[saabaero]

Hey Don,

I bet you could reduce your air demand to your Vortec gun if you had more "impedance" in the air line.

BTW - I thought you had no interest in this thread????

Posted by Don Clement - As I said this thread reminded me of my trip to Pompeii and to the Vitti Bros. house. i.e. A pissing contest.

[Don Clement]

Saabaero: So now you are an expert on the Ranque-Hilsch vortex tube. You should just stick to discussing phenomenology with Doolittle. But then you can post anything when you are anonymous.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_47mmt5SZY"]YouTube - Darkstar - Bomb 20 Decides[/ame]

[MichaelHenry]

I do have a Vortec 610 cold air gun for use on my manual lathe. For one thing it takes 15 SCFM @100psi to run and keeps my 5hp/80 gal dual stage compressor running constantly. But the real issue is that air is not as efficient as flood coolant for heat removal or chip evacuation. I only use the Vortec on the manual lathe because flood coolant is not practical on an unenclosed machine. https://secure.vortec.com/store_prod...ID=6&prodID=44

Don,

Are you concerned about the air blowing swarf where you don't want it?

Mike

[Don Clement]

Don,

Are you concerned about the air blowing swarf where you don't want it?

Mike

Nope. The output of the Vortex tube is relatively low volume and pressure compared to the input to the tube. The Vortec 610 works on my manual lathe in lieu of flood coolant and doesn’t make a mess nor poise a health hazard as a mist cooler does. Works for me till I get a CNC fully enclosed lathe with flood coolant or convert my lathe to CNC. YMMV.

I looked at a Hass TL1 but new around $25K. The interafce on the Microkinetics CNC conversion isn't Mach 3. The Tormach duality lathe is too small (I need at least a 5C spindle and use a Royal pneumatic closer) My Sherline lathe is too small for use as a CNC for my use. Is Tormach or Miniki going to come out with a decent sized CNC Lathe 12x36 or 13x40 or a CNC conversion kit that runs in Mach3 and has 5C capability?

Don

[howecnc]

Quite honestly Fryer can keep there box ways with there inaccurate machines. I ran an MB-14 and MB-11 for a few years and the box ways constantly needed adjustment and the circular interpolation was worse than a proto-trak.

Friction is the enemy it will cause drag. If the heavier machine can use linear ways then I am sure that they will be fine on the Mikini.

[ihavenofish]

Quite honestly Fryer can keep there box ways with there inaccurate machines. I ran an MB-14 and MB-11 for a few years and the box ways constantly needed adjustment and the circular interpolation was worse than a proto-trak.

Friction is the enemy it will cause drag. If the heavier machine can use linear ways then I am sure that they will be fine on the Mikini.

heavier machines usually use roller linear ways though, not balls and the ones that do use balls use massive rails (45-55mm).

but kinda like the comments about the tormach tooling - the machine probably isnt going to see the amount of force needed to cause problems.

[syil]

Hi Syil

I totally agree with your finding about the X7 and the Mikini.
I have send you a private message and require more details.(group)

Thanks
Deon

see more detail pic,can check and compare our table stands more solid.
everybody can see our x7 with solid casting stands,big coloum.

[ihavenofish]

see more detail pic,can check and compare our table stands more solid.
everybody can see our x7 with solid casting stands,big coloum.

nice machine, but it really doesnt look anything like the mikini other than being the same general configuration.

[syil]

nice machine, but it really doesnt look anything like the mikini other than being the same general configuration.

mostly similar,but we have more solid x table stands.
i post mikini pic,but was delect,i won`t post again,if you need more info,email to me.
we are working on a big encloser for x7 too,and i`m confidence better than miniki use a lathe cover.we will make more industry and prefessional.

[ihavenofish]

mostly similar,but we have more solid x table stands.
i post mikini pic,but was delect,i won`t post again,if you need more info,email to me.
we are working on a big encloser for x7 too,and i`m confidence better than miniki use a lathe cover.we will make more industry and prefessional.

im just pointing out the obvious.

everyone knows most of the machines in this price bracket are all based on the same designs and expanded by each bulder. im sure if you looked hard, youd find a manual machine with a near identical frame to the tormach. you arent going to win any sales here by claiming the the x7 and the mikini are the same when they very clearly arent.



http://img.alibaba.com/photo/2291308...420L_frame.jpg

[syil]

im just pointing out the obvious.

everyone knows most of the machines in this price bracket are all based on the same designs and expanded by each bulder. im sure if you looked hard, youd find a manual machine with a near identical frame to the tormach. you arent going to win any sales here by claiming the the x7 and the mikini are the same when they very clearly arent.

thank you for your mention.but at least i can open more Resources like pic to show everybody.i don`t think a thread can be good for sales..course it is still depend on the quality and service.let`s see the future.

[Dave Berryhill]

syil - I'd like to look at your machine and see it work. Where is your showroom in the U.S? Also, what kind of customer support do you have in the U.S?

[MIKINI MECH]

All,

Great discussion. Here's a bit more information relevant to the discussion here.

1) The Mikini 1610L was designed from a clean sheet in the USA. It took us nearly 3 years in design and development, including both CAD-FEA analysis and refinement. It may be similar in travel range, some features and price to other machines in the market, but is not based on castings of, or related to any machine prior. When you get into the details, it is substantially different than any other solution in this price range. We own our facilities both in the US and overseas. We produce the majority of our components in our own facilities and have strict in process QC measures in place for all third party components. For consideration, take precision parts such as our spindle units, which we assemble ourselves. Take a look at the difference in operating temperature of our spindle (115F at 5000 rpm) vs Asian spindles (160 - 200 degrees F). Better get some welding gloves out to change those tools. Wonder why those bearings keep failing on a typical 80mm R8 spindle every couple hundred hours? We know, and we fixed it.

