

When I graduated from High School, I was planning on attending Florida State University to get a degree in computer science. (computer programming with patch cords in those days) However, the Vietnam war was in full swing, and I knew the military draft was getting anyone who could breathe air. So, in lieu of going to college and getting drafted later, I joined the US Air Force with a committment that I could get into the electronics program.

I went into tech school and my class was the first to be taught the new concept of solid state electronics. All previous classes had been taught only vacuum tube fundamentals. So we learned about the latest and greatest in solid state diodes, transistors, and so on.

Being in the first solid state class resulted my getting training on any new type solid state devices that were a part of air force equipment. As an end result, I have held the first transistor based solid state radar transmitter and receiver in my hands when it was first conceived by some very talented electrical engineers who were military contractors. At this point in time, it had not been tested to see if it would even work. It ended up working very well after a couple of small modifications.

As a result of my training, I traveled extensively while in the Air Force repairing and troubleshooting equipment. I remember going thru O'Hare airport on four different occasions in the same week.

Anyway, after spending four years in the air force, I decided that I would go to college and get an engineering degree at their expense, under the GI bill, so that is the path I took.

It did not take long for me to figure out that I did not like to be imprisioned at a desk with only high windows, or none at all, and that I liked to know at least what the weather was like outside. So, I abandoned the design side of electronics for the travel side of field service engineering. I traveled extensively for several years teaching seminars on troubleshooting, repair and preventative maintenance on custom designed laser based systems for assembly, welding, and painting for the major auto manufacturers, tire manufacturers, steel mills, foundries, electronic manufacturers, and do forth.

I have traveled to every state and country of North America, and it has been very exciting. There was never a dull moment, as the problems were always different, and if it was the same problem, it was in a different location.

The manufacturing processes I have seen and experienced are a marvel unto themselves. I have watched metals melt, being poured, forged, watched rolling mills make sheet metal, watched rubber being processed, rubber extruded, tires made, vulcanized, checked with lasers, coffee ground, packaged, vacuum packed, circuit boards designed, etched, tested for open circuits, soldered, repaired via computerized test fixtures, kool-aid made, packaged, and weighed at 2500 packs per minute. (My partner and I designed and built the laser based machine controls), and so many other things, that I cannot remember them all. I would not trade my experiences for a million dollars.

The question you asked was what area should you go into? Just dream and go for it. It is by no means easy, but the more you learn, the more you understand, and the easier it becomes to learn and understand new ideas and technologies.

Think I may have gotten off track and off subject, but I was just trying to show that there is no limit to the experiences and technologies that one can encounter in the field of electronics. It is a part of every machine, in every factory, in every state or province, in every nation of the world, and there has to be people who are capable and willing to repair these electronic wonders.

Jerry

[Al_The_Man]

N.America has only in recent years just woken up to the fact that they have been training Tradespeople, and Engineers, but nobody in between.
Europe realized this some years ago and private industry such as Siemens, started their own Technology schools because of the then lack of a highly skilled pool of Technicians.
Al.

[CJL5585]

Deadwood,

Based upon my life experiences, If I was a young man interested in electronics, I would get a Bachelor of Science in Electronic Technology (BSET). Then I would get a Master's degree in the same field. (MSET)

With these two degrees, you can do anything your heart desires over a period of time. The pay isn't bad either.

Jerry

[Deadwood]

Awesome CJL5585 and Al_The_Man....u guys have been very helpful...sounds to me like your both about the same age....and have both been there thru the technological development age

I think it is important to keep one eye on the present and the other on the future....I see nanotechnology coming up soon

I personally like to dream up new consumer product ideas that I could commercialize....usually I find it easiest and sometimes quite obvious to adapt current and past technology together in a new an innovative way to solve a problem or fill a market.

This is why I am pursuing the career field...the knowledge...I was already trying at home with a BasicX-24 Development Kit, Electronic Workbench V8 software....aswell as Autodesk Inventor 2009 and my cnc router(cutting machinable wax)....exploring my ideas

I see electronics in most of my ideas, so for me, not is it only important to know the technician view but the technologist and entrepreneurs view.

But of course, I need to pay the bills, so it is important to me to also find education that could give me a job that will keep me satisfied till this inventing takes off...I hate using that word "inventing/inventor/innovator" makes one sound like a genius, when most of the time it is only seeing things in a different view and being persistent when things and people say it can't work....I'm blabbing on

Your opinions have helped me determine that this is a start to an expanding field of opportunities, and yes, if and when possible I will like to explore the engineering side....engineers design our world

[nnpepe]

I was very fortunate like Al the Man to have been through the tube era, the solid state era and the digital age. I went to a two year program in the Navy for electronics back in the 60's (1969-1971) then went into the fleet for 6 years of keeping my electronics equipment up and operating. That prepared me very well for work in the private sector when I got out.

I attended night school for electrical engineering and also took every computer science course I could get my hands on (I knew there was something to this software stuff -- or there was going to be). In 2002 I went back to school for two years in IT (mostly programming).

Today I am a successful automation engineer, system integrator and field engineer in CNC controls (25 years experience). I find it extremely rewarding and having the well rounded knowledge with software and hardware has enabled me to go that little bit extra for my customers -- in other words instead of spending $3-$6,000 for a replacement board I am sometimes able to get down to component level and actually fix the board on the spot --saving my customers time and money.

There are numerous things that you should understand in this field -- know your electronic components and that means everything from solid state devices like diodes, transistors, FET's and SCR's to digital chips (linear such as OP amps and Logic -- TTL, CMOS). You don't need to know how to design with them but have some idea how to field test them and determine if they are good or bad.

Know electrical -- three phase and single phase systems, understand how to find your way around an electrical diagram or schematic. Know something about motors and drives, PLC's, Controls -- again not to design them just to learn your way around them.

One thing that I find people getting confused about are older machines that are packed full of relays -- understand relays and how they work. For newer machines learn how to work around the PLC's (again not to program although it's highly recommended that you learn the basics of Ladder Logic Programming) but learn to work with I/O diagrams.

Above all know your theory, sometimes thats what separates the really good guys from the mediocre guy -- the good guy uses his test equipment and knows what he is looking at, the mediocre guy hunts and pecks.

ViperTX makes a good point about whats in store for manufacturing in the future the way that things are going now I'm not sure anyone really can predict whats coming so I would suggest that along with this stuff you learn some programming (VB6, VB.net, C#, C++ even just C).

What I do is when there are no Automation Projects I fall back on Industrial Control Repair both CNC and Process and Assembly stuff and if there isn't any of that I program for other industries (Spreadsheet automation for example, Database stuff, web programming).

Above all else, never stop learning, keep your eyes and ears open for opportunity, you never know what else you can do for your customers -- one example that happened to me -- a customer of mine that I did CNC repair for wanted to do an automation project in their assembly area of the plant I told him that I could do that kind of work too - I started to do the work and they were so astounded with the stuff that I was doing they kept me busy automating the whole operation for 2 years-- when I started the place looked like something out of the turn of the 20th century -- when I finished it looked like something out of Star Wars -- PLC's, Motion Control, Robotics, Machine Vision....

This is one heck of a rewarding job, and if it feels like work then you aren't doing it right.

Hope this helps.

Norm P.