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IndustryArena Forum > Events, Product Announcements Etc > Polls > Sharpening drill bits by hand

View Poll Results: Do you sharpen drill bits by hand on a bench or pedistal grinder?

Voters
857. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes I do it all the time!

    609 71.06%
  • No, they never cut right!

    46 5.37%
  • Sorry, I don't know how to do that!

    63 7.35%
  • Its better to throw them away!

    30 3.50%
  • No, we have a drill sharpening machine!

    94 10.97%
  • What's a drill bit?

    15 1.75%
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Results 81 to 100 of 267

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widgitmaster Sharpening drill bits by hand 07-24-2006, 03:15 PM
Mcgyver do it all the time, or at... 07-24-2006, 03:31 PM
Geof Mr Mcgyver I could not... 07-24-2006, 03:54 PM
Mcgyver forget 20%, did you know half... 07-24-2006, 06:55 PM
Geof I have been called a lot... 07-24-2006, 07:26 PM
ajmoir Average does not always =... 05-26-2007, 11:33 PM
naytep I agree with you 100%. Some... 02-05-2007, 03:54 PM
kokelol natep 02-05-2007, 07:13 PM
lakeside At today labor rate and the... 07-24-2006, 04:39 PM
Shawn Lucas $95/hr? Get out of the... 06-07-2010, 03:41 AM
diylife.com.tw Let's try to use the... 06-13-2010, 02:20 PM
aka.apprentice I know this reply is... 07-12-2010, 03:35 AM
universalfab Manufacture huh, well I have... 10-15-2010, 08:36 AM
Bubba When I was young my Dad... 07-24-2006, 05:03 PM
lakeside If there one area that we as... 07-24-2006, 05:54 PM
dertsap i sharpen large drill by hand... 07-24-2006, 07:18 PM
lakeside shear & horse power 07-24-2006, 07:22 PM
Mcgyver ahhhh but my dear Colonel... 07-24-2006, 07:39 PM
dertsap in my opinion and experience... 07-24-2006, 07:52 PM
WA Toolman I still have the drill gage I... 05-03-2007, 05:35 AM
roundman drill point 05-27-2007, 09:33 PM
pixburghenat Do it all the time, even the... 05-29-2007, 06:24 PM
widgitmaster Most bench or pedistal... 07-24-2006, 11:34 PM
tobyaxis Drill Point Sharpening 07-25-2006, 01:46 AM
sdantonio Hi Eric, A buddy of mine... 07-27-2006, 09:51 PM
widgitmaster http://www.oceanavenger.com/vi... 07-25-2006, 03:29 AM
CNCezee Drill Grinding 10-18-2006, 09:14 AM
phantomcow2 I have no problem sharpening... 07-25-2006, 04:12 AM
Greolt My dad, who was what we call... 07-25-2006, 05:20 AM
tobyaxis Nice Videos 07-25-2006, 05:26 AM
widgitmaster As for those who voted to... 07-25-2006, 12:35 PM
tobyaxis The first time I sharpened a... 07-25-2006, 05:17 PM
ajl6549 I don't do it any more, we... 07-25-2006, 02:11 PM
Cobra92fs In a production shop, drill... 07-25-2006, 02:39 PM
zjmr Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 08-21-2024, 04:15 AM
miljnor My drill sharpener was used... 07-25-2006, 04:40 PM
Geof A truly competent boss... 07-25-2006, 05:22 PM
lakeside A truly competent manager... 07-25-2006, 05:59 PM
tobyaxis Most places have no real... 07-25-2006, 06:28 PM
Geof Well I have neither so that... 07-25-2006, 06:29 PM
dertsap i dont buy that a boss... 07-25-2006, 08:11 PM
miljnor Damn! Right through the... 07-25-2006, 06:53 PM
lakeside You may not have a degree... 07-25-2006, 06:35 PM
tobyaxis Lakeside I couldn"t agree... 07-25-2006, 06:41 PM
