[joshuadri]

Hi, Guys

I'm new at the engraving business. I'm starting a small business with my mother in law (trying to help her) and the first thing I need to learn is how to engrave two o three lines of text on a 1 1/2 by 3 inches piece of alluminum plate.

I've been reading from you guys about how to accomplish this. First, I'll get my machine ( CNC Router on my desk) in one more week and I know I have to get Mach3 to run it. The seller sent me a file to place it into Mach3. To me it sound like a pre-made profile, according to what I'm reading, don't believe me. Mach3 allows you to download a version with limited features, but I've been told it does many things in demo mode.

The next thing I'm supposed to get is a program that allows me to create those text lines and save them as certaing kind of file format. I would have to import this file from Mach3 and send it to the engraving machine.
CorelDraw is supposed to be a good sofware to create and properly format the text file to be engraved.
Now... Please, tell me what do I need to know to do this "simple" task?

[Regnar]

You will need 3 things to make and run your machine. Cad, Cam, Controller.

For Cad you could use Corel Draw or any other drawing program, it basically really matters on what Cam will import.

Cam programs can be cheap and free or really really expensive. My biggest suggestion is buy what you need and what you might need in the future. This way you are not buying 5 or 6 different software's.

Now to give some suggestions. Sheetcam, Meshcam, Cut2d, Vcarve, Cut3d.
If all you ever plan on doing is engraving then cut2d and sheetcam will do well for you. One is a little easier to use than the other.

Controllers you have a few options. Other can chime in with the different ones but 2 that I know and have used is Mach3 and Emc2. Mach is free up to 500 lines of code, after that you will have to pay for a liscence. Unless you are going to do stick lines for letters 500 lines doesnt go very far at all. Emc2 is free and what I use. You have to install Ubuntu which is linux and wasn't very hard at all.

For easy cheap and no headaches I would do Cut2d with Emc2. You will not need a cad program.

Eitherway good luck with you search.

[joshuadri]

You will need 3 things to make and run your machine. Cad, Cam, Controller.

For Cad you could use Corel Draw or any other drawing program, it basically really matters on what Cam will import.

Cam programs can be cheap and free or really really expensive. My biggest suggestion is buy what you need and what you might need in the future. This way you are not buying 5 or 6 different software's.

Now to give some suggestions. Sheetcam, Meshcam, Cut2d, Vcarve, Cut3d.
If all you ever plan on doing is engraving then cut2d and sheetcam will do well for you. One is a little easier to use than the other.

Controllers you have a few options. Other can chime in with the different ones but 2 that I know and have used is Mach3 and Emc2. Mach is free up to 500 lines of code, after that you will have to pay for a liscence. Unless you are going to do stick lines for letters 500 lines doesnt go very far at all. Emc2 is free and what I use. You have to install Ubuntu which is linux and wasn't very hard at all.

For easy cheap and no headaches I would do Cut2d with Emc2. You will not need a cad program.

Eitherway good luck with you search.

Thanks, Regnar
The seller suggested me to use Mach3. At least, to start I feel I should stick to what he says. I don't want to hear any excuse later.
Thanks again for this explanation. Things start getting clearer for me. I will study a bit on your suggestions and I will ask you guys again for help. I'm sure I will run into a lot of questions
But not to worry... I always try to solve problems myself first. You learn a lot in the process. Then, when I'm burned out, I'll look for you
Thanks again.

[escott76]

What kind of machine did you get, do you have a link? Sometimes sellers include a license file for Mach 3 (this could be what you mean by "the seller sent me a file to place into Mach 3"). If this is the case you have a full version of Mach, so there's one thing taken care of. That file would be "Mach1Lic.dat" if it's the license file.
Now you've got a couple of other things to learn. One is how to actually cut the letters. Several different cutters are available, and results will vary with different cutters, and different machine speeds (spindle and feed). You'll want to play around with a couple of different things.
To actually get what you want you'll need to generate G code. As Regnar mentioned there are many different CAM programs that will allow you to do this. Try the free ones, and shop around the others. There are some more 2D/Engraving types out there that are more tailored to what you are doing. Some of them will even allow you to create the text within them.
Get the machine moving first, and get used to Mach (if that's what you wind up going with). Then start to investigate your CAM options.

