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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    3
    Rich;

    Righteeo, downloaded the Mach 3 manuals and printed them out. MMM, gonna' be a busy weekend.

    Thing is, I have BobCAD. It's not clear to me at all whether to pursue LasyCAM/Mach 3 or just run the Zenbot from BobCAD.

    Which is the shorter tool path, Guruji...?

    Many THANX,

    newbie nurflugel

    Quote Originally Posted by rich909 View Post
    Hi nurflugel --



    You *may* have already spotted it, but if not check out this post ...which is within this Zenbot QuickStart thread: http://www.cnczone.com/forums/1020726-post44.html

    It should answer most of your questions about starting out with Mach 3 on your Zenbot. If not, let me know where you are having specific problems and I will do my best to try to help get you going.

    BTW, if you haven't already done so, you might want to sign up for the Unofficial Zenbot User's Group (UZUGR_CNC) which can be found at: UZUGR_CNC : Unofficial Zenbot User's Group

    There is also a forum at the ZenbotCNC.com site that you may find helpful.

    HTH.

    --Rich

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    0

    I am new to Zenbot too

    I got my Zenbot 2424 last month and I agree the instructions are somewhat sparse. I read alot on this forum about Mach 3 and then I found the TAB key! I was able to then jog the machine around some with great glee. I then loaded some of the sample G-Code files that are contained in the Mach3 folder under Samples. I think every new cnc user must see the roadrunner air cut at least once before they try any actual chip making. I use the Rotozip 1500 with a HF router speed control, it works ok and much better than trying to cut everything at 30k rpm. I haven't put on limit switches or an e-stopper yet but who knows. I use a 1/4 spoil board under any profile cuts and I made my own eccentric cam hold downs to use with a rear table stop I got from Woodcrafters for 10 bucks. I also use 3m double sided tape as many others do. I am happy with my Zenbot all in all. Here are some pics of my rig in its sound proof booth and my first cut.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DSC00062.jpg   DSC00064.JPG  

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    109

    CAD/CAM Postprocessors

    Hi nurflugel --

    Quote Originally Posted by nurflugel View Post
    Rich;

    Righteeo, downloaded the Mach 3 manuals and printed them out. MMM, gonna' be a busy weekend. Thing is, I have BobCAD. It's not clear to me at all whether to pursue LasyCAM/Mach 3 or just run the Zenbot from BobCAD.

    Which is the shorter tool path, Guruji...?
    The version of LazyCam that is provided free with Mach-3 is a Beta Release and it is intended to allow users to import standard dxf, cmx, and other file types and generate g-code output for Mach-3. You certainly can use it to experiment with and get started with Mach-3. Long term you are going to want a good CAD/CAM package to generate g-code files for use with Mach-3.

    Personally, I use vCarve-Pro because I find it quick and easy to do the work I normally want to do. A person could 'start' out with Cut-3D if budget is an issue. I feel most users need both Cut-3D and vCarve-Pro unless you have the bucks go with Aspire right away. Most of these will output a g-code file that you open in Mach-3 and run to cut your project. I have no actual experience with BobCAD, so I can only offer the following 'best guess' on its set-up.

    Correct me if you know otherwise, but I don't believe there is a "direct to Zenbot" (Mechatronics) machine output from BobCAD, based on the listed post-processors at: Post Processors | BobCAD-CAM. If I am correct, you would use the Mill-Router machine-type with the 'Mach' controller-make, and then select the Mech3 post-processor you want, possibly 'Mach3 DynaCNC Rev-1'. Your BobCAD rep should be able to guide you with that, but you will probably want to stick with 'inch' based post-processors since your zenbot.xml configuration file is set for 'inches'. The resulting BobCAD output file will be Mach3 compatible g-code that you open and run under Mach-3.

    Once the post-processor has been downloaded and installed, you should make a simple test file to import into Mach-3 ....after you have completed the configuration and set-up steps outlined by ArtSoft in the Mach-3 Manual.

    Test moving each axis by manual jogs to verify things are working correctly Then you can run the test file as a simulation. If everything looks good, try an 'air' cut and see if the Zenbot moves correctly.