lakeside we worry about tunnel failure... 07-25-2006, 06:45 PM
tobyaxis So teach them how to grind... 07-25-2006, 06:51 PM
Geof I do have degrees just not in... 07-25-2006, 07:34 PM
lakeside dertsap I was refeering to... 07-26-2006, 07:37 AM
diarmaid I just thought the following... 07-26-2006, 01:18 PM
ajl6549 Thats a very "in depth"... 07-26-2006, 01:23 PM
The Puma Man Just let me say, this is all... 07-28-2006, 09:50 PM
tobyaxis For that type of close... 07-28-2006, 10:29 PM
Geof Perhaps in the hands of some... 07-28-2006, 11:19 PM
widgitmaster Too bad you didn't work with... 07-29-2006, 12:46 AM
The Puma Man So Geoff, you think you’re so... 07-30-2006, 11:27 PM
Geof Nope, check:... 07-30-2006, 11:48 PM
tobyaxis Originally posted by The Puma... 07-31-2006, 12:19 AM
widgitmaster Thanks tobyaxis! I Agree,... 07-31-2006, 03:28 AM
ozzie34231 Sharpener plans? 07-31-2006, 04:52 PM
diarmaid Why dont you try making one... 08-01-2006, 11:10 PM
The Puma Man My apologies Geoff I thought... 07-31-2006, 05:16 PM
krt9751 i like to sharpen my bits i... 08-20-2006, 05:44 AM
handlewanker Hi all, the question is how... 09-15-2006, 03:25 AM
Mcgyver Ian, is the design similar to... 09-15-2006, 02:12 PM
ozzie34231 Love to see the design! ... 09-15-2006, 02:12 PM
handlewanker Hi Mac, yes the Potts type is... 09-15-2006, 02:57 PM
handlewanker Hi all, when I learned the... 09-15-2006, 04:28 PM
handlewanker Hi all, just been thinking... 09-16-2006, 06:57 PM
DeadPerson At my NTMA school, the first... 09-22-2006, 09:00 PM
naytep Just do it 10-25-2006, 09:36 PM
kokelol mcgyver reply 02-05-2007, 07:24 AM
naytep Pots jig 02-05-2007, 03:49 PM
kokelol McGyver 02-06-2007, 08:26 AM
Mcgyver kokelol, mine isn't really... 02-05-2007, 08:47 PM
kokelol handlewanker 02-06-2007, 08:10 AM
handlewanker Hi Koke, Here's a few scans... 02-06-2007, 12:44 AM
kokelol handlewanker 02-06-2007, 06:32 AM
viny new to post 02-06-2007, 10:20 AM
handlewanker Good on ya Viny, we knew you... 02-06-2007, 02:33 PM
rancherbill Thanks Handlewanker 02-06-2007, 05:47 PM
Willbird Heck even if you are gonna... 02-07-2007, 01:08 AM
handlewanker Hi Rancherbill, it just goes... 02-07-2007, 03:23 AM
human cnc i am the only tool grinder... 05-03-2007, 02:10 AM
Mazaholic I can and have on many... 05-22-2007, 11:27 PM
Willbird I would be willing to bet... 05-22-2007, 11:35 PM
handlewanker Well, I've seen a lot of... 05-23-2007, 04:28 AM
Geof I agree with Handlewhatsit... 05-23-2007, 04:43 AM
Mazaholic I would say that only half of... 05-23-2007, 04:55 AM
Geof A good machinist would... 05-23-2007, 05:02 AM
Mazaholic I know..i was just trying to... 05-23-2007, 05:16 AM
joecnc1234 Why in the he** would I want... 05-23-2007, 11:19 AM
Geof Well of course we are,... 05-23-2007, 05:03 PM
Mazaholic Hey now...i never knock the... 05-23-2007, 10:49 PM
Geof It's okay. It's like growing... 05-23-2007, 11:06 PM
fizzissist I been sharpening drills by... 05-24-2007, 05:10 AM
handlewanker Dear Joe, I know a guy who... 05-23-2007, 04:54 PM
Willbird I have spoken with many many... 05-23-2007, 08:45 PM
joecnc1234 Have you ever made airplane... 05-25-2007, 09:12 AM
JerryFlyGuy It's also the reason why... 05-25-2007, 04:04 PM
joecnc1234 I don't think it is the worry... 05-26-2007, 06:01 AM
Mazaholic Here's how you sharpen a tap. 05-26-2007, 08:02 PM
