[steve88]

Hi,

I'm currenttly in the process of researching different cad/cam software systems for my company. We are on a very limited budget. We currently use Autosketch to design parts in 2d and then manually write g code for our HAAS milling center.

I have narrowed it down to bobcad-cam and alibre as our main choices. I have downloaded both the demo softwares and can say I like the CAD side of Alibre more and the CAM side of Bobcad-cam more.

From reading reviews on here it would seem that bobcam is not very well liked but everything is on the older V22 or older editions. What about V23? Whats everyones opinions?

Has anyone had succesful experiences with either software package?

Thanks,

Steve

[scadvice]

Look at what is most important to you. CAD or CAM? I used both systems and prefer Alibre over BC. However I’m only familiar with BC v22 and lower. Also, I suggest looking at the MecSoft site and their recommended CAD systems to go with their CAM product. Alibre is strong on the CAD side.
Steve

[harley4ever]

Brother check out dolphin cad cam. Its much easier and much more stable than bobcad. Alibre cad is very nice but the cam has been faulty from different threads i have seen on here. I personally use dolphin cad cam for 99% of my work and surfcam for very complicated 3d. JMO

[scadvice]

Steve,
I don’t know what kind of budget you have… however… I based my first answer on only comparing the two you asked for. So… what IS your limited budget? start out by telling your company that the cost for a fairly good CADCAM system is 8 to 10k with training (Training is a must to get everyone going properly and a smooth transition.) They may say OK if that’s what it takes. However (again the however)… if they are pinching the bucks… and want something cheaper… don’t let them get it without training of some sort. I base this concern on what you posted. No one at your company has used any system of more than two axis. 3D solid modeling is really a must nowadays, but it can be a really rough road learning at first… for some of us. This is in both the CAD and the CAM side. I’ve been there…and after 20 plus years of 2 axis CAD and 2 ½ axis CAM systems it was my worst nightmare for a time. I had to literally throw all I knew out the window and start over and the old systems would still come back at times and haunt me.
CAD CAM systems tend to be strong on one side or the other. A simple example… Alibre is strong (powerful) to the CAD side and somewhat weak on the CAM. But… for the most part… quite workable and MecSoft’s VisualCAM/Mill is very weak on its CAD side. It’s still better then an orthogonal (2 axis) system but geared mostly to support the CAM side of the program. So people tend to buy Alibre, Solidworks or some other CAD system to support their design needs and get another compatible system for their CAM needs. The CAM tends to usually get it in the shorts because of the cost of the more advanced systems. But, if all you need is a basic system with CAM side, most of the affordable systems will do fine. All, cheap and pricey both, have their quirks. I suggest keeping with those that will support and interchange cleanly with the solid model systems like ProE, Solidworks, and what else? …I can’t think of them now…someone else will have to speak up.
I personally was not happy with BobCad. It is not as mainstream of a system as the others and had real problems in v22… I decided not to spend any more fruitless hours trying to make it work. For a hobbyist who likes to play around a lot with the quirks and any problems… it might be fine. Or someone other than me… who it worked for…well thats OK…but, I will not recommend it.
I do not know anything about DolphinCADCAM or its prices, You’ll have to rely on “harley4ever” and others for that info.
Anyway…with a real tight budget… I would look at AlibrePRO without CAM and then look at look at These CAM systems MecSofts VisualMill, EZCAM, or RhinoCam . I’ve not used Rhino but others seem to like it. I’ve used EZCAM in the past and considered it when I bought. Using VisualMill now (still learning).
You’re looking at about $1000 for the CAD and about $1000 to $1400 for the CAM’s. As I said…push for training… another $2000.
Steve
Oh ya...what am I using now? Alibre Pro v12.1 with AlibreCAM Pro (Its basically MecSoft's but embedded and not supported by MecSoft only Alibre. It could be supported better by them. IMO) I also use that 20 year old EZcam still for basic 2 1/2 work but I using it less and less as time goes by. An old version AutoCad Lite sometimes... but less and less.

[dertsap]

if the software is for a business then you should be looking at better cad cam systems than the low cost solutions
try demos and stuff that are out there , there are a great number of good softwares out there as well as a good number of bad ones out there that are backed by guys who push the software for a finders fee

[harley4ever]

Its not always the expensive programs that do the best. It all varies by job. In depth testing of precisely what you'll be doing is the best way to make a judgement. As I have always said, theres a time and a place for both. I use dolphin partmaster for most all of my 2d 2.5d work. When a complicated 3d job needs to be done, boom, we got surfcam. Does that mean its better? For 3d yes. But for our easy, everyday and repetitive work, we find dolphin as quick and easy as any. Sheetcam is good at what it does too. Again, everyone and every shop is unique so see whats best for you.

[laszlozoltan]

if you are designing in autosketch and then programming by hand then you are not doing any 3d stuff yet; it might be wiser, being on a limited budget to save the money to help keep the shop running when things slow down or the HAAS needs an expensive repair part than blow it all on a esoteric cad/cam package that won't really help much to get the job done and requires special training for any hired help. even the 3d stuff that might come in the future can be farmed out to shops who can do them who may in return farm simpler 2d stuff back. When the business grows enough that the budget constraints won't be so much of a concern then it'll be a lot earier to pick an appropiate software without incurring such risk. Just my opinion.

[osphoto]

I own both Alibre (V12) and Bob CAD (V21).

