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  1. #1
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    Mar 2007
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    Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Hi Kflopians!

    I'm attempting to retrofit a 1998 ARIX knee mill (about 6000lbs and a 5hp spindle to give an idea of size) that was equipped with propriety controls and drivers, and I want to use the dynomotion equipment for the retrofit

    Attachment 244714

    I'll summarize where the machine is coming from and where it's heading to, before asking my question.

    From: 486 PC running DOS based ARIX software restricted to a floppy disk and RS232 interface for DMC (PC is labeled '1' in the attached image)
    To: Windows PC running MACH3 (or KmotionCNC if I find it to be a good replacement)

    From: 8 (yes 8!!!) separate ARIX interface boards for motion control and I/O (boards are defined as PMI, PMS, PMD, MDD, MIO, MTC, IOC, and DDD if anyone can guess what they all are?)
    To: Replace with KFlop and Kanalog boards

    From: 3 x propriety ARIX servo drives connected according to the diagrams I've attached , driving SEM MT30U4-36 brushed DC servo's fitted with tacho and accu-coder 755A encoders
    To: ????

    Attachment 244718

    The Mitsubishi Freqrol A200 VFD, the 3PH coolant pump, the oiling pump, lamp, applicable contactors, power draw bar and transformer are all staying, and I do hope to keep the standard jog wheels/control touchpad as well, but I'm not so sure if I can make them interface correctly at the moment.

    Now my question is about the motor drivers, because servo control is a bit new to me (all my previous machines have been steppers).

    a) I'm hoping that someone experienced can have a look at the attached circuit diagrams/photos of the ARIX driver interfaces, and help me understand if these inputs look somewhat 'standard', and could be controlled with the +/-10V and other I/O from the kAnalog. Specifically, do "XDRVGND, XON, X-OUT, XACIN TG+, TG- BRAKE, +24VG, XDRVDRY+" sound like they align with some standard driver inputs? Bear in mind that these are just the DB25 signals between the motion controller and driver, and the motor connections and input power are the screw terminals on the front.

    Attachment 244716 Attachment 244720

    b) If I cant control the ARIX drivers with the kAnalog, I'd like replace all 3 with a snapamp. But my existing transformer supplies 110V/10A, and the motors (SEM MT30U4-36) have ratings of 140V/7.5A (13.2A stall). I thought these would run a fairly standard voltage, but the snapamp only seems rated to 80V). Am I misinterpreting something, or is snapamp not going to work for me?

    Thanks in advance,
    Tim

  2. #2
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Here are some more pictures of the drives, but I just cant find any datasheets or anything to help me identify if these are +/-10V units, or step/dir, or some other interface.

    I really hope someone here with more intelligence than me can suggest whether or not these would be able to be driven by a Kanalog

    Attachment 244736Attachment 244738Attachment 244740Attachment 244742

    Thanks, Tim

  3. #3
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    May 2006
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    3549

    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Hi Tim,

    It is hard to say from those signal names on the drives. Do you have any other schematics?

    The analog input might be the XDRVDRY+ to XDRVGND ?

    Or maybe the TG+ to TG- ??

    You might try applying a small voltage like a 1.5V battery through a 1K Ohm resistor to those pins to see if the motor moves. The 1 K Ohm resistor will most likely prevent damage if they are the wrong pins.

    Otherwise SnapAmp may work but can only be used with up to an 80V supply. That might limit your top speed if the original supply was higher voltage.

    Another option would be to use 3rd party analog drives such as from a-m-c.com.

    Regards
    TK
    http://dynomotion.com

  4. #4
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Hi Tom, great idea with the battery.

    I do have the entire schematic of the machine, but there is nothing with more detail in it about the drives... just a DB25 cable between the ARIX control cards and each of the drives with those signal names defined..

    I will try your suggestion, as well as maybe scoping some of the signals *if* I can get the original gear to function predictably enough to get some consistent movement.

    thanks again.

    I think I'll have a go in the servo foum and see if anyone else has seen such a drive.