[joshuadri]

Hi Escott
I don't get a full version of Mach3. I bought this machine at ebay and the seller said I could download Mach3, trial version, from Mach's web site; this version would be limited to 250 lines of G Code (which I don't know what it means yet). The file he sent to me is a xml document called "MachMill". He said I should copy it to the Mach3 folder and it will configure Mach3 to work with this machine. I assume this is a kind of "profile" for Mach3 that I should pick up to work with.
You can see the machine at zenbotcnc.com. It's the 1216 router.
Since I told him I'll be working mostly on engraving aluminum sheets, he sent me this link http://www.mcmaster.com/#8762a33/=22jv0h to get the kind of bit I need to work on aluminum sheets.
I love free programs )))
I tried to download Deskengrave from deskam.com, but there is a problem installing it. I don't know if it is Windows Vista on this pc, but I doesn't happen. I have a dedicated old pc with the beloved XP installed and I will try installing it there to see if the problem is the OS. I want to start playing with something, like you said.
The other thing: Mach3 has a Text Wizard and I need to play around with it too. It may do those two o three lines of text that I need by now.
Since I don't need to have the machine physically connected (don't have it yet... probably on monday, fingers crossed) to run Mach3, I thing I should download the demo version and play with it.
I'll keep you posted, guys.
I love this forum and once again I confirmed the good nature of people when it comes to help someone who needs help. Thanks.
By the way: I have Corel Draw. I'll take a look at that too. I have the idea that I can create a file, format it as a dxf or something like that (sorry) and then have it imported from Mach3, convert it into G Code file and send it to engrave. How to do all these? I don't know... yet. You can see the mist in my words
Thanks again.

[Hans_G]

since you love free software, try the free version of CamBam- http://www.cambam.co.uk/download.html

Version 0.8.2 is free forever. The other versions, CamBam Plus (0.9.xx), have 40 uses before you need to buy it. If you never close the application, you could just keep using it forever in theory.

The engraving tutorial on the cambam website is pretty easy to follow too. I recommend it since it'll give you a good overview of the design (CAD/CAM) process and then you'll have a gcode file to practice with in Mach3.

[DeusExMachina]

since you love free software, try the free version of CamBam- http://www.cambam.co.uk/download.html

Version 0.8.2 is free forever. The other versions, CamBam Plus (0.9.xx), have 40 uses before you need to buy it. If you never close the application, you could just keep using it forever in theory.

The engraving tutorial on the cambam website is pretty easy to follow too. I recommend it since it'll give you a good overview of the design (CAD/CAM) process and then you'll have a gcode file to practice with in Mach3.

I second CamBam, used the free version for a few weeks before updating to plus, its a bit rough in some spots but it works well and the support for it is top-notch. The developer routinely post on the software's forums and updates the code in the direction that the customers support (including pretty decent 3d support with the latest beta). Cut2d/3d have wonderful interfaces, but I believe the gcode they produce, and their support are not quite as good as CamBam's.

If you want to engrave using CamBam, create the engraving in any program that can save a dxf (including inkscape [though you'll need the better dxf export plug in]) import it, clean up the dxf a bit (move/size/join any duplicate lines) then select the Engrave Machine Operation (MOP), fill out the panel in CamBam and it'll generate the code. The Engrave MOP is limited, for instance you can't do multiple depth passes, but being careful and playing with the program and some simple tricks will allow you to use the free version easily for simple engraving.

You should look in to finding a simulator, NC Plot for example will allow you to view toolpaths, there are other simulators that will let you see the "finished" part after machining operations (Cut2d/3d have a decent simulator built in, and is another great part of the user interface in my opinion.).

[joshuadri]

Hi Guys
I checked into Cambam and I think it's a good way to start. I installed Deskcam in my dedicated PC. It was Vista. It's running smoothly on XP. By the way: for somebody like me, no knoledge about this at all, it was ease to create a line of text, linear or in a arc, modify the fonts, etc. The only problem I found is that it doesn't create more than one line of text. It saves your file as dxf or g code. I don't know how good these files would be.

After reading DeusExMachina's comment, thanks to you and Hans too, I think I can create those two lines in Deskcam, save them as dxf files, import them from Cambam, get them cleaned, copy and paste one line with the other (I guess), save the new file as a G code, do the MOP thing (I'll find out) and VOILA!!!! Nice dream

I have a question: It sound like you cannot "preview" the engraving before I send it to the machine using Cambam. What simulator can I get?

