[Outoftheboxwood]

New to CNC, I'm looking to purchase a a small footprint CNC router for woodworking. Have read many of the primers on this site, looked at many machines and reviews.
Does anyone have any experience with Pcnc Automation.
How about other machines ranging from 24 x36 to 36 x 60.
Thanks,
Mike

[cabnet636]

camaster makes a doggone good little machine.

www.camaster.com

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LIqaDUOLtI"]YouTube - CAMaster CNC MC-2840 cutting sign out of solid surface[/ame]

jim

[redblackviper]

the only peoblem with the camaster is price, its about $4000 more than the pcnc

[bdsorcic]

I ordered the 24X36 on Monday 28 September, 2009 price was $2,995.00 at that time which I thought was a good deal and it should be ready for pick up on Novenber 10th, I will let all you guys know the Pors and Cons of the machine. I will include Pixs too if that will help. So far only problem is owner is real slow to answer my emails and I do mean reaaaaaaaaaaal slow!

[cabnet636]

the mc CAMaster is an industrial class machine and even though camaster is building a table top the price is still at 4500+ for it, when you are looking at this metal it makes sense. it will be nice to actually see the router though!!

jim

[bdsorcic]

I purchased a 24X36 Machine From Bill Johnson the owner of PCnC, I paid in full for the machine and a license for Cut3D software. When I arrived at his place in Vevay,IN to pickup my machine, He did not have the Software which I ordered and paid for, also he did not have the 4 bits included with the sale of the machine. Instead he gave me 4 used bits which only one was worth anything and the other 3 were shot and dull. With a promise he will ship it to me later in a few weeks. To this date I still have not recieved my Cut3D software which I paid $299.00 in full or anything, He does NOT answer my e-mails and phone calls. I feel riped off and am warning anyone who is thinking of making a purchase from PCnC Automation, be aware of his tricky tatics and bull talk. He is a con man and just be careful if you make a purchase from him. His machines are okay, support is non existance, no manuals or tech papers. I am at a loss here and I am afraid of returning the machine as I will never get my $3000.00 back and he is a poor guy living way out in nowhere USA. Think twice and remember you get what you pay for. I thought it was a good deal but now I kick myself and think I should of had build my own machine or brought the CNC Shark Pro from Rockler which is at least a legimiate company with great support.
Thanks for listening to my gripe and thanks to Bill Johnson the owner of PCnC for making my Hobby CNC purchase a bad experience.
Brian

[bdsorcic]

Still to this date December 18, Bill Johnson keeps giving me excuses why he did not ship my software, keeps avoiding my phone calls and states he is in Texas? Gee, you guys think I am ever going to recover my $299.00 for my License of CUT3D ? Hope one of you who read this are either a Lawyer or Police Officer who can give advice on to what to do with this con man. :devious::devious:

[y2khines]

Wow.. I just read this thread and now I'm worried. I also ordered a 24x36 towards the end of Sept. To date, I've received nothing.

The last Email I got was just before Christmas. Bill states that he had a setback and all machines are 4 weeks late (mine is going on 8 weeks late). I also plan on getting vcarve+cut3d, or just bite the bullet and get Aspire. I intended on ordering from his site, but I'll think twice about that now.

I'll try calling him tomorrow.

[luthier]

Hi Brian,
I have the same machine and it was delivered a few weeks ago. Fortunately I built my own machine years ago from Maxnc components. Their support and documentation was pretty iffy too. Really after installing the software and plugging in the machine, the learning curve is in Mach2. The machine will do what Mach tells it to do. If your machine is homing correctly then you should be OK. I did find that turning on the machine before resetting mach allowed for a better result in homing. I installed a fence on both x and Y axes using the table clamps. After zeroing in the machine, I had the router cut the wood edge so that it would be parallel and perpendicular accordingly. My biggest gripe is the wisecarver guides that they are using. Mine have too much play when the router enters the wood. I've contacted the wisecarver people but they are on vacation. If there is no adjustment in the guides, I will have to replace one with some other type of guide. Everything else is well designed and put together, I can't believe they would use sloppy guides to save a few bucks. My homebuilt machine flexes less. I know you get what you pay for, but for $3k, I'd expect a bit more accuracy. That's my only beef with the machine so far.

[bdsorcic]

luthier,
Thanks for your input, I did carve a few things from some drawings found on the CnZone, and on the Vectric forum a few turned out okay, not the best but just okay I do notice some chattering of the bits when carving and I do not know if it is my fault or the machines as it is my first machine and do not know yet how a good machine is supposed to run. All I had seen is a SharkPro demo at the local Rockler wood store. It is intresting about what you say about the Bishop Wisecarver rail and guides. I do see some play but do not know if that is normal or not? If you come up with something I am intrested in learning a few tricks from you if you do not mind sharing them. I find the CNC Router a fun machine and spend too many hours playing with it, Mach 3 is not too hard for me to learn, it is VCarve Pro that is giving me the fits, as there are so many options and so many different bits and mills to learn about. After seeing some of the members here and at the Vectric forum show off their work it just amazes me what a machine can do and do relize it also pretty much depends on the operator that makes a carving look good or like crap as much as a good machine does. I am pressed to try and succeed no mater what and am always looking for ways to improve. Thanks again for your input.
Brian

[ger21]

. My biggest gripe is the wisecarver guides that they are using. Mine have too much play when the router enters the wood.

