[rpovey]

I just saw that Novakon is EOL the NM-145 and the current price seems like a really good deal for a machine of this size.

It's actually a little bigger machine than I was looking at. I was just going to convert a G0704, but at the price the NM-145 is very tempting.
I assume that I will need at least a pallet jack to get this thing in place, I have an engine hoist, but I can't see how you'd lift it from above?
Like a lot of support forums a lot of what's posted here are problems, what are the primary issues people have and are they generally resolved in a timely matter?

Thanks

[cteufert]

Lifting the machine with a hoist or crane is a challenge. To do it I ended up using 4 identical 30" lifting slings and S hooks. (use heavy duty hooks) I placed a hook in the holes at the front and rear of the machine itself. I used forklift so had two slings on each fork to lower it in to position. I lifted the base along with the mill, the base isn't that heavy but check that the mounting bolts are installed properly.

Most of the problems with the machine relate to the spindle motor. The original motor and VFD (drive) supplied by Sangmutan had serious problems that make the mill almost unusable. The problem was very little torque at low speed and slow spin up. The problem was acknowledged by Sangmutan last December but it took until August before replacement VFDs came available.... or at least until Novakon sent me a replacement. With the revised VFD the machine is much much better.

The machine is not a $200,000 Haas or even a $20,000 machine. Just like every other piece of Chinese equipment priced at the low end of the market there are defects to be found and repaired. Silly things like cheap screws that strip the first time you remove them are easy to fix. Rethreading a hole that didn't go deep enough to tighten up only takes a couple minutes. The problem is discovering what needs to be addressed. My mill had a problem with 0.008" of lash in the Y-axis. Novakon was pretty quick to suggest tightening the jam nut on the ball screw to eliminate any gap in the bearings. Didn't work. Asked for a replacement ball screw and they agreed to send me one but it took several weeks. (I suspect they didn't have any stock and had one shipped by boat from China.) When I pulled the machine apart to replace the ball screw I noticed one of the bearings was installed backwards so no amount of adjustment was going to correct the problem. Unfortunately the bearing race was damaged from being used incorrectly so I had to replace both bearings. With that done the lash is down to about 0.002" which I identified as being caused by the rubber spider coupling to the motor which I will address with some shims.

Electrically and electronically the machine is made with good quality components. However the workmanship on the wiring is a problem. Common failures are wires pulling out of connectors or off terminals. Besides my machine I have see two other NM145s and the routing of the wires is different in each. There are many places for a wire to get snagged or pinched. I found conduit fittings that were left loose and even a nice screw driver left in the cabinet as if the worker left for lunch, had a couple beers and forgot where he left off so closed the panel and sent the machine on its way. Better workmanship and attention to details would prevent many of the problems customers find as time goes by. The good news is 30 minutes of you time spent looking at and tugging on each and every connection will catch most of the problems.

The discounted price is tempting especially if you go in with the mindset that what you are buying is a assembled kit that you are going to inspect and adjust before use and not a finely tuned piece of equipment ready to use. I paid closer to the regular price and even with the cost of stuff I opted to replace it has nearly paid for itself in less than 6 months.

Novakon got it about 90% right. What is lacking is documentation such as an exploded parts diagram, wiring diagram and some written up procedures. They try to provide support but without these materials they must start over and go one step at a time for each and every customer that calls causing their support staff to get overwhelmed quickly and loose track of what each customer needs to get their problem resolved.

Charlie.

[kvom]

I use a pallet jack to move my NM200 around the shop. The only "problem" I have with that is that the cabinet is only wide enough for the jack forks on the side, so a bit of maneuvering is needed for precise placement. I have an auto lift in my shop, so I was able to mount the mill to the cabinet single-handed using slings and d-rings. I think it could have been done with two people and 2 engine hoists, but I wouldn't have wanted to try it with just myself. I think the NM-145, although smaller, would be the same.

All the fasteners are metric. So while I have a full set of metric hand tools, I don't have any metric screws or nuts on hand, nor do I have metric taps or thread gauges to identify screws that need replacement. Fortunately there's an Ace hardware near me that has a good assortment of metric screws and nuts.

[rpovey]

Thanks guys that's exactly what I needed.
And pretty much what I figured, If I wer're buying a none CNC mill that size and converting it, adding one shot oiler and coolant to it, I don't think I'd come out far ahead price wise and that doesn't count my time. Shipping is a bit brutal to the US West Coast, but even with that it's not bad.

I don't see anyone complaining about the QC on the casting, actually the mechanical issues seem to be less prevalent on the forums.