For my CAM, I opted to purchase Mecsoft (V6) as a a separate version so I can import other files as needed.

Alibre is great for the price, IMO. I build products with various parts and Alibre Assembly checks all my tolerances and tells me when things don't work! Time/Money saver. I'm fairly certain BC doesn't do this. The interface alone for BC irritates me enough that I hate to even power it up.

The CAM side of BC didn't logically flow for me well enough as does MecSofts CAM software. So, I've got Bob Cad sitting on a shelf. I've used it only when I tinkered with sign making. Alibre has finally added basic use of lettering. No need for BC!

What turned me off the most about BC is that when I called in for help, they wanted to charge me for training! My questions where based upon the training materials they provided and they seriously wouldn't answer my questions without a charge to me. With that sort of tech support, I've no reason to want to upgrade to their latest and greatest version nor continue using a product such as theirs.

Call up Alibre tech support, they are more then willing to help questions. They would help me through a design issue without asking for training cost. Alibre offers on-line free and paid training classes. Get the yearly support and get free classes.

Alibre DOESN'T call me every freaking time a new version comes out offering me an upgrade price! It's been three years and BOB CAD still calls me!!!

Based on what you are designing, go with what feels comfortable to you in the design mode of the software (CAD) cause you'll be spending less time in the CAM side of things. In addition You can always export from Alibre to your favorite CAM software.

Also keep in mind, Alibre doesn't use "Key fobs" as does Bob Cad. I use two designing machines, home and laptop and about to add a third machine for my shop. Which means I don't have to move a key fob or purchase another license seat.

I will say that if you are doing lots of lettering... BC is a bit stronger in that department. If you are doing signs, then look at Vetric.

Alibre gets my vote.

[steve88]

Thanks for the answers so far guys.

Our shop isn't currently making 3d cuts but we have been doing quite a bit of prototyping where we have to change the design simply because we can't machine the part due to a feature.

I'm comfortable learning a new software. I have experience drawing with surfaces, solids, wireframes, parametrics, etc.

It sounds like there's a lot of mixed reviews at the price point. We simply can not go buy surfcam or mastercam. Keeping everything under $2k would be ideal.

Can a shop be productive with Alibrecad/cam or bobcad/cam?

[steve88]

I own both Alibre (V12) and Bob CAD (V21).

For my CAM, I opted to purchase Mecsoft (V6) as a a separate version so I can import other files as needed.

Alibre is great for the price, IMO. I build products with various parts and Alibre Assembly checks all my tolerances and tells me when things don't work! Time/Money saver. I'm fairly certain BC doesn't do this. The interface alone for BC irritates me enough that I hate to even power it up.

The CAM side of BC didn't logically flow for me well enough as does MecSofts CAM software. So, I've got Bob Cad sitting on a shelf. I've used it only when I tinkered with sign making. Alibre has finally added basic use of lettering. No need for BC!

What turned me off the most about BC is that when I called in for help, they wanted to charge me for training! My questions where based upon the training materials they provided and they seriously wouldn't answer my questions without a charge to me. With that sort of tech support, I've no reason to want to upgrade to their latest and greatest version nor continue using a product such as theirs.

Call up Alibre tech support, they are more then willing to help questions. They would help me through a design issue without asking for training cost. Alibre offers on-line free and paid training classes. Get the yearly support and get free classes.

Alibre DOESN'T call me every freaking time a new version comes out offering me an upgrade price! It's been three years and BOB CAD still calls me!!!

Based on what you are designing, go with what feels comfortable to you in the design mode of the software (CAD) cause you'll be spending less time in the CAM side of things. In addition You can always export from Alibre to your favorite CAM software.

Also keep in mind, Alibre doesn't use "Key fobs" as does Bob Cad. I use two designing machines, home and laptop and about to add a third machine for my shop. Which means I don't have to move a key fob or purchase another license seat.

I will say that if you are doing lots of lettering... BC is a bit stronger in that department. If you are doing signs, then look at Vetric.

Alibre gets my vote.

That is what I was thinking as well. Alibre CAD seems very productive. Just not so sure about the their CAM.

[osphoto]

Alibre CAM is a derivative of MecSoft's Visual Mill. At the time of MY selection of a CAM software, Visual Mill was at V6 and the integrated CAM of Alibre was Visual Mill 5. Both are very productive. I think Alibre's CAM is up to date to the current version of VisualMill.

I'm currently looking to add the 4th Axis module of Visual Mill. It seems my needs are about to expand!

IMO, MecSoft offered more of a logical flow of the CAM software versus Bob CAD. There are other CAM software out there that are cheaper and some offer two+ sided CAM features at a cheaper price. Good news about that is you can export your Alibre code to those other CAM packages.

Alibre Expert comes with a limited feature CAM version built in. And that CAM version is easily upgraded with a license key.

I do understand having to go back and modify a design because my machine's psychical limitations on cutting a part. Without the ease of what Alibre gave me to make those modifications, I'd probably haven given up on my projects.

Go with the design features that make you comfortable and trusting of your CAD software.

On a side note of the CAD/CAM of Alibre. With the integration I found the CAM build to be much faster then using Visual Mill separate. Visual Mill uses a mini CAD program which I've have to learn. With the integration of the packages, I was able to take short cuts and got my CAM builds done faster. I used the CAM software of Alibre expert before updating to the separate version of Visual Mill. For the basic CAM needs, the CAM version that came with Alibre Expert meet plenty of my needs at the time.