Other question: What is "to fill out the panel in Cambam"?

[joshuadri]

UPDATE:
I installed Mach3. I run a test and the result was good.
I also installed Cambam 0.8.2. There is an option to create text to engrave and I can create as many lines I want. So there's no need for me to create one single line in Kadcam and then another and so on to, finally, make a final dxf file. These lines that I need can be done on Cambam. I cann't wait to have de machine on my desk. Thanks guys

Hi Guys
I checked into Cambam and I think it's a good way to start. I installed Deskcam in my dedicated PC. It was Vista. It's running smoothly on XP. By the way: for somebody like me, no knoledge about this at all, it was ease to create a line of text, linear or in a arc, modify the fonts, etc. The only problem I found is that it doesn't create more than one line of text. It saves your file as dxf or g code. I don't know how good these files would be.

After reading DeusExMachina's comment, thanks to you and Hans too, I think I can create those two lines in Deskcam, save them as dxf files, import them from Cambam, get them cleaned, copy and paste one line with the other (I guess), save the new file as a G code, do the MOP thing (I'll find out) and VOILA!!!! Nice dream

I have a question: It sound like you cannot "preview" the engraving before I send it to the machine using Cambam. What simulator can I get?

Other question: What is "to fill out the panel in Cambam"?

[Hans_G]

There's a CamBam plugin called ArcText if you want to put the text on an arc, like what DeskEngrave can do. You can find it in the plugins forum over at the cambam website.

[joshuadri]

Thanks, Hans
What about a Simulator? Do they have any plugin for it that you know of?

There's a CamBam plugin called ArcText if you want to put the text on an arc, like what DeskEngrave can do. You can find it in the plugins forum over at the cambam website.

[joshuadri]

UPDATE 2:
Hi Guys
I received my machine. I tested it with the help of the vendor. Nice guy. Mach3 is configured. It's setup to Inches, which I don't mind, but when is time to set up how deep the bit is going to engrave I don't really know what to say. I think I'll find out with practice. I'm not going deeper than 0.05 inches. I'm open to information, of course
Well... I open Cambam and I had a little problem remembering the tutorial about text engraving. I checked it again and I found out it is not complete. I mean... A the point of creating the G Code, it doesn't tell you exactly what to do. I had to figure it out. The software is not hard to deal with.
So for those who may run into this little problem, this is how: Go to Insert, then select " Text ". On your left, down you will see all the properties of the text file you're creating; find the row for Text and make your own by typing on it (delete what it is there like you would do in a word procesor); hit " Enter" and your new text will appear on the work area.
After this point you'll click on "CAM" from the menu bar and select "Engrave". You'll notice an " x " at the center of the working area.
Then right click on the word " Engrave [1]" at your left and on the " tree area". Select " Create GCode File" from the list of options and VOILA. You'll be given the privilege to name the file the way you want, save it wherever you want and that's it. Now... I was expecting some kind of drop down list to select an extension, but no. All I see is "All Files (*.*). But no problem. It will work.
Go back to Mach3, load the file, send it to "print" ( jeje) and that is it for tonight. My wife is waiting and I don't need a fight at this time and after I accomplished something great

Next stop: how to make a file with some ten or twenty set of three engraving lines of text to engrave on a whole 12x24 engraving alluminum sheet, so I just cut this little plaques to be placed on the trophies.

PD: Sorry about my English. I speak Spanish but I try to operate in English as much as I can. See you guys. Thanks for your support.

Thanks, Hans
What about a Simulator? Do they have any plugin for it that you know of?

[Hans_G]

hey nice work, you are making fast progress- this stuff isn't simple and no one learns it over night. So now you need to show us all pictures of what you can do!!!

[joshuadri]

hey nice work, you are making fast progress- this stuff isn't simple and no one learns it over night. So now you need to show us all pictures of what you can do!!!