As long as the quality of the electronics components is acceptable, I have a scope and have no problems checking wiring, or cleaning it up, the pictures on Novokons site show Gecko controllers, but from reading the forums, this seems to have changed several times.

Novokon has so little technical information on their site.

I assume it's using Dovetail ways, is the gib adjustment like the Siegs (3 set screws) or does it use tapered gibs? Are the gib adjustments accessible?

How heavy is the head if it needs to be removed to adjust something?

The lack of an exploded parts diagram and disassembly instructions does seem to be an oversight, and inconvenient.

I pretty much assume everything not built in the USA is metric, I have a race car where every fastener in the engine is imperial, the transmission housing has both metric and imperial bolts and everything else it is metric. <ugh>

I might be able to rent a forklift to locate it, there's plenty of vertical clearance inside my shop, but I'm not sure I can get it through the door (time to dig out the tape measure).

[MichaelHenry]

It looks like no warranty is included with the closed out NM-145s and it sounds like they won't be marketed any more after the remaining stock is sold. That probably means you are on your own for support or replacement parts right from the get go. That's something to ponder, if you haven't already done so.

Mike

[rpovey]

Yes I hadn't seen the flyer on the forum until today, I'd only seen the web page which doesn't state no warrantee.
It is something of a concern, especially if the expectation is that there is a good chance of mechanical or other issues off the bat.

[bob b]

i do not see any neg. comments from new nm145 owners about them phasing machine out ! I hope that is a good thing they claim any warranty issues will be honored and parts also :drowning:

[rpovey]

I exchanged email with Khai yesterday about parts availability and he basically said the same thing. Specifically he said they would continue to carry parts as many were still being used by the other models.
I'm still in two minds about the purchase, I think it's a great price for a machine this size, but my primary concern at this point is the lack of any real parts breakdown/exploded diagram and getting through the initial "debugging period" that many seem to have without support.
I'll think about it over the weekend.

[bob b]

yes i kinda flew off gthe handle when i sent khai an email i was kinda upset being i just bought machine in jan. he di not sound to happy with me but like i told him how would you feel if you bought i new car and not even 100 miles on it , and they dicontinue it kinda makes you wonder . Khai has been real good with me in the past guess i shouldn't have flown of the handle , but on the other hand i spent alot when i first bought it new :violin:

[tjd10684]

I dont have a problem with the mechanical components or most of the electronics but the spindle drive on mine has blown out twice and their is no reset :bs:. I have just given up on the dc spindle and am in the process of installing a 3 phase ac motor. as for the other electronics they are fine i have gecko g203v drives on all 4 axis (i have a 6" rotary table also from Novakon) and cnc4pc c11g to interface the computer (also from Novakon) to the steppers its really a decent setup for control the only real goof was specing the dc drive that large. I have heard other companies use similar drives on other machines but they are smaller and seam to be reliable but this model SUCKS (sorry I got to call em' as I see em'). Another thing I would change is the home switches. the non contact sealed switch seams like a great idea but in practice it just dont seam to work spot on every time. good enough to get by but i would like mechanical snap action switches better i think. Also the machine does not have limit switches. so the limits have to be set with the soft limits within mach but i would rather have real LIMIT switches. one of my last gripes is on my machine the cabinet and machine came together and when i added coolant it leaked out the mounting hole or something and was loosing maybe a gal of water every 2 hrs. i had to keep a mop nearby to suck the coolant off the floor. i ended up running a bead of caulk around the entire base of the machine to keep the coolant away from the mounting holes.

[rpovey]

Well in the end it was just too good a price to pass up, I've ordered one of the clearance NM-145's, lead time is apparently 2-3 week, so I should have it towards the end of October.
Looking forwards to it, hopefully no major issues to iron out.

[protrackcorp]

Likewise I decided to get one of the NM145 for the price. I have my own experience with my other machines that needed some tlc to get them running with good repeatability. Our machine will ship on Monday. Looking forward to it.

[steveb946]

I have a NM145 on order, and expect shipment to start next week. It will be supplied with the 4th axis electronics, and will run on my own computer.

Khai has been exceptionally responsive to my many email questions.

This is the same model of machine that I have tried out at the University of Arizona here in Tucson. Nice, compact machine, quiet and a 6000 RPM R8 spindle.

A great deal, IMHO!

:cheers::cheers:

Steve

Likewise I decided to get one of the NM145 for the price. I have my own experience with my other machines that needed some tlc to get them running with good repeatability. Our machine will ship on Monday. Looking forward to it.