WE DO NOT condone FALSE information presented intended to confuse customers. Not even sure how a lathe cover would or could fit a mill. We designed and build our own enclosures in our own facility.

2) It is not a big surprise to us that other machines are following this overall layout, nearly 2 years after release of our machine. We shake our head at some of the choices made when certain vendors try to duplicate things but don't understand the fundamental engineering behind the design. Both mechanically and electrically. As the saying goes, the devil is in the details, and we encourage anyone interested in the details to give us a call.

3) We highly recommend that all interested parties do the research to prove or disprove all claims. Again, we feel there is a substantial amount of mis-information and opinion here not based on facts, as well as intentionally misleading facts presented.

4) Mikini Mechatronics is a wholly USA owned company. All support, final assembly and QC of our machines takes place in California. We do not have a formal showroom, but are happy to show any interested parties our machines in our industrial assembly facility in Watsonville, California.

5) Support, reliability, documentation, safety features and compliance, and honesty in specifications are a big deal. We designed our machines to be reliable in industrial service, easy to maintain and troubleshoot, and have generous safety factors. We highly encourage customers to do their research. You may be shocked at what you find, as we were when we purchased another vendors machine. There is a wealth of information about the support (or lack of) post (and pre) sale support, documentation, and reliability delivered by several vendors in these forums.

6) We don't spend money on a bunch of marketing or overhead. We don't do tradeshows. We don't have a $2.00 a square foot showroom. Wonder what a full color 2 page AD in a magazine costs ? How much of your machine purchase price is going to your vendors AD and or overhead line ? We spend money on building (in our opinion) the highest value, highest performance, most reliable machine available for the money and let the machines speak for themselves.

If you need a reliable industrial quality machine from a US company, designed, assembled, qc'd and supported here in the US, built to make real parts give us a call. We don't claim it is the right solution for many users here who simply do not need the features and performance we offer, but do know that it is the only solution for some.

Enjoy your weekend,

- Mikini Mechatronics
831.254.2012





Originally Posted by syil
mostly similar,but we have more solid x table stands.
i post mikini pic,but was delect,i won`t post again,if you need more info,email to me.
we are working on a big encloser for x7 too,and i`m confidence better than miniki use a lathe cover.we will make more industry and prefessional.
im just pointing out the obvious.

everyone knows most of the machines in this price bracket are all based on the same designs and expanded by each bulder. im sure if you looked hard, youd find a manual machine with a near identical frame to the tormach. you arent going to win any sales here by claiming the the x7 and the mikini are the same when they very clearly arent.

[ihavenofish]

lies, all lies!

wait, what?



thanks for the info. you quoted me in there, but perhaps misinterpreted. i didnt mean i thought your machines was a copy of any in particular, just that there are very few ways of making a machine this size and price so they all tend to borrow from one another even if its not deliberate. syils claim is like saying every knee mill is exactly the same as a bridgeport. its just a bit silly.

[MIKINI MECH]

Ihavenofish,

We understand what you meant as you detailed below. Basically the point we were trying to make in detail as you referred to with the differences and similarities in knee mills.

We can't agree with you more in regards to the "silly" information presented on some of these forums.

Thanks for being another voice of reason.

Regards

- Mikini Mechatronics

lies, all lies!

wait, what?



thanks for the info. you quoted me in there, but perhaps misinterpreted. i didnt mean i thought your machines was a copy of any in particular, just that there are very few ways of making a machine this size and price so they all tend to borrow from one another even if its not deliberate. syils claim is like saying every knee mill is exactly the same as a bridgeport. its just a bit silly.

[Dave Berryhill]

After many discussions and opinions, I have decided to buy the Mikini. I am convinced that it will not let me down. I won't have it until late October and I will share my opinions on CNCZone with a comparison to my Tormach.

I know that this thread has drifted around a bit but I am very interested in seeing a real side-by-side comparison of the Tormach and Mikini.

[howecnc]

Just so you know, that comparison is still a month or more away. I still need to be paid for over $3000 dollars worth of work that has been shipped before I will be to make final payment to Mikini. Then the shipping process will begin and then the learning process. Then I will be able to make a fair comparison.

[ataxy]

i think what whe are currently seeing is that more and more company are jumping into the small mill&lathe and that the pressure is starting to build and it making company prone to do and say thing in order not to loose the face basicaly yes mikini, syil and whatever other company have machine that are quite similar but i think the word here is similar, there arent million of way of doing thing and so you eventually end up with machine with similar spec and look but that are still different in other area.

[syil]

syil - I'd like to look at your machine and see it work. Where is your showroom in the U.S? Also, what kind of customer support do you have in the U.S?

how are you
call jeff of syilamerica,i think them x7 shipment will arrive in next month ...

our dealer will make the support.don`t worry.

[syil]

lies, all lies!

wait, what?



thanks for the info. you quoted me in there, but perhaps misinterpreted. i didnt mean i thought your machines was a copy of any in particular, just that there are very few ways of making a machine this size and price so they all tend to borrow from one another even if its not deliberate. syils claim is like saying every knee mill is exactly the same as a bridgeport. its just a bit silly.

no no,what i want to express it is 1610 have some relative with syil,i was post those info before,but delected by administrator,i won`t post again.course i have been make some emails with Mr phlip of mikini.

no need explain too much i think now.market will see the later....
but anyway..we are coming,we are not slience always now.