    I also have a servo lathe and a chinese stepper router that I want to convert to dynomotion at the same time (chosen mainly because of your great level of tech support to others!), so I look forward to learning all about your products..

    Cheers,
    Tim

  5. #5
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Part of the schematic is cut off. Send the entire page to the right of the motor in the drawing.

    If you can find the pin out drawing for the signal connector I can help.

    99% sure the Kanalog would do the trick. Just need to see the whole drawing.

    More than happy to help you guys.

  6. #6
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Hi Donb9261, I just sent you a PM.

    Basically, there are 9 wires between the ARIX motion controller and the drives, and I'm trying to figure out what the purpose of each one is so I can connect them up to my KAnalog.

    The only ones I am sure about are the tacho wires, and the description in the wiring diagram isn't enough for me to work out which one is the enable, and which is the +/-10V signal, etc.

    Pin 6 = XDRVGND
    Pin 7 = XON
    Pin 12 = XACIN
    Pin 13 = X-OUT
    Pin 15 = +24VG
    Pin 16 = XDRVDRY+
    Pin 20 = BRAKE
    Pin 24 = TG+ (This is the motor tacho +)
    Pin 25 = TG- (This is the motor tacho +)

    I'm confident that the kanalog will work too, I'm just a bit hesitant to go guessing connections and see what happens (smoke?). If I can't suss it out, then it's going to be an expensive exercise for me to get 3 new ~1kw drivers, and If I was to go to the expense of new drivers then I may as well replace the old brushed DC motors at the same time with some new compact AC motors (more $$$)!

  7. #7
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Well, I finally struck pure gold today, with a very, very, VERY helpful lady from ARIX taiwan digging through their archives to find the servo driver datasheet from 20 years ago (ARIX didn't design the drivers, they just used them in their mills and the driver company shut down long ago with no trace on the net).

    She scanned it, and after looking through it, there are so many places I would've gone wrong while trying things. I'm really appreciative of this, because it would've been very easy for her to say "too old"/"out of service life"/"dont have any info"/"buy a new machine"/etc...

    To say I'm excited is an absolute understatement, because now I can start wiring up the kanalog on the massive mill with confidence!!!

    The down side is that I only bought 1 Kflop from Tom, which is currently running like an absolute dream with a Kstep on my little chinese CNC3040 router. So I'm going to have to disassemble my router again to get my mill up and running

    I don't know how to upload a file here, but if anyone wants a copy of the driver datasheet, just send me your email.

    Thanks,
    Timbo

  8. #8
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?


  9. #9
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Hi Timbosaurus,

    To attach a file: use the Manage Attachments button. Then Browse to the file. Push Upload. Close Window.

    Regards
    TK
    TK
    http://dynomotion.com

  10. #10
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    Feb 2008
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    If anyone has the schematics could they flick me a copy to please. My Arix CNC 90 is having "issues" m.dann@hotmail.com

    Cheers

  11. #11
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    I know this post is very old, but I am the new owner of a Arix cnc60, that I am am in need of schematics and or any info on. I am also going to start the retrofit to Mach. It appears my machine is the same as the one pictured. Any help would be appreciated.
    Thanks.

  12. #12
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Pont463, shoot me a PM with your email I have a arix CNC 90 and Tim sent me some info.

  13. #13
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?



    Hello I was just wondering if anyone wanted to sell their Arix drives. I am currently looking for the Y Axis drive YSDC-1350A.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timbosaurus View Post
    Well, I finally struck pure gold today, with a very, very, VERY helpful lady from ARIX taiwan digging through their archives to find the servo driver datasheet from 20 years ago (ARIX didn't design the drivers, they just used them in their mills and the driver company shut down long ago with no trace on the net).

    She scanned it, and after looking through it, there are so many places I would've gone wrong while trying things. I'm really appreciative of this, because it would've been very easy for her to say "too old"/"out of service life"/"dont have any info"/"buy a new machine"/etc...

    To say I'm excited is an absolute understatement, because now I can start wiring up the kanalog on the massive mill with confidence!!!