Thanks, Hans
I will take pics of those little plates I'm trying to make and I'll post them here. But I'm not there yet. I'll keep the pressure on and we'll get there

After I'm done learning this BIG task (engraving three lines on a piece of alluminum sheet - I know I'll be laughing later at myself), my following think will be engraving a picture of my mother on a Brass sheet. And then, a pic of Jesus, half a body, on a piece of wood ( to honor my mother too). After that Hans... whatever comes

One last thing: please keep an eye on me, because I still need help. When I feel I'm drowning, I will yell:drowning:

[Hans_G]

One last thing: please keep an eye on me, because I still need help. When I feel I'm drowning, I will yell:drowning:

That's what this place is for! I'm not a frequent contributor to CNC Zone, but seriously this place is amazing... so many helpful people!!! I have many different hobbies ranging from Volkswagen diesels to video game programming (yes, cnc machining fits in there too), and I am amazed at how civil, intelligent, and helpful people here are compared to the other forums. Good luck with your projects, and I look forward to seeing your results

[joshuadri]

That's what this place is for! I'm not a frequent contributor to CNC Zone, but seriously this place is amazing... so many helpful people!!! I have many different hobbies ranging from Volkswagen diesels to video game programming (yes, cnc machining fits in there too), and I am amazed at how civil, intelligent, and helpful people here are compared to the other forums. Good luck with your projects, and I look forward to seeing your results

Thanks, Hans. I'm taking the rest of this Sunday to jump on it again. I'm telling you... I wont let go until we have this thing down
And thanks again. I know you guys are watching. Nothing bad is going to happen to me

[joshuadri]

UPDATE...

Problems with Cambam creating a full set of character for my two or three lines of text.
I type in the first line, then I add the second one. Then, I create the GCode for the file. I load this Gcode from Mach3 and it comes missing characters. This can be seen on the " Tool Path" screen. I send it to the router and the machine "prints" (I'm using a pen and paper by now) what it is on the file, that's the uncompleted second line.
I tried any horizontal alignament just in case, with same results.
The Gcode file is being created, but is going throughout dropping letters on his way
I created these lines again, then exported the file to dxf format. Then I oppened the dxf file and created the Gcode from it. Oppened it in Mach3 and still the same problem.

I don't know what else to try. I review the tutorial on text engraving at Cambam's place, but there's no answer there and obviously, the author was able to print many lines on a piece of wood. So... What is it that I'm missing here?

This is a copy of a Gcode file which I can load from Mach3, but is missing the character "G" for Good:

Sorry... The system does not recognize the file's format. Actually, Cambam doesn't give you any choice but "All files" and the resulting file is not recognized by this forum system.

What can you guys tell me?

[Hans_G]

UPDATE...

Problems with Cambam creating a full set of character for my two or three lines of text.
I type in the first line, then I add the second one. Then, I create the GCode for the file. I load this Gcode from Mach3 and it comes missing characters.

Attach your cambam (.cb), dxf, and/or gcode files and we'll take a look at it.

Instead of exporting as dxf from CamBam, why not create the gcode file from CamBam?

There's a line limit to the free version of Mach, maybe that's what you're seeing (I know nothing about Mach3, sorry).

[joshuadri]

Hi, Hans
I am creating the GCode from Cambam. I tried to send you guys the file but it's impossible. I can create a dxf and send it but I don't see is working neither. What I get is a 1kb file and it doesn' t open back in Cambam.

When I load the Ccode file from Mach3, I see the whole bunch of lines, but characters are missing. There is no problem when it is a single line.

I doubt Mach3 to be the problem. It load the file, shows you the tool path (where you can see the letters missing), send it to the machine which prints what you see on Mach3's Tool Path window.

I don't know what to send you, since the dxf file I get is useless and the generated Gcode file format is no recognized by the forum's system. Here is a screenshot of what I'm trying to describe; it's only the Tool Path window; the whole thing would be too big a file. The path goes from line 1 to line 2, and the letter G for Good is not there.
This pic may not be helpfull but what else can I send you?

Attach your cambam (.cb), dxf, and/or gcode files and we'll take a look at it.

Instead of exporting as dxf from CamBam, why not create the gcode file from CamBam?

There's a line limit to the free version of Mach, maybe that's what you're seeing (I know nothing about Mach3, sorry).

[joshuadri]

Well, Hans... I think you're RIGHT!
Bad news for me. I kept on looking around Mach3 and guess what: the Tool Path stops on line 501. So... No more than 500 lines in Mach3 for free.... Big problem since I can not afford it now and I have to create these plates before July. I think my option is to download the Demo and see if I can go around the issue meanwhile. At some point I hope I can buy Mach3 and whatever I need in the future. I need to do this and I know I can do it.
I am able to create those lines with Cambam. The dead end is in Mach3. Tell me what you think, but I see you said it before.