[NJC]

Thanks skullworks and okumatech, Mobil DTE lite it is!

Okumatech, do you have a manual on PDF for this machine? Or do you have paperwork on fill levels and such for this machine. I'm a brand newbie to this type machine and don't want to hurt it.

I got it wired a couple of days ago, fans fired up, controller came on when I pushed the button, but did not completly boot up, I think this was the problem the previous owner was having with the machine. When I turned the control panel on, the hydraulic motor and pump on the large tank in the back right corner stated up as well, no pressure on the gauge though, I can't see any oil in the tank but it has a screen in the filler neck, the sight glass on the tank has some discoloration, so it's hard to tell if it has oil or not. Should there be pressure at the gauge with the pump running without any machine movement?

Scott

[OKUMA Tech]

LB15 // what kind of control ?? I'm guessing 5020L.

As far as the hydraulics // I think that on that model machine there should be a black rotary knob on the back some where near the tank, If it is there turn it up to the turret position and press it in and see if you get a pressure reading, as far as the oil in the tank you should be able to see it in the site glass if not remove the cap and take the 3 screws out and pull the screen out and look in the tank. I think you said that the control did not boot up all the way, if this is true the hydraulics will not come on until the machine is fully booted. I think I have complete electrical manual on this machine, it's about 10 Meg will need a different Addy to send it to

[theokumaguy]

With the 5000L green screens, the hydraulics would come up during power on because the emergency stop would actually turn the control off (nothing but relay logic controlling the hydraulics if I recall). Regardless, you do need to fill the hydraulics if they are coming on and before you troubleshoot any control bootup issues.

Regardless of the control, there are a few good starting questions:

If you open the control cabinet and look at the card cage, there should be a row of LED's located on the cage. Are any red ones on, and if so which?

There is a brass colored power supply for most of these vintage controls, near the card cage. Are any of the red LED's lit up on this unit?

When the power is turned on, do all the LED's on the operating panel come on?

If so, give the control a few minutes to boot up, the older ones can take 3-5 minutes, after waiting do most of the LED's turn off, but a few stay on?

[NJC]

LB15 // what kind of control ?? I'm guessing 5020L.

I think I have complete electrical manual on this machine, it's about 10 Meg will need a different Addy to send it to

That would be a huge help, you can send anything you want to me at [email protected]


Thanks,
Scott

[NJC]

OK guys, here's what I have, (sorry for the long winded version)

LB15 w/ OSP 5000l control, (green screen)

The huydraulic tank is almost full, oil looks clean, when the control is turned on the pump runs and I can see oil circulating in the tank, when I put the black knob to "Turret" and push it, it is spring loaded and does not make pressure at the gauge.

The control seems to boot part way, it says

SBP Version E7
LBB03-06-F.POL
LBC03-06-F.POL
LBME3-06-F.POL
LAZE2-15-I-PO1A.POL

Does nothing else besides run the huydraulic motor

In the cabinets at the rear of the machine I have

A CPU, power and run LED's are lit, no others

Power Supply, (just above the CPU), no lights on at all

DC Power Supply, (just above the previous), PS and MCON LED's are lit, nothing else

Lower servo drive, (just above the DC power supply), SAOP and PSON LED's are lit, nothing else

Upper servo drive, (at the top), has SAOP, PSON and a red LV LED on, nothing else

Finally, the only other lights I see on are on the Spindle servo drive, (Fanuc), has PIL and a RED Alarm-code #8 light on, nothing else

I appreciate any thoughts or advise!

Scott

[theokumaguy]

Your boot up looks right, but it is definitely hanging up if it just comes up to this point. Going in the order the information was provided:

The hydraulic motor/pump coming on but no pressure on the gauge could just mean a bad gauge or selecting valve. It could be several other things, a bad pump, blocked pickup, bad coupling etc. If someone else presses the control on pushbutton, can you see the hydraulic lines in back actually "charge" (flex some with the pressure when the pump energizes)?