Geof D****d puppies! On the... 05-26-2007, 09:06 PM
Mcgyver yeah i know, I've done stats,... 05-27-2007, 03:28 AM
joecnc1234 Geof I have only one question... 05-27-2007, 08:15 AM
Geof Because I could not find a... 05-27-2007, 02:51 PM
Mazaholic Nice Geof! Your my hero! I... 05-27-2007, 06:18 PM
handlewanker Hi Geof, doesn't it give you... 05-27-2007, 06:41 PM
Geof Never truer words written.... 05-27-2007, 07:40 PM
joecnc1234 You know I get a bigger buzz... 05-30-2007, 12:45 PM
Mcgyver the naysayers to tap making,... 06-01-2007, 03:12 AM
joecnc1234 So mcgyver, 1) how much is... 06-01-2007, 05:10 AM
ajmoir Joe look up real quick... ... 06-01-2007, 06:24 AM
Laser.Tech Sorry Joe, but I had to jump... 06-01-2007, 06:57 AM
Mazaholic I know the philosophy behind... 06-01-2007, 11:36 PM
joecnc1234 So I guess I missed the... 06-01-2007, 11:19 AM
Mcgyver Joe, its not a business for... 06-01-2007, 12:11 PM
Mazaholic Also i know nothing of any... 06-01-2007, 11:58 PM
Geof I like both your posts, I... 06-02-2007, 12:31 AM
martinw [QUOTE=Geof;304067]I like... 06-03-2007, 12:29 AM
Geof They are steel. You simply... 06-03-2007, 02:39 AM
roundman drill doctor may work for... 06-03-2007, 02:46 AM
handlewanker Sounds like Martinw is... 06-12-2007, 03:09 AM
martinw Dear Ian, I could be... 06-12-2007, 05:00 PM
joecnc1234 Good show martinw, if drill... 06-13-2007, 10:24 AM
joecnc1234 Mcgyver, My Posts here are... 06-13-2007, 10:59 AM
Mcgyver Joe, thanks for the offer, if... 06-13-2007, 09:25 PM
handlewanker Hi Martinw, sorry if I came... 06-13-2007, 12:26 PM
timewarp Hi, Can someone please make a... 06-13-2007, 03:12 PM
fizzissist I did a Video/Google for... 06-13-2007, 07:53 PM
Geof Go back up the thread a few... 06-13-2007, 08:08 PM
Geof Yeah, the intolerant old so... 06-13-2007, 03:33 PM
martinw Dear Ian, I know the... 06-13-2007, 08:59 PM
Geof That's the spirit! Give the... 06-13-2007, 09:01 PM
martinw Dear Geof, Thank you for... 06-14-2007, 12:49 AM
Mazaholic Joe, You don't think the... 06-13-2007, 10:03 PM
Mazaholic I was once told by a... 06-14-2007, 12:54 AM
handlewanker Geof, better take your... 06-14-2007, 07:47 AM
joecnc1234 Mcgyver, I guess I thought... 06-14-2007, 11:05 AM
martinw Ian's tutorial 06-14-2007, 03:01 PM
handlewanker Hi, who cares who owns the... 06-14-2007, 06:12 PM
joecnc1234 I guess in the land of OZ you... 06-15-2007, 11:59 AM
handlewanker Hey Joe, they don't call OZ... 06-17-2007, 03:29 PM
Frankenfab I sharpen drills by hand,... 07-01-2007, 08:27 PM
Big_d Just read through the posts... 08-23-2007, 11:04 AM
handlewanker Hi BigD, repetition, best way... 08-24-2007, 01:45 AM
jrrdw It only took me 3 trys to... 08-25-2007, 10:45 PM
victorofga when i learned, back in the... 09-01-2007, 06:41 PM
JROM Drill sharpening was just... 09-07-2007, 11:08 PM
mc-motorsports Hand sharpening is VERY... 03-20-2008, 07:16 AM
Ch_Irawan Is it possible to hand... 03-20-2008, 11:08 AM
neilw20 Mostly 03-20-2008, 02:32 PM
tool_man I used to sharpen all my... 03-20-2008, 04:38 PM
handlewanker Hi all, anything is possible... 03-20-2008, 05:26 PM
Ch_Irawan Hi Neil, thanks for your... 03-20-2008, 07:28 PM
neilw20 Google for Diamond Wheel. 03-21-2008, 11:06 PM
Ch_Irawan Ok, I'll try to find what I... 03-23-2008, 02:41 PM
neilw20 Practice 03-23-2008, 05:20 PM