    I'd certainly recommend that you take your time checking things out before you attempt any actual cuts. When you are ready, make sure to use a spoil board and mount your work piece in the center of the work area so you have time to react before crashing your tool. You may also want to review the first dozen posts in this thread to get some ideas for set up, tooling and a few 'gotchas'.

    HTH

    --Rich

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    0

    Spindle questions - Kress feedback?

    Hi fellow Zenbot owners,
    I have just purchased a Zenbot 2424 and everything is going swell with the set up, however I am having a few troubles with getting a satisfactory spindle for it.

    I am based in Australia, and it seems the Australian market for fixed base routers with a variable speed control does not exist. I bought the Australian version of the bosch colt (bosch gmr 1), and was going to get shaun to make me a mount for it, but upon receiving the router I realised the only difference to the American Colt is that the Aussie one doesn't have a variable speed control, and runs at a staunch 30k rpm or something similar. A bit fast.

    So then i picked up a Dremel 300, and got Shaun to supply a mount for that instead of the Colt. Having set it up on my machine I am less than impressed with its performance - its just too flexy and weak. Also, although I'm mostly doing fairly fine work, I am finding only being able to use 1/8 or less tools pretty constricting.

    The only potential replacements I have found are the Kress 1050 FME, or a Chinese spindle with a VFD off ebay (which would be a bit more expensive).

    Does anyone have any experience with Kress spindles? And also does anyone know of a good 240v unit on the market I have overlooked?

    Thanks.

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    109
    Hi Lovejoy and all ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Lovejoy View Post
    <snip>
    I am based in Australia, and it seems the Australian market for fixed base routers with a variable speed control does not exist. I bought the Australian version of the bosch colt (bosch gmr 1), and was going to get shaun to make me a mount for it, but upon receiving the router I realised the only difference to the American Colt is that the Aussie one doesn't have a variable speed control, and runs at a staunch 30k rpm or something similar. A bit fast.
    <snip>
    You should look at SuperPID as an option to make the fixed speed Colt a good spindle for use with your Zenbot 2424. SuperPID is available in a 240V version, and you can check with them for any gotcha's related to use with the Aussie version Colt. Here is a link: www.SuperPID.com - Super-PID Closed-loop Router Speed Controller

    Although the Variable speed Colt is available in the U. S. A. it is not really a good choice because the speed range is only 16,000-35,000 RPM. The Kress 1050 has a speed range of 5000/25000 RPM which is better suited to CNC work.

    A number of Zenbot Users at: UZUGR_CNC : Unofficial Zenbot User's Group are using the Kress 1050 as their spindle, with good results. Perhaps some of them will share their experiences with you here.

    BTW, there are discussions here at CNCZone regarding spindle runout, but I don't know that anyone has done a comparison between the Colt and the Kress, which might be enlightening. I am running a Colt spindle on my own Zenbot 1216 with precision 1/8 & 1/4" collets (see: Bosch Colt TIR Measurement) and my unit is within expected tolerance.

    HTH.

    --Rich

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by Lovejoy View Post
    Hi fellow Zenbot owners,
    Does anyone have any experience with Kress spindles? And also does anyone know of a good 240v unit on the market I have overlooked?

    Thanks.
    Hi lovejoy
    The Dremel is really not suitable for presision work since the runout is terrible.
    I have the Kress 1050 (the 5000-25000 version) wich i use with a zenbot 16x24, and i am very happy with it. I am a novice, so take this into account with my advises :-).

  7. #67
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    0

    Smile Hitachi M12VC

    Hello All,

    I had purchased as Zenbot 12 x 16 about 8 months ago, then spent some time putting together a controller PC, learning the CAD/CAM process, etc. and finally starting carving actual wood last week. Things are going nicely and I am having lots of fun. I made a few nice pieces and am now looking into how to properly finish the product to give it a pleasing look.

    Anyway, I wanted to say that the Hitachi M12VC I use is very good. It has built-in feedback control regulating the spindle speed. With a mid-range spindle speed, I can cut quiet enough to run it in the garage while the wife and kids sleep upstairs.

  8. #68
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    0

    Zenbot X-Axis started skipping

    After some use of my zenbot, the x-axis started skipping and my wood piece was ruined. I also found some metallic dust particles on the wood work and thought I had stripped some gears or something.

    I contacted Shaun for help but got no response.