I'm not familiar with your machine, but Dual V wheels should be installed with eccentric bushings on one side to allow you to preload them to remove any play.

http://www.cadcamcadcam.com/eccentri...ovewheel2.aspx

[luthier]

A few things you may want to look at is the feedrate, direction of feed, and bit type. First of all you want a cutter that is designed for plunging into the material. This has a cutting edge on the bottom of the bit. Secondly, you may get a better finish if you change the direction of how the bit is moving through the material. Technically the router should be moving away from the direction of the cut, not into it. So a google search for climb milling and you'll see what I mean. One directon pulls the bit into the wood and the other doesn't. This machine isn't a milling machine. When I look at the results, I can see one direction sometimes looks better than another myself.
This machine can really move the router fast. You may want to slow things down some, as a laminate trimmer is not designed to hog off wood like a bigger HP router. If you play with those variables, you may see a difference. I'm going to tinker with a spiral bit and see if I can get a better result than what I'm currently getting. I've slowed my feed on the Z and start my cut in the center of the rout as opposed to the edge and that shows some improvement. I'll let you know how a downcut bit works as opposed to a cheaper straight bit. My problem is I have a ton of files that will have to be modified for these changes.
I'm learning Rhino3D and have experience in Bobcad V20 for 2d work. You may want to play with some CAD and Cam programs to generate your G code. There are freeware converters you can download to take PDF and Jpg files and convert them into DXF files. If you are not drawing your own stuff, you should, as it will help you to understand how the whole process works. Learning how to edit Gcode is a useful skill to tweak your programs. Start with something simple like creating a ruler or yardstick making program.
If you don't have a cad program, there are freeware ones that are pretty simple but will do the basic things you need to do too.

[luthier]

Thanks for that bit of information Ger, I looked at the bishop wisecarver site and saw that the middle wheel is indeed eccentric. I'll probably have to take the machine apart to get at the wheels. I may wait until I hear from the rep of the company because I may want to upgrade to a different guide anyway. Today I did some guitar body routs conventionally milling them and using a downcut spiral. The results are better but I think this is something that can be improved. I'd rather not redo all my toolpaths if I don't have to.

[bdsorcic]

Hey luthier
Merry Xmas, good luck to us both and to all at CNCZone!
Brian:cheers:

[luthier]

Thanks you too. (after the fact):-)

[luthier]

Brian, regarding the jerkiness. One thing that I noticed about the new software was that each line of code had a feedrate and there were more G0 feeds during my cuts then I was used to. I took all the code in Notepad and replaced all the G0's with G1's. ( under EDIT). This smoothed things out significantly because the G0 is feeding full bore and the G1 is going the slower rate you specify. You may want to try that and experiment. You can also slow the feed down on the screen which you probably know.
I think having the cash flow to start a business and keep it going presents its own set of problems. I'm sure the money that we paid went into the materials for the next machines on the list and the paychecks of those working there. Putting that kind of money out there upfront is unusual in my opinion, because you have nothing to show for your money except a promise. Ebay works like that and you provide feedback. I would think that people who invest their money would be treated with excellent customer service, fast delivery,and good communication from the vendor. Honesty is the best policy in my opinion. I sell product on ebay and have a great feedback rating. In my case, Bill said he would make the machine and he did. He said he would ship it and he did. With the incident of the " setback" , it took a bit longer and I tried not to be a PITA about it. In the end things went OK.
So far I am pretty happy with the machine except for the above mentioned slop in the guides. Apparently the middle wheel is adjustable. I'm waiting for the tech help from the Bishop- Wisecarver folks to get back from vacation to confirm that. At that time I'll go in and adjust them and see if I can get some of the play out of them.

[ger21]

Can you post a pic of the Dual V setup? Are you saying there are only 3 wheels, 2 on top and one on the bottom?

[luthier]

This is better than what I could photograph.
http://www.bwc.com/products/utilitrak.html

[bdsorcic]

luthier,
Thanks for the encouragement, that helps me keep my faith in my machine, but still I do not believe a person should take advantage of a customers money and use it for their own gain. The buisness owner should honor the customers request first and put themself last. He, Bill should never of had started building a new barn before he had the cash, he is using our money for his own good, hoping orders will pour in so he swims in cash, and gets his new barn build! That is poor a poor buisness plan, and I bet after all those who read my gripes and yours too will shy away from him, all in all he is a loser. If I was going into business I would build my cash reserves first and secure a building loan and worry about customers first making sure they are satisfied and happy, after all they are the ones who make or break the buisness... What you think? I am a retired guy after 35 years in the business, I am a happy retired person with a good cash flow, I never took advantage of anyone and grew up poor working my way through the thick and thin of life! I should know better and do not like people taking advantage of others, putting them selfs before others and breaking promises, that is just me ! You seem like a fair and hard working person and I like you!
As for the Dewalt Router, what do you use for a 1/8" collet. Do you ever use any bits smaller than 1/4" ?

[ashgrimm]

Back in Oct I ordered a 36"x 48" router from Bill.
I paid him up front and was told there was a 6 week lead time. At the end of the 6 weeks Nov 23 I emailed Bill for a update and received a email stating he had some supply problems and needed another couple of weeks. He also stated that he would keep me updated. I waited until DEC 25 and emailed him for an update. On the 28Th i emailed him again and every day since. To date i have no replies to my emails. I contacted Pay Pal and Visa Fraud Services about this matter. Pay Pal coverage is only good for 45 days. Visa will cover your purchase for 120 days.

I am appalled at the lack of customer service. And fear I will half to go thru Visa Fraud Services to get a resolution.
Are there any satisfied customers of Bills here?

Any advise from those of you who have dealt with him would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Ash