[MichaelHenry]

CarveSmart was at the Tormach open house showing their jaw system, specifically the one that is designed for the 5-in Tormach vise. Has anyone here ever used this system for mill work, even if not on a Tormach mill? If so what did you think of them?

[tbev]

Like these? They are great, I use the aluminum jaws for lots of jigs and the steel ones I just have set up and use flat, just haven't needed steel jigs. The kurt ones are fabulous, if the Tormach ones are good and got your vise hop on them. You can use them upside down as well, the ones that are cut out for the cone are the bottom of these ones pictured.

[MichaelHenry]

The CarveSmart system is very similar (CS says that Kurt copied their concept), but CarveSmart offers a model that directly fits the 5-in Tormach vise and they offer more dovetail jaw options including 94-in extrusions that you cut to size, a flippable hardened set that has a dovetail gripping edge on one side and flats on the other, and a set that takes Mitee-Bite TalonGrip doohickeys. The Tormach-size master jaws are 6-in wide which could be handy for a lot of work. The soft dovetail jaws are extruded aluminum that you can buy in lengths up to 94-in long. Most of the jaws do have a way to repeat jaw location to within 0.0003". Prices seem roughly comparable and some folks just buy aluminum bar and machine their own dovetails into them. They looked very well made to me, though I didn't spend a lot of time at their table. All made in the USA, if that matters to anyone.

[mountaindew]

Nice.
I have looked at these before didn't know they worked on Tormach machinist vise.

[tbev]

It's pretty cool that they fit in a Tormach vise, the concept is great, the kurt ones I think I paid about fifty bucks per set in aluminum. I figured I'd get a cutter to make them when I needed more but I'll prolly just buy them. Either way I really like them, one if the best things I've spent money on in the shop.

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[CadRhino]

What is the big advantage of using this system over just using soft jaw blanks from monster jaws?
Thanks

The CarveSmart system is very similar (CS says that Kurt copied their concept), but CarveSmart offers a model that directly fits the 5-in Tormach vise and they offer more dovetail jaw options including 94-in extrusions that you cut to size, a flippable hardened set that has a dovetail gripping edge on one side and flats on the other, and a set that takes Mitee-Bite TalonGrip doohickeys. The Tormach-size master jaws are 6-in wide which could be handy for a lot of work. The soft dovetail jaws are extruded aluminum that you can buy in lengths up to 94-in long. Most of the jaws do have a way to repeat jaw location to within 0.0003". Prices seem roughly comparable and some folks just buy aluminum bar and machine their own dovetails into them. They looked very well made to me, though I didn't spend a lot of time at their table. All made in the USA, if that matters to anyone.

[smokediver576]

What is the big advantage of using this system over just using soft jaw blanks from monster jaws?
Thanks

I met with them as well and would have purchased a kit had it not been for needing to buy a coaxial indicator first. As I saw it, the advantage was that if you multiple parts you run in soft jaws you do not have to re-indicate on each switch over. Once you reference the vise you can switch back and forth because the soft jaws have an alignment key. Now, this also assumes that you set your CAM up based on the vise location vs part location.

At least that's my takeaway.

Andrew Wall

[tbev]

That's correct, and they swap out super easily and quickly.

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[smokediver576]

That's correct, and they swap out super easily and quickly.

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Yep, I'll be buying a starter kit just as soon as I recover from buying the Hamier coaxial indicator......

[MichaelHenry]

What is the big advantage of using this system over just using soft jaw blanks from monster jaws?
Thanks

There may be other benefits but, the master jaw set has a feature that lets you re-mount jaws to within 0.0003" repeatability which requires a dowel pin in the dovetailed jaws. The dovetailed mounting screws jaw are released from the top so that they can be removed from the side or the top with much less clearance between master jaws than Kurt-type jaws that take SHCS fasteners through the face. Jaw swaps are a lot faster. The dovetailed jaws are solid, so you don't get any marking from the SHCS holes in the jaw faces. The soft jaws can be machined out without hitting the SHCS counterbored holes (since there aren't any). The master jaws are 6 inches wide so wider work can be better held than in the standard 5-in Tormach vise. It might be easier to mount a long soft jaw across 2 or more vises since you don't need to drill mounting screw holes that match your vises, assuming they are already mounted.

One possible downside is that there is less useable opening between the jaws since the master jaws take up some space in Y. That's not often a problem for me and the regular jaws can always be swapped back in when maximum space is needed.

[MichaelHenry]

It's pretty cool that they fit in a Tormach vise, the concept is great, the kurt ones I think I paid about fifty bucks per set in aluminum. I figured I'd get a cutter to make them when I needed more but I'll prolly just buy them. Either way I really like them, one if the best things I've spent money on in the shop.

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CarveSmart gets around $1/inch for their standard aluminum dovetail soft jaw bars in up to 94-in lengths. That's $12 for a 6-in pair, maybe a little more.

[CadRhino]

Thanks for everyone's insight on how this works.

There may be other benefits but, the master jaw set has a feature that lets you re-mount jaws to within 0.0003" repeatability which requires a dowel pin in the dovetailed jaws. The dovetailed mounting screws jaw are released from the top so that they can be removed from the side or the top with much less clearance between master jaws than Kurt-type jaws that take SHCS fasteners through the face. Jaw swaps are a lot faster. The dovetailed jaws are solid, so you don't get any marking from the SHCS holes in the jaw faces. The soft jaws can be machined out without hitting the SHCS counterbored holes (since there aren't any). The master jaws are 6 inches wide so wider work can be better held than in the standard 5-in Tormach vise. It might be easier to mount a long soft jaw across 2 or more vises since you don't need to drill mounting screw holes that match your vises, assuming they are already mounted.

One possible downside is that there is less useable opening between the jaws since the master jaws take up some space in Y. That's not often a problem for me and the regular jaws can always be swapped back in when maximum space is needed.

[tbev]

CarveSmart gets around $1/inch for their standard aluminum dovetail soft jaw bars in up to 94-in lengths. That's $12 for a 6-in pair, maybe a little more.

Wow, that's awesome! Maybe I'm wrong about the price of the kurt jaws..I bough a few of them when I picked up the vise and I'm not sure...by that's pretty cool the cutter is prolly a hundred bucks.

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[wildwhl]

Apologize for my ignorance if I missed it. What is the cost of the CarveSmart starter kit for the Tormach 5" vise?

WW

[smokediver576]

Apologize for my ignorance if I missed it. What is the cost of the CarveSmart starter kit for the Tormach 5" vise?

WW

I want to say a "starter kit" was somewhere around $400 to $500. Now keep in mind - when I order a starter kit it has everything I need to get me up and running and give me several extras to carry me a few months. I've attached their price list from the web site.
Later,
Awall

[wildwhl]

I want to say a "starter kit" was somewhere around $400 to $500. Now keep in mind - when I order a starter kit it has everything I need to get me up and running and give me several extras to carry me a few months. I've attached their price list from the web site.
Later,
Awall

Thank you for this.

WW