[slavetothemetal]

Hey All,

I am looking for a unit that can be used to automate the assembly of 50 taper tooling. This is for milling chucks as well as arbor type holders. I am thinking something like a rotary indexer with a hold down for the holder. We have one guy assembling/disassembling about 50 holders a day for our robot cell. Any ideas as to where this could exist?

[pdoherty]

Like this?

http://www.jlindustrial.com/ETM-4995.../product.html#

[slavetothemetal]

Thanks for the reply pdoherty,

Well, kind of. I wat to attach something like that to some type of rotary so that we can load the holder in, attach the wrench, and tighten/loosen the holder. I can't believe with all the companies using these holders, not a single off the shelf solution out there?

[mxtras]

I am confused about what you want to do here.

The pictured holder is attached to a table and holds the tool holder in place while you attach the stud and the tooling. This is what I have seen in use in hundreds of shops.

What's not love?

Scott

[slavetothemetal]

Scott,
We have already assenbled the retention knobs, so we don't need to get at the bottom of the tool. What we do need is a faster method of changing the tools out. We are using the 50 taper holders to mount tools on, which we then load/unload into the machining center via robot. The run times on parts vary, but tha average is around 15 minutes. That means the operator working in this cell must change out many, many holders, especially for the weekend runs.

[Geof]

Why not simply get more tool holders?

There has to be a cost balance point somewhere between the time it takes to keep constantly changing tools in a limited number of holders and simply buying enough holders so the tool stays with the holder until it needs replacing.

If your tools need replacing at the 15 minute mark this does not work but if an individual tool goes through several runs it might. I know we found it to be the case with 40 taper holders.

[slavetothemetal]

I am going to put up some pics here to better show my situation. I am attaching them here.

[Andre' B]

Are you putting the part being machined in the #50 holders?
Looks like you are making face mills.

Edit:
If so why not just give the robot an air wrench and let it change the parts.

[slavetothemetal]

That is correct Andre, this particular job is a face mill, though I have about 230 other products as well.
If I give the robot an air wrench, then I need new end of arm tooling, and alot more room inside the cell.

[WOLOG]

If you don't mind me asking, which company do you work for? I never would have figured a face mill was machined in that manner.

Wolog

[slavetothemetal]

I am not sure that I can say, but it is a MAJOR tooling manufacturer.

[WOLOG]

That's good to know. I am not interested in stealing information just curious. I like knowing if the tools I buy are helping Hamas or not.

[fpworks]

Although pricey, I recommend using hydraulic CAT50 holders. The tool can be clamped/unclamped with a setscrew, usually a 5mm or 6mm hex. Very low actuating torque, typically 4-5 ft*lbs, but quite strong clamping torque. If you buy some large bore holders, you can sleeve them down with intermediate sleeves.

You can also get them with an arbor interface.

Your assembly guy will be MUCH faster and far less fatigued...additionally, the clamping will most likely be more accurate than your current method.

[slavetothemetal]

Thanks fp,

The accuracy isn't an issue, you can see in one of the photos that I put up where we are probing the part. I have a calculation that automatically compensates for the o.d. runout as the part runs. The dilemma I have is we already purchased the holders(about 300 pcs in all) so I doubt we would be able to trade them in. Also, where could I find an arbor type hydraulic holder? I have yet to see one of these.

[fpworks]

The following are links to companies that make these. Depending on your application specifics, you may be able to purchase something off the shelf, but you may have to have them special made. I'll warn you, they are very expensive. If you require special made arbors, you're looking at $3-4k a piece. Luckily, you probably won't need as many holders...you can change a part in 15-20 seconds without rushing.

Typical runout is 2-5 microns. The big problem with hydraulics is that they require tight tolerances on the part they are clamping. Hydraulic clamping arbors/chucks can only expand/contract about 3-5% of their clamping diameter. Having said that, your parts must be better than +/- 0.001" on a 1" clamping diameter. With larger diameters, your tolerances can be looser, for smaller diameters, your tolerances must be better.

Here is a list of companies that can do it. I used to design hydraulic chucks and arbors for one of them.

http://www.mytec.de/en/produkt.htm

http://www.schunk.com

http://www.hydralock.com

http://www.koenigdorn.com/frameset_englisch.php

http://www.kuroda-precision.com/

[broby]

Have a look on the Iscar tool site, I seem to recall several years ago being shown a unit in the book that would allow you to assemble a tool holder and have this unit torque up the tool ready for use, obviously if it can do up the tool it should be able to undo the tool also.
I will see if I can find the reference in the books when I get back to work tommorow.
Cheers
Brian.

[slavetothemetal]

Thanks, Brian. I have an Iscar rep coming out Friday. I will have to make some modifications, but it is prtty much exactly what I was looking for!

[broby]

Hey Kyle,
Finally managed to find the page in the Iscar Rotating Tools catalogue!
In the latest book the unit I am talking about is on page F116 (last page in the Tooling Systems section).
It is called "Electrical Nut-Clamp Torque Control Device"
I hope this is what you want?!?
Cheers
Brian.