ChipsNChips Oh boy, much ado about... 03-21-2008, 02:58 AM
handlewanker Hi neilw20, that's just about... 03-24-2008, 03:50 AM
neilw20 Pictures please 03-24-2008, 09:52 AM
phillby Ian it is a bit later but I... 05-16-2008, 02:39 AM
neilw20 Ian? 05-16-2008, 03:44 AM
jjdon I sharpen #70's by hand... 03-27-2008, 08:47 PM
halestone try holding the drill in a... 03-28-2008, 10:26 AM
handlewanker Hi all, the drill sharpening... 03-28-2008, 01:02 PM
neilw20 #70 03-28-2008, 01:45 PM
neilw20 Sharpen 0.5mm Carbide. 03-28-2008, 02:12 PM
Ch_Irawan Hi Neil, would you make a... 03-28-2008, 05:39 PM
jjdon >I don't know what a #70... 03-28-2008, 11:44 PM
handlewanker Just sharpened a 1mm drill on... 05-04-2008, 08:08 AM
neilw20 That works for any size. 05-04-2008, 09:06 AM
handlewanker Ahem, hi Neil, Ian calling,... 05-16-2008, 04:32 PM
neilw20 I like it! 05-16-2008, 06:34 PM
handlewanker Hi, I could also bring a... 05-18-2008, 05:37 AM
neilw20 Broken drills. 05-18-2008, 05:43 AM
mc-motorsports just wondering, is this... 05-18-2008, 06:46 AM
handlewanker Hi Neil, no ball & chain now,... 05-18-2008, 06:37 AM
handlewanker MC-motorsports and to whom it... 05-18-2008, 09:58 AM
neilw20 slang. 05-18-2008, 12:37 PM
phillby Drill Sharpener & BBQ 05-18-2008, 11:52 PM
neilw20 Had to make one to suit me. 05-19-2008, 02:04 AM
handlewanker Hi Brian, know what you mean... 05-19-2008, 01:45 AM
handlewanker Hey Neil, I'm astounded, did... 05-20-2008, 04:29 AM
neilw20 Not a fake. 05-20-2008, 08:19 AM
handlewanker Hi Neil, .025mm, that's .010"... 05-29-2008, 03:21 AM
neilw20 How small? 05-29-2008, 04:38 AM
handlewanker OOPS, that damm point, yeah... 05-30-2008, 02:35 AM
Geof A guy I know used these for a... 07-12-2008, 02:41 PM
MarkT I have sharpened standard 118... 07-12-2008, 02:27 PM
manoharan In my place I do it all time... 08-28-2008, 07:49 PM
Drais_80 Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 11-27-2018, 11:47 PM
hfjbuis Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 11-28-2018, 09:42 AM
Protronie It's just not worth the time... 09-20-2008, 04:38 PM
handlewanker You still MAKE your own... 10-01-2008, 01:39 PM
neilw20 I just sharpened 6. 10-01-2008, 02:28 PM
Astonlee Sharping drills below 1/4" is... 12-13-2008, 09:56 PM
handlewanker You've got to know when to... 12-14-2008, 11:57 PM
neilw20 30 seconds? 12-15-2008, 03:39 PM
Bubba Also, being a HSM, I don't... 12-15-2008, 03:56 PM
neilw20 No local store. 12-15-2008, 05:47 PM
handlewanker Astonlee, I've heard of... 12-16-2008, 04:54 AM
cheetahcnc A retired tool and die maker... 01-25-2009, 06:15 AM
neilw20 Not exactly a drill but.. 01-25-2009, 04:09 PM
venomgrrrl Takes alot of practice, but... 04-20-2009, 11:24 PM
Motzilla41 Remembering the Basics 09-19-2009, 11:43 PM
WA Toolman Hi Motzilla41... Another one... 05-30-2010, 07:04 PM
edilberto.milan Hi all of good people out... 05-29-2010, 03:42 PM
handlewanker Hello Ed, what's your... 05-30-2010, 04:36 PM
handlewanker Hi all, I would go as far as... 08-12-2010, 02:10 AM
christinandavid Carbide tooling needs to be... 10-15-2010, 12:46 AM
gdgrinder I have worked in a machine... 03-05-2011, 10:27 AM
DMF_TomB sharpening poll 03-05-2011, 02:53 PM
Dualkit Mine have to do with size, I... 03-05-2011, 05:35 PM
Joe S. Wow, they still sell those ?... 03-24-2012, 11:22 AM