SBP Version E7
LBB03-06-F.POL
LBC03-06-F.POL
LBME3-06-F.POL
LAZE2-15-I-PO1A.POL

**Control lockups during the bootup sequence usually mean either a bad board or the wrong jumper settings**

CPU and power LED's are right - nothing wrong bus-wise here
Power supply - should only have red LED's on if there is a problem so looks good here

DC Power Supply - PS (green LED) = Power is supplied to the DC Power Supply, this should be on. MCON (green LED) Relay MCS on the power supplied is on.

Lower (Z) Axis Drive - SAOP (yellow LED) = Sub Amp Operational this is on when the servo drive is not active, this is normal during power on sequence. PSON (green LED) = Power Supplied to the drive is on should be on when main breaker is on.

Upper (X) Axis Drive - LV (red LED) = Low incoming DC voltage, this is normal if the DC Power Supply is not on. I am assuming that this is a BDU drive unit and the lower (Z) is a newer/upgraded BLD-A drive? This would explain why only this one has the LV LED on, and is most likely due to the #8 on your Fanuc unit. If not, this could be an indication of another problem, but I would start with the #8 on your Fanuc SDU and the bootup issues.

Fanuc Drive with PIL/#8 on - Depends on the Fanuc drive, I am assuming you have similar to the A20B-1000-069_ analog top board. PIL is your Power On LED, so this should be on during normal operation. Alarm LED #8 means your +24 Volt supply is too high. Check the incoming voltage to the drive (R to S, S to T, R to T on the bottom left of the base unit). This should be 200-230VAC maximum. If it is higher, you need to change the taps on the transformer between the cabinet and the hydraulic unit. If you are between 210 and 230VAC, flip the voltage switch (silver up/down switch) in the bottom right of the drive to the upper position. This should reduce the voltage and clear the #8 alarm.

[theokumaguy]

Clearly it's late, I replied to another post here too . . .

[NJC]

I think I'll deal with the control later, I'm concetrating on the alarms for now. As you suggested, I checked the three terminals, R to S and so on, they are all testing at 245 VAC.

The Fanuc servo unit number is A06B-6044-H018

I'm not sure of what you are refering to as "TAPS", can you explain these and how I might change them?

The X drive is a BDU-50-A and the lower, Z drive is a BDU-75-A if this helps

Thanks,
Scott

[theokumaguy]

Good idea, we might already have that part fixed with the transformer taps already (info on that below)

The Fanuc units are sold with separate base unit, control PCB, and possibly an orientation card. The number you posted is the model 8 base (could be long or short chassis, but it's the same big bore 7.5/11kw standard). There should also be an A20B number on the top board, also known as the control PCB. This should be about 2/3 of the way down on the left hand side.

The taps in your transformer change the incoming voltage (the 245 VAC you stated) to the proper operating voltage. If you are looking at the back of your machine, to the right of the hydraulic unit, to the left of your electrical cabinet, and below the back of the turret there should be a large metal box with a label that says __KVA. This is your transformer. Make sure you have the main power to the machine off and remove the cover on the transformer, then you should be able to see the tap bars for the incoming (primary) and outgoing (secondary) settings. Usually on this age of machine, the secondaries are in the center of a ring of tap points you can move the bars to, each labeled with a different voltage. Most likely these are currently on the 200 or 220 points. If you remove the tap bars from their current position and move them to the 240 position, this should bring your power down to 203-204 or 223-223 (depending on which they were set to before). This will bring your machine's power into the proper operating range. Again, if this gives you 203-204, flip the switch on the drive to the down position, but if it gives you 223-224 you need to flip it to the up position. Once you do this, the #8 alarm "should" go away.

If both drives are BDU style, they should be giving you the same LED feedback. The LV LED could just be another symptom of the wrong incoming power. If not, on the left hand side of the drive you should see a terminal strip with several wires going to it. Two of these should be HV and LV. These are your input power wires from the DC Power Supply do the BDU units. Please set your meter to Volts DC and check from HV to LV on each drive then post the results. I believe this should be 300VDC nominal, but operating range is something like 270-340VDC (I could be wrong, I'm going off memory and will double-check the actual values later).

