[JoBwan]

ralph@nes,
Can you explain what ( or if ) you did to get the rotary running? I have a unit that was faulting "A axis cable fault". I swapped out the motor and the cable ( Supplied by HFO Northwest), and now I can jog it (both directions) with no problems. If you try to home out the unit, it reads "NO Zero T". This is an HRT-160 unit and the unit has been used on the 2005 VF-2SS in the past. Just wondering if you recalled any fix that may be related with my unit?

[JoBwan]

Guys,
I was able to fix it by changing the value at parameter 218. This info was supplied by HFO Midwest. Thanks anyway.

[serviceman]

parameter 218?? what does that say?

[JoBwan]

Reytech,
Sorry 'bout that! It was parameter 128 - APC Pal.2 Unload Y: was 0000 and had to change it to (+.3215). I got this number by hitting the Machine restart button, and when the machine alarmed, the value on the "Z" axis would read .3215. Every time!! I was told by HFO to insert a value between -.5000 and .5000. Once I inserted this value, the Alarm was fixed and the Rotary worked perfectly.
I do question if I will need to change this value when I hook up a different rotary unit, or will it stay the same for all rotary units? Does this correspond with the rotary itself or the machine itself?? JoBwan

[ralph@nes]

For what it's worth, mine still isn't working. I'm at my wit's end on this thing. The rotary is doing the same thing it was before, A Cable Fault (even with a new cable and encoder), when I turn off cable test it will move but completely erratic. Tried the unit on a local shop's VF-3 and also didn't work. I'm about ready to throw the thing in the dumpster.

[Al_The_Man]

It is possible the controller encoder input receiver is bad?
If you have it hooked up to a good encoder.
Al.

[ralph@nes]

That's what I'm wondering. Anyone have any ideas of what kind of values I should be getting at that connector? I'd love to prove the machine itself out before beating myself silly with encoders and cables anymore.

[JoBwan]

Guys,
I was wrong about the # on parameter 128. That actually had nothing to do with it?
I was able to home out the machine individually on each axis and all the alarms went away. Hopefully, until the next time I have to use it.
Ralph@nes,
I would be hand delivering the unit back to oracle encoders and have them hook it to a machine and show me that it works properly. If it doesn't, they can fix it, right?? Good Luck!!

[ralph@nes]

Actually the unit has been back to Oracle a second time and they paid for an OEM encoder and put it on. The problematic aftermarket encoder is out of the loop, I've tried two cables and still getting cable faults, erratic behaviour, and 'A Z CH MISSING'.

[Al_The_Man]

One long shot to test the input that may work, is make up a controller input plug for a dummy encoder. This is done this way, for the A, B,Z, channels connect a 1k resistor from these pins to +5 and connect /A,/B,/Z pins to common.
Disconnect the armature leads to the motor so that it cannot turn.
Upon switch on, you should not get any faults.
If the 4th axis cannot be controlled by hand wheel, then command a 4th axis move at very low feed rate.
Normally you should see no faults until the controller senses that the axis has not moved and you will eventually get a 'Following Error' or equivalent.
If you get Z marker missing, then I would suspect the encoder input card.
This method works for most controls, it may work in your case.
Al.

[ralph@nes]

Funny you should say that, because I get following errors now. One direction I can turn the pulse wheel with no issues, the other (and sometimes with no input) it will just go into a rapid. The screen numbers aren't changing when it's doing that, so I have to assume for one reason or another the machine has no idea what the motor is doing at that point.

[HAILINHAAS]

This is a long shot ... with the rotary plugged in ...e-stop ... change one of the A-axis parameters ... reset machine ... wait a second ... e-stop the machine ... change the parmeter value back .. reset and zero return the unit and see if that works.

[Al_The_Man]

Apparently you have a multitude of confusing symptoms
With the majority of controllers, when you command an axis move, the screen displays the anticipated position, not the actual from the encoder.
IOW if you were to disable the motor without the control knowing it, it is normal to see the display show where the axis should be according to the command, until the following error appears.
The other symptom of runaway is symptomatic of loss of tach or wrong phasing of the encoder.
Al.