handlewanker The fact is everyone, if'n... 03-05-2011, 06:11 PM
Dualkit The fact is everyone, if'n... 03-05-2011, 06:44 PM
Monkey_Nuts I always used to sharpen... 05-06-2011, 10:09 AM
gdgrinder The boss think about save the... 05-10-2011, 01:59 AM
wganders Drill Sharpening 05-10-2011, 09:00 PM
handlewanker Mostly it is the pride you... 10-20-2011, 01:23 AM
handlewanker The last statement is only... 10-20-2011, 01:50 AM
wganders Are you kidding! 11-20-2011, 03:58 PM
handlewanker Yeah, pay peanuts get... 11-20-2011, 11:50 PM
neilw20 Yep, promotion beyond their... 11-20-2011, 11:59 PM
Cavi Mike I once worked with a... 12-01-2011, 10:22 AM
z369 I used to do it all the time,... 03-15-2012, 05:51 AM
Renesky Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 08-17-2016, 10:28 PM
Joe S. Ha Ha Ha does he buy 2 ply... 03-24-2012, 11:26 AM
Dan342 nice work thanks for ... 05-16-2012, 05:22 AM
uli12us I often have the problem,... 05-31-2012, 09:48 PM
neilw20 Want to drill a round hole in... 06-01-2012, 02:28 AM
handlewanker Uli12us.......Words fail... 06-01-2012, 03:00 AM
uli12us @handlewanker: Sorry, I'm... 06-01-2012, 01:50 PM
neilw20 uli12us, Been there, done... 06-01-2012, 01:55 PM
handlewanker uli12us, no problem, you... 06-01-2012, 05:27 PM
underthetire I just give it to the sheet... 06-01-2012, 05:48 PM
Dualkit When I was 25 I could sharpen... 07-22-2012, 02:24 PM
Thad92 Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-17-2017, 01:24 PM
dharmic Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-14-2017, 08:24 AM
ChipsNChips Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-14-2017, 10:30 PM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-14-2017, 06:16 PM
dharmic Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-15-2017, 01:13 AM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-15-2017, 03:39 AM
RCaffin Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-17-2017, 11:05 AM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-18-2017, 08:12 AM
neilw20 Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-15-2017, 03:16 PM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-15-2017, 05:22 PM
neilw20 Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-17-2017, 05:01 AM
NUGUY Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 09-12-2017, 02:30 AM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-17-2017, 09:21 AM
hfjbuis Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 05-27-2018, 06:53 PM
RCaffin Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-18-2017, 09:06 AM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-19-2017, 05:15 AM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-19-2017, 06:09 AM
RCaffin Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-19-2017, 08:32 AM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 07-19-2017, 09:33 AM
bestellen Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 08-19-2017, 06:08 PM
handlewanker Re: Sharpening drill bits by... 08-19-2017, 07:22 PM
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    262
    Heck even if you are gonna sharp it on a drill grinder, if some fool has badly mangled it I think it is quicker to whip it into shape by hand, then shine it up purty on the drill grinder :-). I have done large drills on a belt sander :-) or a disk sander :-).