[rpovey]

I had to delay my order because I was out of the country on short notice for business, but hopefully mine will also ship this week, or early next.
Looking forwards to the delivery.

[steveb946]

Well in the end it was just too good a price to pass up, I've ordered one of the clearance NM-145's, lead time is apparently 2-3 week, so I should have it towards the end of October.
Looking forwards to it, hopefully no major issues to iron out.

Please let us know when you get your machine.
I have one on order, also, with the 4th axis electronics option. The University of Arizona has all 3 different size models of Novakon and really like them. The NM-145 was "plug-and-Play" after uncrating, and the insides of the electrical control box are very well constructed and wired.

The 6000 RPM spindle is a great feature!:cheers:

[rpovey]

Well after a small delay, my NM-145 is apparently due to be picked up by the carrier Monday.
Hopefully they can get through the passes around here since it's now started snowing in the mountains.

[igalloway]

Hi, I also just got a NM-145 on clearance. Reading here, I decided to upgrade by VFD to the "new" version. That did hold things up a few weeks.

I would like to comment that Khai has been very helpful to date, and while not always "instantaneous" to respond, I am happy. I did read these forums carefully before making my decision to buy, and felt that the overall quality would be good, and that I could handle most adjustments/improvements myself.... given the sale price!

So I got the mill, and I'm pleased with it so far. Granted I'm a noobie, so I can't yet comment on measured backlash and such.

At the moment I'm trying to get my PC setup to control the mill.
I didn't buy Mach3 yet, so I'm just using the downloaded free version.

Again this is my first time setting these things up.
So I started with an old PC, and downloaded the evaluation version of Mach3 from the website. It is my understanding that it's fully functional for up to 500 lines of G-code, and that the NFD "extras" are not able to be used. Everything else should run.

You put the XML file in the same directory as Mach, and then you can use machloader to pick the .XML configuration file. Keep a backup somewhere. Each time you "save configuration" it will update this file.

The first little hurdle (forgive me for stating the basics) was to figure out how to get Mach3 to use the correct printer port. Using the Bios setup I set the pc's printer port to SPP. (I think this is correct? ) And then in windows, went to control panel to find out what address it was at. Inside Mach3 Config, there is a setting for port1 address.

I'm pretty sure that Novakon has changed their controller boards several times. Using the default XML file from the Novakon the X axis was set to use the wrong two output pins, and the Z- Axis was on the X axis pins. A quick adjustment under config got that sorted out.

I used the Diagnostics tab to look at inputs etc... Flood/mist control turned on the pump etc...

So I now have a couple of things to figure out. (While waiting for a bit of help from Khai).

- Strangely it seems like *all 3* of the home sensors(?) are triggering input 11. That to me doesn't seem correct. i.e. They are all connected in parallel to input 11. Shouldn't they have independent channels? I checked this by moving the X,Y and Z so they were positioned over the sensors. Then unplugged each of the sensors one by one. and even tried them in X in Z etc.. This proved they were each active, and that the inputs on the breakout board were all going to input 11.

- I can't get the spindle to startup. I totally expect that the XML/Config settings are not correct. Anyone have some help on this?
If I was to guess, I expect that:

- One output is setup for an "enable"? <Relay control> <Spindle relays> ?

- under motor control spindle - the step and Dir pin have to be also setup correctly. I noticed that the Novakon XML has these pins also set to "step low active"

I realize this is difficult for anyone to give much help. Just wishful thinking in case someone really does know how to set up spindle control for VFD, and possibly also has the same VFD and NM145 and XML file.

Thanks

[rpovey]

All three home pins wired to pin 11 is likely correct, Mach homes one axis at a time, so you can wire all three NC to a single pin.
Can't help with the spindle, my mill won't arrive until next week because of thanks giving.

[screen]

- One output is setup for an "enable"? <Relay control> <Spindle relays> ?

- under motor control spindle - the step and Dir pin have to be also setup correctly. I noticed that the Novakon XML has these pins also set to "step low active"

Thanks

Hi,

Set pin 16 as the Step pin#; pin 14 as the output 2; pin 1 as the output 1;

In spindle setup screen, choose "PWM control" mode. Relay control: un-check mark "disable spindle relays"; Clockwise (M3) output#: 4; CCW (M4) output#:2

[mcphill]

The limit switches sharing an input is fine. When homing MACH knows which axis is moving. Later, if you hit a limit, it doesn't really matter which one it is - any limit will stop the machine.

You can break them out to three pins, but then you lose an extra 2 inputs you could use for something else.