[serviceman]

have you ohmed out the encoder jumper cable that goes from the encoder to the peckerhead on the motor?

[ralph@nes]

Peckerhead???

Haha, no. But I have ohmed the entire cable assembly up to the MOTIF card in the back. I have valid connections there.

Also verified that I had reference +5v at the cable-to-table connector junction. My HFO supplied me with a parameter list (which is exactly the same list that you/Carlos/serviceman provided me). Still can't get anything with Cable Test on, instantly goes into cable fault. When moving it with cable test off I get the Z channel missing code.

I'm going to pull the encoder cover and see if there's something in there. What exactly is this peckerhead you're referring to? Other than the frustrated guy working on it >

[ralph@nes]

I just ohmed the pigtail all the way to the encoder. All wires have continuity and are uniform in color (red is connected to red, blue to blue, etc). Although I have no idea what each of the wires on the Renco encoder is actually supposed to relate to as far as channel.

Anyone have any ideas as far as what the colors on the Renco actually represent?

Here's the way it's currently connected, from the Motif card all the way to the encoder:

Motif Color: Name of Channel: Renco Color:

Red +5vdc Red
Red/White Logic Gnd. Black
Brown/White A Chan Green
Yellow/White B Chan Yellow
Orange/White Z Chan Brown
Brown A- Chan Orange
Yellow B- Chan White
Orange Z- Chan Blue


The only thing that seems kind of odd is that the B colors kind of carry through. Yellow is present on both. Now the A and Z colors seem to flipflop a bit... A has orange on the renco end and Brown on the Motif end; Z has brown on the renco end and orange on the Motif end.

I'd say I'm pulling my hair out but I'm beyond that now, I'm sort of at that numb complacency when you realize stuff is FUBAR and you just give up.

[serviceman]

i remember once, back a long time ago we replaced an encoder and we had to swap the a and anot and b and bnot wires to get it to work i am pretty sure that there will be no damage the z channel you can invert with a parameter and i guess we tried that with the invert z ch parameter in parameter 43. so try swapping the channels you can get a hold of renco and ask them, if it is a renco encoder they would be able to tell you which wires are which. red +5 red/white logic gnd brown white a yellow white b orange white z brown anot yellow bnot orange znot

[Al_The_Man]

The Renco encoders usually conform to one colour code.
VCC+ Red
Com Black
A = white
/A = Yellow
B = Green
/B = Blue
Z = Orange
/Z = Brown
What is the actual model # of you Renco Encoder?
Al.

[ralph@nes]

OK, I got this now guys.

For what it's worth, it's a Renco RCH-50 series. Has a 15 pin double-row connector. Came from the HFO in Chicago but is NOT the original Haas spec RCH-50 (which they custom ordered with an 8-pin inline connector at the PCB)!

The pins are different than the 8-in-a-row but the colors ARE THE SAME and match up with what Al said. I had Carl from the Indiana area HFO on the phone with me for quite some time, between that and a fax from a helpful salesman at Renco I got three pieces of info that let me put it all together: Connector configuration and RCH-50 standard pin assignment [without colors] from the Renco website, and the fax was the 8-in-a-row connector pinout WITH colors.

Using the two I was able to cross reference the color (from the 8-in-line) to the pin (on the 15 pin double row) and found out that my encoder pigtail was wired COMPLETELY wrong! They lined up color-for-color but the channels were totally incorrect! It's almost like the pigtail had been rewired for a totally different control.

Snipped the wires and crossed them so the pins were correct to the pins on the Haas cable, and voila--I have a working HRT.

Unreal to think that with the colors matched, and a reputable encoder service (who I'm sure just reconnected the encoder based on the way it came in) looking at it THREE times, it ended up being the internal pigtail that was completely wrong. But I'm up and running finally, and I owe a HUGE thank you to Carlos (serviceman) and Al especially for their help.

:salute: Thanks again, and if anyone runs into an oddball encoder, chances are I've got your solution!

[HAILINHAAS]

Awe .. closure .. it nice when things get answered ... from up above : )