    Knowing how to hand gash an endmill is a nice skill to have too :-)....takes the same kind of a steady hand.

    Bill

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    6463
    Hi Rancherbill, it just goes to show you, there isn't a tool out there that hasn't been made in some form or other before.
    The principle remains the same in most cases, but the trick is to design it so that it will work better, or is easier to make.
    It just occured to me after reading the previous posts that the Potts type drill grinder jig uses the side of the wheel, which is not a good practice, but can be used to advantage when the need arises.
    When I've got a bit of time I'm going to have a look at how a broad faced cup stone, mounted on the bench grinder, will work for the application of the Potts type drill jig.
    In all cases, where a drill grinding jig is being used, it must be firmly mounted so that there is no lost movement between it and the stone.
    To enable this, the grinder should be mounted on a steel plate, and then the jig won't flex away from the stone face.
    I like the aspect of the Deckel SO tool & ctr grinder, which if you look at it properly in the case of lathe tools, is just an angulated work holder that pivots around a round shaft, and stays in the same plane.
    Before anyone gets hot under the collar at the "just" part, it is still a simple guided plane but very reliable and well made to stand up to the grinding dust and day to day grinding requirements.
    The ability to present the tool to the stone precisely and advance a thou at a time, and always at the right angle is the answer to a maidens prayer, but the price of a Deckel, $US1000 second hand or more, is a bit off putting and one of the reasons that professor Chaddock designed the Quorn T&C grinder for the home builder and user.
    Which comes down to having a firm base, with no slop, to enable repeat performance to happen.
    No matter how proficient you become at hand grinding tools, even the simplest grinding jig pays dividends in accuracy and time saving.
    Ian.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1
    i am the only tool grinder period out of 12 employees sad part is most are older than me

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    227
    I can and have on many occasions hand sharpened tooling and have even made my own tooling out of tool steel...But.
    Not sure i agree that a machinist should know how to hand sharpen drills or tooling.
    It is a dying skill and anyone that can do it should be commended,but for most of the modern machining industry all it does is make you more appreciative of what you have.
    A real machinist knows the metal he works with, and has the ability to choose what tooling,feeds,speeds,coolants,and machines required to make an end product as close to what the customer wants as possible, and in as little time as possible without sacrificing quality.
    And the most important part..he takes pride in his work.
    Being able to hand sharpen drills is nice,but not required to be a good machinist.
    I like to hunt deer...but i'm not gonna chip a hunting knife out of flint rock to dress the deer.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    262
    I would be willing to bet that MOST people that think it is unimportant cannot do it nicely, and the reverse is true also :-).

    What if we modified the question to ask if a good machinist should be able to sharpen a drill with a drill grinder ??


    Bill

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    6463
    Well, I've seen a lot of situations where the deskilling of the workplace is taken to such a degree that someone can walk in from the street, never seen a machine tool in his/her life and six months later is a "fully qualified", I kid you not, machinist.
    I heard an amusing story at the waterhole the other night, a guy applied for a job as a skilled machinist and when given a test asked, "where's the green button I have to press?".
    It seems that the term watchmaker is now someone that is capable enough to open a watch and replace the battery.
    Strewth, my brother in law is chief cook and bottle washer at the local greasy spoon cafe, but that doesn't give him cordon bleau capabilities.
    Getting back to the drill sharpening skills, if you can't sharpen a drill and you call your self skilled, then you won't rank with the professionals who can when you're put to the test.
    I don't care who you are or how long you've been hacking metal, if you're mechanical skills are lacking in any department then you're second rate at best, especially those that proudly express their inability to master the fundamental skills and disciplines of engineering.
    We've now got a generation of green button pushers that only have to know which green button to push to make a particular tool do a specific job.
    Ian.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    12177
    I agree with Handlewhatsit and if you want to call yourself a hunter then make your own bow and arrow and stalk your prey like a true hunter did a few generations ago.
    An open mind is a virtue...so long as all the common sense has not leaked out.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    227
    I would say that only half of the people that say they can....can actually hand sharpen tooling...Only about half of those can do it right.
    Many times i see people claim to be able to sharpen drills and i have to inform them that it isn't supposed to look like a pencil.