    So I started poking around. I opened the stepper motor drive cover and found that the pinion gear on the stepper motor came loose and the screw on the side was coming out. Screwed it down and everything is ok again. I'm glad that a costly repair wasn't needed.

    The metallic dust was from the wire brushes scraping against the metal cross bar supporting the assembly for the router. There was a significant amount o burr developing on the upper portion of that bar. So I filed it down and smoothed it out with sand paper. I didn't put any grease on it since grease would trap saw dust and clump.

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    41
    Hi hidamari. I dont think i ever got your email. I try hard to answer emails in a timely manner. Im glad you got your machine running, but i think the preload on your rails might be too high. You shouldnt be seeing metal flakes and significant grooving in the rails. Email me and ill take care of it.

  10. #70
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    0

    New Zenbot owner

    Hello all,

    I am very new to all of this. I take delivery of my new Zenbot 24x36 on Friday and I am trying to get everything ready ahead of time in preparation. Attached is a pic of the stand I built for the machine. If anyone want's plans for it, I am happy to provide them. It is quite simple if you have a welder and 3 hours to kill.

    Thanks to Rich for starting this thread. I plan to contribute plenty and often, as I have NO experience with CNC machines. So I hope my trials and tribulations will help flatten the learning curve of other new users.

    Back soon with more pics and reports on the set up and initial start up. If anyone knows some specific do's and dont's for getting started, please let me know.

    Matt
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_2682.jpg  

  11. #71
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    41
    wow matt. that is quite the table. looks nice.

  12. #72
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    0

    new zenbot

    Yeah, Thanks. I am a total geek when it comes to my equipment. When customers walk through my shop, they see neat and tidy professionalism. So sometimes I go a little nuts with things.

    I sealed the table with DEFT (great product, 6 coats) and was ready to take delivery of the new machine. When it arrived, we set it on the table, popped the gantry into place, tightened the bolts and hooked up the wires. Not much else was necessary. Shaun has a slick animal in the Zenbot. Any ding dong can get it up and running.

    Once the test run was successful, the cables that were draped everywhere made me start to itch, so I got out the sticky mounting bases and zip ties and bundled all the wires so they were tidy and clean and out of the way. Several beers and zip ties later, I had it all looking sharp. In the pictures, the PC is resting on a plank of hardwood and the screen and keyboards are on the end of the workspace, but I have a keyboard arm coming and a proper mount for the PC is almost done. Pics of those will follow.

    I also designed a dust shoe that attaches to the spindle mount (quick release for access), and a cool clear plastic sleeve that moves up and down with the router body (when visibility is a must). Both can be used with a shop vac, or larger dust collection system. I'm surprised Zenbot has not designed these items to sell as accessories. I would have bought them!

    So far, it runs great and I have done a large production run as well as a few smaller test jobs to get familiar with it. The pics are of the set up in my garage. Once it is just right, I will move it into the shop. More pics to come as I improve things.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_2689.jpg   IMG_2690.jpg   IMG_2691.jpg   IMG_2692.jpg  

    IMG_2694.jpg   IMG_2695.jpg   IMG_2696.jpg   IMG_2697.jpg  

    IMG_2698.jpg   IMG_2699.jpg  

  13. #73
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    0

    keyboard arm and clamps

    Well, though my posts haven’t offered hints to successful CNC router use, I hope the improvements I have made give other new users ideas for setting up their machine center to maximize efficiency.

    The keyboard/monitor arm is handy, allowing me to move the control in close to the work.

    I also designed some slick cam clamps for holding the work piece. They are great because they are very low profile, light weight and inexpensive. The set shown is ¼” clear acrylic, but I can make them in varied thicknesses to accommodate different materials. I used these to clamp both a ½” Delrin part, as well as a 2” thick butcher block. Worked awesome! And because they are plastic, if the tool runs off the edge of the material and nips the hold-down, there’s no damage.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_2701.jpg   IMG_2702.jpg   IMG_2703.jpg   IMG_2704.jpg  


  14. #74
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    163
    what kind of accuracy are you guys getting with your machines? bout to purchase one myself.

  15. #75
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    0
    So far, I have found the Zenbot to be a great machine for the price. They even made it to my spec (24 x 36) which is not listed on their site, for a small upcharge. It is compact, well built and easy to learn to use with the software they suggest for the application. Shaun at Zenbot is easy to work with and quick with support, not that I needed much, as the product was ridiculously easy to set up.