[SRT Mike]

Well finally got the cable done and tested. Still same as before will transfer from NC to PC fine no matter how it's set but nothing at all in the other direction. Tried several different cables (both hardware and software handshaking) with no luck. I have a cable built exactly like the one Okuma Tech's attatchments showed for my Mazak, same result, punch but no read. An off the shelf null modem cable doesn't work at all.

On EDIT/AUX page I selected PIP, then READ. From here I tried a couple different things, first I just hit READ and then WRITE/INPUT. This puts the filename A.MIN at the top and does absolutely nothing. Just sits there all day long with cursor flashing, also Predator editor on PC shows no activity. At this point have to turn the control off and back on. Then selected READ and typed TT: and INPUT. Waits about 10 seconds or so and says RS232C Device Error FFFFFFF. Then tried typing TT:,A.MIN and same thing. Tried using CN0 but no luck. CN1 or above causes a CPU error and puts machine in E-Stop mode.

Thanks,
Nate

Replied to your other thread... I had the *EXACT* same problem "RS232C DEVICE ERROR FFFFFF" and CN1 causing CPU error and putting the machine in E-stop needing a hard reboot.

I triple checked my cable, and now it works great. The cable is custom, not null modem or normal serial, I used the pinout that okumatechguy posted in the other thread (in the Word .DOC file).

G'luck

[NJC]

Good idea, we might already have that part fixed with the transformer taps already (info on that below)

The Fanuc units are sold with separate base unit, control PCB, and possibly an orientation card. The number you posted is the model 8 base (could be long or short chassis, but it's the same big bore 7.5/11kw standard). There should also be an A20B number on the top board, also known as the control PCB. This should be about 2/3 of the way down on the left hand side.

The taps in your transformer change the incoming voltage (the 245 VAC you stated) to the proper operating voltage. If you are looking at the back of your machine, to the right of the hydraulic unit, to the left of your electrical cabinet, and below the back of the turret there should be a large metal box with a label that says __KVA. This is your transformer. Make sure you have the main power to the machine off and remove the cover on the transformer, then you should be able to see the tap bars for the incoming (primary) and outgoing (secondary) settings. Usually on this age of machine, the secondaries are in the center of a ring of tap points you can move the bars to, each labeled with a different voltage. Most likely these are currently on the 200 or 220 points. If you remove the tap bars from their current position and move them to the 240 position, this should bring your power down to 203-204 or 223-223 (depending on which they were set to before). This will bring your machine's power into the proper operating range. Again, if this gives you 203-204, flip the switch on the drive to the down position, but if it gives you 223-224 you need to flip it to the up position. Once you do this, the #8 alarm "should" go away.

If both drives are BDU style, they should be giving you the same LED feedback. The LV LED could just be another symptom of the wrong incoming power. If not, on the left hand side of the drive you should see a terminal strip with several wires going to it. Two of these should be HV and LV. These are your input power wires from the DC Power Supply do the BDU units. Please set your meter to Volts DC and check from HV to LV on each drive then post the results. I believe this should be 300VDC nominal, but operating range is something like 270-340VDC (I could be wrong, I'm going off memory and will double-check the actual values later).

I will be away for a long weekend, but will check the values above and post my results early in the week.

Scott

[NJC]

Ok theokumaguy, here's what I found.

1) The top board of the Fanuc unit is an A20-1000-069.

2) I changed the taps to the 240 positions, they were on 220 BTW

3) I moved the switch to the upper position, tests at the 3 lower legs at 224 VAC

4) I do not have the alarm #8 LED on anymore.

5) Both of the DC servo drives have the LV LEDS on now, only had one before, I tested between the LV + HV legs on both drives, they both test at 310 VDC, (the legs are listed as VL + VH, by the way not LV + HV as they are listed in the boards), am I testing the right legs, I didn't see any others?