    If i wanted a machine shop to make me an engine block..I drop off a block of steel..The machinist takes that block and mill it,drill it,bore it,hone it,grind it,line bore it,decks it.
    In the end that block is perfect...I could care less if he hand sharpened the drills or any other tooling he used,he's still a good machinist to me.
    The end product and the knowledge to get there is whats important.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
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    12177
    Quote Originally Posted by Mazaholic View Post
    ....If i wanted a machine shop to make me an engine block..I drop off a block of steel..The machinist takes that block and mill it,drill it,bore it,hone it,grind it,line bore it,decks it....
    A good machinist would probably tell you a block of steel is not the best material to make an engine block out of.
    An open mind is a virtue...so long as all the common sense has not leaked out.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    227
    Quote Originally Posted by Geof View Post
    A good machinist would probably tell you a block of steel is not the best material to make an engine block out of.
    I know..i was just trying to make a point.
    Making and sharpening tools by hand is a good skill to master,i don't disagree with that.
    But there are much more important things to being a machinist.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    247
    Why in the he** would I want a guy making top dollar to sharpen drills when I could send the whole lot out and have them resharpened for a buck a piece, or buy new drills, and my guy could be making parts at $60 an hour. It would be like making lathe tools instead of buying inserts! I think the old timers are justifying there skills, but we have to be progressive to make money work smarter not harder. BTW I've never sharpened a drill by hand Why would I? Just to prove I can?
    Joe

  12. #12
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    Jul 2005
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    12177
    Quote Originally Posted by joecnc1234 View Post
    .... I think the old timers are justifying there skills,....Joe
    Well of course we are, because we have them! We're not just a bunch of green button pushers.
    An open mind is a virtue...so long as all the common sense has not leaked out.

  13. #13
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    May 2007
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    227
    Quote Originally Posted by joecnc1234 View Post
    I think the old timers are justifying there skills,
    Hey now...i never knock the oldtimers.
    I have learned alot throughout the years from"old timers".
    You'd be suprised at what problems you'll have that will just ruin your whole day and an "old timer" will walk up and fix it in a minute.
    Ever have a chatter problem and your whole day is spent trying 200 different ideas and the "old timer" comes in on second shift and runs good parts from part one?

  14. #14
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    Jul 2005
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    12177
    Quote Originally Posted by Mazaholic View Post
    Hey now...i never knock the oldtimers....
    It's okay. It's like growing up on a farm...there are always the little puppies running around yapping at your heels. They grow up and calm down after a while.
    An open mind is a virtue...so long as all the common sense has not leaked out.

  15. #15
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    Apr 2006
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    3206
    I been sharpening drills by hand for over 40 years, and I started out because I HAD to!!

    We've got 3 drill grinders, and one I happen to rather like that does a good job....yet I still do a lot of hand grinding where I need something slightly different that isn't built into the machine's capabilities. Like kissing the edges for a smooth finish, or stoning the faces for better chip break up or longer life.

    Sometimes it's just plain faster and easier, and I can't split the point on most drills within a minute or so.

    No, I ain't perfect, and no, I'm not as good as a fresh new drill. Tell ya what though, a good eyeball calibrated drill point is something to be proud of.

  16. #16
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    Sep 2006
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    6463
    Dear Joe, I know a guy who just wakes up in the morning. makes a phone call lasting 30 secs, and earns twice what I earned in a month, then he goes back to sleep till mid-day.
    Last week he asked me to take him up to the hospital for some heart mnedication because his car wouldn't start.
    Turns out the battery was flat.
    I said,"wine chew getta new battery?" He just said," someone's coming to fix it".
    He preffered to get on the phone to get someone down to fix-it whenever it stopped running.
    I'm all for not getting your hands dirty but thats going from the sublime to the rediculous.
    I hope the guy who earns $60 an hour can keep doing it, with a lack of basic fundamentals he's going to need it if the going gets rough.
    Up to a point you are right about not doing it the hard or maybe the old way.
    When you live in a perfect world then the best way is the only way, cost doesn't come into it.
    I would no more expect a highly skilled brain surgeon to know how to sharpen his own sharp bits when nowadays they are all throw items anyway, prepacked, sterilised and untouched by human hand.
    In the perfect machine shop the best way is the only way, and the tooling would all be pristine, unused, brand new without a nick or a burr, waiting for the call to produce the perfect hole to microns every time, with a tool life that made scrap parts and down time negligable.
    I would venture to say that as long as I have a vent in my trousers the perfect machine shop will never exist, no matter how up to date our present technology is, due to the fact that there is a cut-off point when it doesn't pay to be perfect.
    The customer will only pay a certain amount, and is not sympathetic to a cost structure that has a blank bottom line.
    To sum it up, in Uk in the '80s where I worked, we had a chap who had worked for a number of years in Germany.
    His total experiance was with preformed tooling and throw away carbides, toolstore maintained and issued to drawing requirments.
    We were all issued with a set of drills to 12mm diam when we started there, and he couldn't shapen a tool to save his life.
    He informed us that no one in a German workshop ground their drills by hand.
    So we just showed him how anyway.
    I like the idea of the perfect workshop where everything is bright, shiny and pristine, and you get whatever you want just for the asking, but I accept the reality of the moment and go prepared to face any challenge.
    As for to-day, the finger that pushes the button rules the world.
    Ian.

  17. #17
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    Nov 2006
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    262
    I have spoken with many many co-workers that could not run a thread in a lathe, yet proclaimed themselves to be artistes at the trade of machinist.....in fact may could not run a lathe PERIOD....and yes they were green button guys, and many many of them had zero idea what the cnc program on the screen meant other than.

    T01 M06 (SAFE START BLOCK FOR T01) being where you started T01 to run from there. They had no desire to learn more, and would proclaim to all and sundrey how GOOD they were at the trade. Some of these guys COULD sharpen a drill, with a drill grinder...maybe even an Oliver drill grinder :-)...BUT one example did not know how to change tool offsets, so as he sharpened the drill that was munched by sand inclusions, he simply made a program edit to make the drill go deeper so it went thru the part......so when we came in on days the drill was starting to feed 1" above the workpiece.

    Talk about the basics, we had one guy who was a radial drill operator, decent fella, but he couldnt READ....that really played heck with a QS audit when they asked what "Safety Related Componant" on the blueprint said, he told the Auditor "I don't know, I can't read". We were slow for a couple weeks and they had this fella paint all the trash drums, 55 gallon drums, he painted them safety yellow, and then made some nice stencils that said "TRASCH", and painted that nicely in black on 20-30 drums.

    Bill

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    247
    Have you ever made airplane parts? GE has a specification for drilling read it, it is detailed down to coolant and holes drilled per drill after they reach their max holes drilled you must mark them and put them in a controlled (locked) area. I'm sure if you're making oilfield parts or any commercial parts it doesn't matter if the point is not on center but sometimes it does. Fly safe
    Joe

  19. #19
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    Sep 2005
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    1660
    It's also the reason why Boeing Surplus has so many tools for sale, and good condition ones at that! Think about GE for a second, they are deep hole drilling a turbine housing, if the bit breaks off inside there, they will pretty much wreck the housing and it will be scrap. Why? Well anything they do to get it out, is 'outside the approved process for fabrication', they are off of the 'beaten track' and could be damaging something or effecting something that will fail later. At that point, there is no safe method for removing it [and no EDM isn't safe in this situation either as you can't garrentee that you won't gouge or nick the side of the hole at some point.]

    The same thing goes for 90% of the parts made of the military and NASA. They are elliminating the 'unknowns'. If by only drilling 50 holes w/ a bit is what they decide is a safe number which will keep them away from broken bit's, then it's VERY cost effective to throw away a $5-10 bit every 50 holes instead of 1 in 100 [or even 1 in 1000] parts due to a broken bit.

    It really has nothing to do with sharpening bits at all.
    JerryFlyGuy
    The more I know... the more I realize I don't
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  20. #20
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    Dec 2006
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    247
    I don't think it is the worry of losing parts so much as changing the properties of the material like work hardening the material or bell mouthing the holes. Plus if I change drills every 50 parts or 10 parts I don't have to worry about cutting oversize or undersize. It's easy to see on an spc chart. If i sharpen my own drills I have no idea of the drill change frequency because I have no idea how long it will last. next someone will tell me how to resharpen taps!!!

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