[Ron Dunn]

When you guys quote hourly rates are they pre- or post-tax?

If you're quoting pre-tax wages I'm SHOCKED at the low rates. $10/hr? That's what a kid working at McDonalds or KFC gets in Australia.

Here's a link to the absolute MINIMUM wages for metal industry jobs in Australia:

http://www.fairwork.gov.au/Pay-leave...F/AN160206.pdf

Good jobs pay more. Plus you get government-provided health care with the option of private insurance for different services, government-provided unemployment benefits (close to the equivalent of the wage levels you are quoting for a family man), a decent political system, and good beer.

Thought about emigrating?

[DouglasR]

This should come as no surprise. Really. I worked 25 years for my family's business. I was promised the Sun, Moon, and Stars. Every time I got fed up and issued notice I was promised even more. The third time I knew they were jerking me.

I secretly started my own shop. Bought some CNC's, conventional machines, rented space, got tools. Started getting some jobs. THEN I told the two old coots what I did!

Oh! PRICELESS!

I still worked there another 2 years collecting benefits (were they ever MAD) and "setting my table." Then, one day when I was really being disrespected by them) I told them to take a hike, packed my Kennedy tool boxes in my little red Ford Ranger and never looked back!

Two years later they went out of business. They couldn't even figure out how to run the CNC's that I set up and ran all those years! Ha! I wound up buying the best two CNC's in the shop (an Okuma and a Mori-Seiki) at $5k each and now those machines run parts for me!

[BobWarfield]

Glad you talked to the company and got it straightened out.

I hope you handled it tactfully. Always take the high road on this stuff.

There are a couple points employers need to consider (and don't go pointing this out to your employers, that's not tactful, but keep it in mind judging employers or when you become an employer).

First, there's never a good reason to lie to employees. Shoot straight with them. If you can't give out any raises or reviews despite what the Handbook says, just tell them the situation. Man up about it. They will appreciate it, and if you have always treated them fairly they are likely to put up with a lot in order to stay with you. They know the economy is bad, you don't have to sneak around about it. They see how busy the shop is, you can't exactly hide that stuff and it's silly to try.

Second, in matters of compensation, most employers think about it totally wrong. They think if they delay and put you off they're going to save money. If you do something proactive for your employees, it takes a lot less to make them happy. If you wait until they're very unhappy, it takes a lot more because you've given them a good reason to be unhappy. It is therefore often cheaper in the long run just to do the right thing by them, particularly if you factor in any value on their increased loyalty and desire to be productive for you.

Shooting straight with people, treating them like adults, and being fair are what's needed to get the employee to quit feeling like an employee who will do just enough to get by and start feeling like a team member who will help you get your business to succeed.

I didn't invent this stuff. There are companies and managers who know how to do it right. Be on the lookout for them. It's a better deal for all concerned.

Sincerely,

BW

[aaron p]

I dont work for this company anymore. I hit the road and now make $8/hr more and I dont get lied to and I dont have some ***** in another office treating people like dog ****. They read this forum, and I hope they see this post. I allready told Mrs. DeFrancesco how I feel about her. Hi Mollie! Valco Instruments Company is the name of this place, just a heads up for you guys looking for work out there. Avoid this company, they are in 3 states I believe and do annalytical instrumentation for the chemical and medical instrusty. Piss on em'

[PixMan]

I learned the hard way several years ago that posting something like that can really bite you in the ass. You should delete it, especially if you intend to sell stuff. I learned this and I never even named the company I left.

Your reputation and integrity is what you are selling, not a product. Rise above the small-minded crap. Get your "payback" by being very successful. That would pain them more than some internet posting from a disgruntled former employee.

[aaron p]

I stand by what I said! The job I have now will be the one I retire from.

[PixMan]

I stand by what I said! The job I have now will be the one I retire from.

I believe that's what we all plan when we start a new venture. Best of luck to you.

Just remember: karma sucks.

[aaron p]

Sucks for them. Maybe they won't dick around the next guy. I'm not a pissed off person, but I don't appreciate being lied to!

[dewme5]

Originally Posted by 307startup View Post

Guess what, sunshine? There are no guarantees in life. You get what you get when you deal with other people. You think you are alone???

Change what you can, accept what you cannot. If you can do it better, differently...go into business for yourself.

Otherwise...QUIT WHINING. It's pathetic. And useless.

Tearing down a guy that's being mistreated by his employer is pathetic. Since you're clearly so tough, isn't there someone bigger you could be picking on?

I agree with the basic sentiment that at the end of the day you either have to tough it out or go it alone. I've made my decision, and I'm working towards going it alone. But until OP figures out what direction he'd like to go in, why not have a little empathy?

Sorry to be off topic just a little bit, but this is one of the cleanest differences I've seen for those supporting, and those against socialism.

[flick]

Really? I think both the posts you quoted are clearly those of capitalists. If anything they clearly show the difference between ******** and gentlemen.

I'm not a socialist. Choosing not to kick someone while they're down isn't the same as believing that all of society should be required to artificially prop them up.

[roundman]

Go and ask the man for a raise. Be prepared to discuss why it is that you deserve this raise calmly yet firmly. Time it right not after you just screwed up something. Also update your resmue before you even go and talk to the man. If it does not change go to another place. Things are picking up and shops who want people want them with the skillset you say you have.