    The down side is that I only bought 1 Kflop from Tom, which is currently running like an absolute dream with a Kstep on my little chinese CNC3040 router. So I'm going to have to disassemble my router again to get my mill up and running

    I don't know how to upload a file here, but if anyone wants a copy of the driver datasheet, just send me your email.

    Thanks,
    Timbo
    Hi, new user here

    I have an arix machine, a cnc60. It's still got the original control and drives on it, but it is getting very flaky in its old age. Its in my garage at home, I mostly use it for hobby stuff.

    I also have had very good experiences with arix support. They've been super helpful to me, especially when I first bought the machine about 5 years ago. I got it from graysonline auctions. Cost more to truck it to my house than what I paid for the machine! It needed quite a bit of love to get it running again.

    I've had to replace all the capacitors and repair corroded pcb's in the drives. The computer is getting so unreliable now that its not really trustworthy to use anymore. Retrofit time!

    I would love a copy of any documentation anyone may have, I have copies of the original manuals for mine if anyone might find them useful.

  15. #15
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    I also have an old Arix machine with the YSDC-1350 driver. Does anyone still have info on this drive and want to share?

  16. #16
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Datasheet from ARIX support!

  17. #17
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    Sep 2020
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Hello/ I too am setting up an original Arix cnc60 and have error note 532 (IO card not exist or Damaged) appearing. Does anyone have any wiring or troubleshooting diagrams to allow me to solve the problem ? thanks Phil

  18. #18
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    I am considering doing a full controller/servo retrofit on my Arix CNC60.

    So if anyone is interested, I will probably be selling all of the electronics and servos.

    The machine is fully working, except for an intermittent fault on the Z axis. Occasionally (but getting worse) it won't run the Z axis with the MPG. Works fine in auto, but regularly glitchy with the MPG. I've spent a fair bit of time searching for the problem, not as easy fix as it sounds.

    All drives work (they have been re-capped and serviced), Y axis motor has been rewound/rebuilt (it filled up with slideway oil and burned out badly). I've modified the control panel for a 15" LCD as the original CRT died many years ago.

    I won't be offering any warranty on parts. I can assure you that anything I sell will be functional when removed from the machine, but its a 23 year old machine and as you're all aware, they're getting temperamental.

    Message me if you want any parts! The amount of money I can scrape back on parts will influence my choice of new controller!

  19. #19
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tarakai View Post
    Hello/ I too am setting up an original Arix cnc60 and have error note 532 (IO card not exist or Damaged) appearing. Does anyone have any wiring or troubleshooting diagrams to allow me to solve the problem ? thanks Phil
    I have the basic electrical schematics that originally shipped with the machine. I can scan and upload if you/anyone else is interested.
    I have found that carefully removing each card one by one and blowing off dust, cleaning the connectors and refitting helps with a bunch of the errors I've had over the years. There are many hundreds of electrical connections in that computer module, it only take one of them to be a bit dirty to cause issues. The Dsub connectors at the top are particularly difficult to get to, be patient and don't damage anything.

  20. #20
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    Re: Keep existing drives or replace with snapAmp?

    Quote Originally Posted by proto-psycho View Post
    I have the basic electrical schematics that originally shipped with the machine. I can scan and upload if you/anyone else is interested.
    I have found that carefully removing each card one by one and blowing off dust, cleaning the connectors and refitting helps with a bunch of the errors I've had over the years. There are many hundreds of electrical connections in that computer module, it only take one of them to be a bit dirty to cause issues. The Dsub connectors at the top are particularly difficult to get to, be patient and don't damage anything.
    Thanks Mate....it's funny having spent so long today trying to get it sorted that I too am considering starting from anew with new controller, CAM, drivers, servos etc. I am in Maitland NSW. I dont know if you are local but any diagrams you have would be a massive step forward for me. I removed all the boards yesterday and carefully cleaned and looked for any damage,burn marks etc but couldnt see a thing. Id like to have a chat with you if thats ok. I am on 0405674919 cheers Phil

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