6) Control will not boot any further yet.

Your Thoughts?

Thanks,
Scott

[theokumaguy]

1) Non-issue now that there's no alarm LED 8
2) - 4) Great! This is a common mistake made by people installing used Okumas. The good thing is that you didn't plug it in to 480VAC with the taps set to 220. I've seen the fire damage as a result, not pretty.
5) Check the breakers on the drives, they are usually hidden by the top card on the drives. If they aren't tripped then the drives aren't enabled yet. I doubt they're tripped, this should just be an indication that the machine hasn't booted up all the way and enabled the drives.
6) You can try removing some boards from the card cage to see if you can change the problem:
-svp/tbo are the servo boards, it won't boot up all the way without these but you can see if it goes further than it does now
-ec or eo board, this controls the machine I/O, the switches and solenoids etc. The machine will alarm out but again can at least see if it gets past the alarm
-mc3, this controls rs232 and tape puncher, no need for this during bootup or testing at all

Depending on options you may have other boards that can be used to test this. At this point I'd remove all the boards but the main board and mc2 (mc2 is the display) and see where it alarms, then add one board at a time and see if you get further or not then move to the next. Most likely if you don't find it by this, you either have a memory problem or just need the software reloaded.

[NJC]

OK, I removed the control, I found that the cooling fan on the top of the card cage looks like the tar inside came out and some of it got on a couple of the cards. I pulled the cage out and cleaned it with contact cleaner, some came off, but most of the tar is still there. Should I worry about getting it off? If so, what would you clean it with? I seperated the cards, I was thinking of cleaning them with more contact cleaner and a toothbrush?

I don't see the number or letters on the cards that you listed above, I just see the corresponding connections, (CN1,CN2,CN#, ect), there are 6 cards total, 7 including the panel control card, am I in the right area?

Scott

[theokumaguy]

You're in the right area yes. The front of the boards should have letters at the very top over the top screw that secures it them in the card cage. DO NOT use contact cleaner/toothbrush on the boards!!! If they really are that dirty, you can probably find a local company that can infrasonically clean them. This is a machine that uses sound waves in a non-conductive bath to remove dirt and grime from boards. You can also have Okuma clean and test the boards for a price, but it'll definately be a bit more than the local guys.

If you can't find the labels on the top of the boards, you can also list the 1911-____ numbers from the boards here and they can be identified by this. The E4809 numbers are circuit board layout numbers/revisions, so they don't always work (you could have a circuit board laid out for 3 axis but only have 2 axis control circuits filled on it).

[NJC]

The only numbers that make any sense, besides the numbers listed for every tansistor are as follows

Main board- SXP-228A, (has all the harness plugs on it)
2nd board- XPS-229B
3rd board- SXP-230A
4th board- SXP-231A
5th board- SXP-232A
6th board- XPS-291A

Do these make any sense to you? If so, which ones would you suggest to remove to see if it boots further?

Scott

[theokumaguy]

Those don't really ring a bell or translate to any boards I know off the top of my head, is there any way you can take a digital picture of the card cage and post it?

[NJC]

Here's a few shots of what I have. I did some searching for boards and none of what I found looks like what I have. I found alot of the numbers that you posted though, maybe I'm in the wrong area.

[theokumaguy]

You're disassembling the Operation panel my friend. This controls the I/O for all the buttons on the front keypad, the machine panel (below) and all the switches/buttons/LED's at the operator's control panel. The card cage is in the back electrical cabinet, most often below the BDU drive units you were talking about before. Sometimes it was to the right of these too, but it will be quite obvious. Brass colored cage, several boards, many connectors going into the front of the boards. This would be the assembly to look at for the boards I mentioned in the previous posts.

[NJC]

LMAO, I thought I might be in the wrong area. I'll go back a few posts, pull out a couple of cards and post my results:idea: