[Psychlist1972]

I've been searching around here for a bit, and found almost nothing (except some nice 3d renderings) regarding the Machine Tools Warehouse (MTW) MD001 mill.

The X travel is perfect for what I need (need > 20" usable travel after any CNC conversion), and it seems like a beefy enough machine while remaining small enough that I just might be able to get it into my basement workspace.

I'm curious to know if anyone has converted one to CNC and, if so, how it differs from the rf45 and IH mill conversions and I've been reading about here. Pictures appreciated if you have them. (EDIT: I did find ninefinger's build thread and am following up with him, but I figured there may be others?)

I'm also wondering why I don't see any information here. It seems like a good priced mill with a huge work envelope. Are there any known issues with it or MTW?

I've sent an email through the "contact us" link on the MTW site with some questions about the MD001, but haven't yet heard back. I also asked them if it would be possible to get one, but substitute the belt-driven higher-speed head (for a price, of course) in their MD001-CNC machine. A nice machine, but out of my budget. Any idea if someone from MTW is on the forums here at all?

[sdubfid]

I just sold my mtw md001. No issues with it at all just too big for my area. My only complaint was the lack of rpm range. The gears weren't noisey at all in my opinion. You are better off calling mtw directly and Pat will answer any questions you have.

[cyclestart]

I have the MD001, no complaints regarding the machine and Pat is a pleasure to deal with.

Prying a piece of the MD001-CNC out of his hands seems unlikely but nothing lost in asking. The $12000 price tag is probably his way of saying "it'll be done when it's done"

Edt/ As far as cnc, I'm still on the fence on whether to take this mill in that direction

[DSpeck]

Since the MD001 is labelled as being an Industrial Hobbies clone, you might try looking at the threads of people doing conversions on their IH mills. There are several that I recall seeing, and they have their own forum. There have been complaints lately about the service at IH, but the information on the conversions themselves will likely be of help to you. Just a thought...

[Psychlist1972]

@Cyclestart
I recently noticed he has big full-page ads in magazines saying it'll come in 2011. Hope that's his plan. Who knows? In any case, it's worth trying.

@DSpeck
Thanks. I did look around at that, but most were specific to some kit that IH offers (but seems to never fulfill.) I'll check around again

[ninefinger]

The MD001 is the same as the IH mill - there are no mechanical differences. There might be a difference in the wiring but that is pretty minor, especially if you opt from the get go for a 3 phase motor and pick up a VFD to use with it (highly recommended).

Most of what you read on converting a RF45 / ZAY45 / IH mill / etc is applicable - the main difference between the MD001 and the RF45 / ZAY45 is the travel on x and y and Z are shorter, but they share the same design footprint as far as table width and spacing of the ways if I recall correctly. There are some differences in the attachment of the Z screw to the Z slide but again its really not that big a deal.

If there is a picture of something on the mill you want to see let me know and I'll try and take one for you.

Oh yeah, last thing is availability. Seems that they are never in stock so you have to order and wait for the next container to come in (up to 3 months later).

Mike

[yooooda]

I've talked with Pat regularly over the past couple of months. He has been helpful and cooperative. I was going to buy an MD001 in September, but he sold out before I could get one.
The good news is he has received another shipment of which I have already ordered one. It should arrive next week. I'll post pictures when I can.
Some reasons I went with them are Pat has been good on communications, and his mill has higher spindle speeds than the IH mill, 1920 on the high end vs, 1500 or so. That's good if you can't afford the VFD drive right away. I too have the need for the larger travels and table size. I also found out that both parts of the ways are ground, not just the bottom part you can see, so I'm hopfull that all will be well.

[Psychlist1972]

@yooda

Congratulations on your new mill

Thanks. Yes, Pat answered my questions about the mill offerings. Unless something else appears in the meantime (and assuming they're still around), I'll likely get a MD001 next year, but get it with the 3 phase motor and run it from a VFD.

Definitely post pics and whatnot when you get it. the more detailed the better!

Out of curiosity, which spindle taper did you end up purchasing? I know this can be a hot topic, and I haven't yet made up my mind

Pete

[yooooda]

I went with the R8 spindle. I have a fair amount f tooling from my old Jet round column mill/drill. I did order an extra 2hp three phase motor from them as well so I know I'll have one that fits when the time comes to get the VFD.
In the meantime, it's hurry up and wait.

[ninefinger]

Out of curiosity, which spindle taper did you end up purchasing? I know this can be a hot topic, and I haven't yet made up my mind

Pete

BTW - I have the NT30 spindle. Unless you are super keen on fabbing up an automatic tool changer I don't recommend it. I thought I would go that way but the more (or less...) I use it the more I realize that in my personal workshop environment I'm a long way off from having an ATC. I'm far better off spending money on a good CAD and CAM program instead. Way more time to be saved there than the 20 to 60 seconds it takes to change tools. Plus the NT30 tooling is harder to find and more expensive when you do find it...(ie $10 to $15 more on cheap stuff, even more for quality stuff), That adds up fast when you start buying all your tooling.

On the other hand if everybody starts buying NT30 then it can become the standard and it will get cheaper for me - so get a NT30 spindle!

My 2 cents...

Mike

[yooooda]

The MTW MD001 has arrived. A couple of pictures to get you started. I'll post more as time and progress permit.
Initial impression- Big. Clean. Solid.