    That said, it is no more than a medium duty machine. It is best suited for the hobbyist or someone who's production doesn't require long duty cycles. It is NOT designed for high tolerance machining.

    It performs beautifully on the drill paths and small tool pocket paths, but I am finding it doesn't hold it's accuracy when running profile paths, or when using larger tools. It also seems to be inaccurate on the Z depths... when I carefully touch off my work piece and set my Z at zero, I still get varying depths and find myself trying to compensate and chase the problem. NOTE:, I am still learning how to use it, and each day I find a new trick that fixes a problem, so my negative remarks may be completely due to inexperience.

    My reason for buying it was to satisfy a specific customer's needs, and if I can use it for other things, then that's a bonus. It does exactly what I need it to do, and I have been able to use it to make tooling and fixtures for other production centers in my shop, so it has proven itself a handy purchase.

    The next closest machine (by price) is going to run you around $6k after software, spindle and set up. I have $2500 in my set up, and it is running right now making me money. So unless you just have to have accuracy and tight tolerances must me kept, why spend the extra money.

    My two cents!

    Matt

  16. #76
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    550
    Some very nice work there, I really like your clamps and table tops. Do you have any posts on how you do the butcher blocks?
    Thanks..
    Garry

  17. #77
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    0
    I should also say this...

    At $150,Vectric 2D is perfectly adequate for the tool path portion of the work it does, but the design half of the software is total CRAP. And I use the word crap because any stronger language would be censored here.

    It's a must for calculating tool paths, but I find myself doing ALL my design work in Corel and then importing it into Vectric 2D. I haven't experimented with V-Carve yet, but I would hope the design portion of the software is a little more powerful at $600.

    The Mach 3 Mill software (the machine center dashboard, if you will) is good stuff.

    Matt

  18. #78
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    0
    I only mentioned butcher blocks to convey the varied thicknesses the clamps will hold. I was actually running a batch of butcher block barbeque/serving trays. They come to be finished from the manufacturer as a serving tray, and I router a slot around the perimeter (a moat for the juice) and a deep pocket in the corner (a well for the juice to run off into), as well as laser engrave custom branding into the surface for a local customer of mine. They then sell it as a high end carving/serving tray.

  19. #79
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    109

    Z-Axis Counter-Balance

    Hi all --

    An issue that keeps popping up from time to time is that the z-axis drops when the power is cut off, ...such as when turning off the control box. Many other CNC router/mills also have this behavior because the weight of the spindle overcomes the friction of the belts and gears in the z-axis slide when the stepper motor is not energized. Normally this is not a big problem, but it could be under certain circumstances.

    Fortunately there is an easy to implement solution, using a constant-force spring as a counterbalance. Several members at: UZUGR_CNC : Unofficial Zenbot User's Group ...have now posted a design for Zenbot mills that can be easily added using only two existing bolts. It consists of a 'spring hook' that attaches to the top z-axis motor bolt and a 'spring spool' assembly that attaches to the spindle mount plate as shown in the attached photo. Total cost of materials should be $15.00 or less. A DXF template file and a photo-illustrated PDF with details for making the spring spool are available for free to any Zenbot owner.

    There is a brief video at: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8dPTQNP6bU]UZUGR balance - YouTube[/ame] ...that demonstrates the prototype in operation with power off. Installed on my Zenbot 12x16 as a test machine using a Bosch Colt spindle, the z-axis can be positioned anywhere within it's travel limits and it will remain there without dropping to the bottom of travel.

    --Rich
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails mounted.jpg  

  20. #80
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1
    Hi Rich,

    Thanks for posting these "n00b n0tes'; I don't have a zenbot but I'm re-purposing automated microscope imaging station, and your Mach3 "table setup" post was VERY helpful! (I'm a firm believer in the RTFM approach, but sometimes you and the manual are simply a half-step out of phase!) - having someone else say the same thing in different words can prevent a lot of stumbling around in the dark. Even though the thread is "Zenbot centric" there's a lot of great info that's generically applicable.

    Really appreciate the time and effort you've put in to this thread - Thanks!

    -Jeff

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