[arizonavideo]

I was reading the IH thread and I have a IH mill and Tommy said that he refused the last shipment because the castings were lighter. He said to look at the oil fill hole on the left side of the column to see how thick the casting is. Mine was 3/4"

It should be over 3/4".

The only real weakness I found on mine was the three bolts holding the head to the column are not shoulder bolts and they made some chips in the mounting ring. I replaced them with some from McMasters but I had to turn them on the lathe to fit.

Have fun with the new mill.

[jason_b]

I am very close to getting an MD001. Can yooooda (or anyone else) tell me the rpm rating of the 3ph mtw motor? Its not listed on their site.

Jason

[yooooda]

The three phase motor plate says 1700 rpm, same as the single phase motor. The mills come standard with the 220V, single phase unless you order special and wait. MTW had some three phase motors in stock so I ordered the extra three phase motor for the day when I can get the VFD. The mill itself lists the top spindle speed as 1920 rpm which should be adequate for most things initially.

[jason_b]

Thanks for letting me know. Though I was hoping you'd say it was 3400 rpm. I guess I'll plan on a different motor.

Jason

[arvidj]

The three phase motor plate says 1700 rpm, same as the single phase motor. The mills come standard with the 220V, single phase unless you order special and wait. MTW had some three phase motors in stock so I ordered the extra three phase motor for the day when I can get the VFD. The mill itself lists the top spindle speed as 1920 rpm which should be adequate for most things initially.

Some additional questions if you don't mind. Does it appear as thought the motor is rated for use with an inverter use?

Also is the top spindle speed you cited related to the listed speeds of the gearbox when used with a fixed speed motor or is it related to limits -- gears, bearings, what ever -- and therefore higher speeds that would be available with a VFD would not be recommended?

Maybe only Pat would be able to answer these quesitons but I thought I would give it a try.

Thanks

[ninefinger]

I can answer a few of your questions:
the 1920 rpm is based off the stock fixed speed motor, running in high gear with a ~1750rpm input.
I seriously doubt that the 3 phase 2hp motor is inverter rated. That being said I have that motor from MTW and it performs fine with the VFD I have and as long as you keep it cool it should be fine for a long time. I use the gearbox to get close to my desired operating speed and use the VFD to fine tune the cut depending on what I'm doing. I have teh motor at 3500 rpm for long periods of time in high gear to get ~4000rpm spindle speed and the motor is fine - its the gearbox and spindle that can suffer when you try and run fast for long periods (hot to the touch).
If I recall correctly the inverter rating means it has better insulation so it can run hotter - which is what happens when you run it below its nominal speed cause the fan on top doesn't blow as much air when it spins slowly.

Personnaly, if I'm running slow I change the gears - I haven't got a belt drive conversion done or even planned and the loss of low speed torque is part of what is keeping me from doing it.

Mike

[arvidj]

Thanks for the quick response.

You are correct that inverter rated motors usually have better insulation to deal with the heat and especially voltage spikes that an inverter generates. Normal line voltage is pretty smooth but what an inverter puts out is far from smooth. I think the insulation rating of ‘H’ indicates it is a better insulation than ‘F’. An interesting side note that I ran across while doing research is that a dual voltage motor – 230\460 – have very good inverter voltage protection when used in the 230 mode based on the extra headroom provided by the need to meet the “normal non-inverter” rating for 460.

As you point out cooling at lower speeds is also an issue. With a TEFC motor the fan turns at motor speed so when run at low speeds but high loads – when extra heat will be generated – the enclosed fan may not run fast enough. The inverter rated motor I bought for my drill press has an external fan independent of the motor shaft – think a big PC fan – in a coffee can style of enclosure that surrounds the motor and constantly blows air over the outside of the motor irrespective of the motor speed. The fan is 120 volts and I have it on a separate switch from the motor controls.

[jason_b]

This is great information. I knew the mtw motor would probably not be vfd rated, but would have done it anyway. I didn't know what would happen if I ran it at double its rated rpm.

Thanks
Jason

[pete from TN]

That is all true to some extent. However I have a belt driven spindle with TWO speeds and I am here to tell you that my motor NEVER gets even warm despite using it on slow speeds drilling holes in steel with large diameter drill bits Silver and deming. I have had projects that I had to drill and mill some rather deep and large holes in steel bar and I was checking the motor quite a bit and I was amazed to see it never even got warm to the touch. I run my 1725 RPM motor down to around 10hz and it has excellent power with the Vector drive and is smooth as anything I have ever seen. It also runs up to around 6500 RPM on top and it has literally run for hundreds of hours at full tilt again without the motor even getting warm. I Do remember that running my gear head before the belt drive and the case would often get hot on me and the fluid would get all bubbly and of course it would leak that nice tablespoonful of fluid onto my vise when I went to sleep. I gotta tell you I DO NOT MISS that noisy gear head AT ALL! If you do your engineering on the belt drive properly and setup the speeds to put the motor in it's proper torque curve you should not have any problems with low speed torque. That was a MAJOR design criteria of my belt drive is that I wanted to make sure I had GOOD torque not only down low but in high gear as well.

I dunno if I just got a good spindle motor out of luck but it sure does run smooth and cool. The faster spindle speed with good torque for spinning larger cutters is also a welcome improvement over the gear head. It quite literally transforms the machine. Peace

Pete