[WOTDesigns]

Conversion Info

I am starting my conversion on a 6 month old Grizzly G0463 X3 Manual Mill using CNC Fusion deluxe kit with Heli-cal couplers, keling 381oz and 906oz stepper motors and Gecko G540. Just another copy of the already established combination so well outlined here on CNC Zone.

The Goal

Complete the entire conversion and have it dialed in making parts in less than one month in just a few hours a night and slighly more on the weekends using the knowlege and assistance of the CNC Zone users by bribing them with a photo-filled build thread to waste time viewing at work :cheers:

My Background boring... skip this section

I am a wheelchair technician during the day providing and repairing custom rehab power and manual chairs for the disabled in southern California. I LOVE motorcycles and started making my own parts on a drill press and bandsaw at work last year... until I got frustrated and bought an X3.

With no intent of being a job-shop I immediately had people pushing work on me and have been very fortunate to get in on some great opportunities. To date the mill has paid for itself and a darn good chunk of the tooling, but I am tired of turning hand wheels and staring at dancing digital numbers. I have one client that has a BIG job coming up that needs a CNC so I want to have this done inside of a month to be ready to crank parts out for him.

I am not really interested in a hobby, nor do I desire the overwhelming satisfaction of making things I can just easily buy... "if you want a hobby, build a CNC. If you want to make money- BUY a CNC". yeah, I know. I looked long and hard and have decided that I don't like any of the small CNC mills for the price of around $5K which is what I currently have to invest including coolant, TTS, Tapping head, and if I have enough left a lathe (that will be a whole separate thread)

I really feel like a red-headed-step-child building a X3 in the dawning of the age of g0704, but that is what I have and there are kits available to expedite the process immensely.

The PLAN
ORDERED
CNC Fusion Deluxe Kit
-Heli-cal couplers
-Extend Y to 8" (Crevice Reamer design)
-Extend X to 20"
-Max available on Z

Keling Electronics
-G540 Gecko driver
-381oz steppers on table
-906oz stepper for Z
-12.5v Power supply (4th axis follows shortly)
-MACH3
-(put your boxing gloves on) I also bought the Control box with G540 and power supply installed with fan, e stop and power switch. I know i know. I don't enjoy wiring and know it will cost me several nights of playing around to mount/make it and would rather buy one thats ready to roll.

Homing swithces
-Honeywell Switches from Allied
-a for the sub micro switch for the Z

-30 ft of stepper motor wire
-a few spare connectors
-waterproof key board
-buddy is building my Mach3 machine with dual parallel ports and PS2 connector.

Still NEED: (HELP IF YOU KNOW IM MISSING SOMETHING)
-Monitor ($55 LCD 17" locally from CL)
-TTS package (subtotaled at $1000 last night building my own package including TC Tapping head) but couldn't quite pull the trigger yet.
-I am planning an MPG (Thank you EarTaker!) Looking at 6 axis. It may be silly, but I made sure I have a PS2 port so I can use [ame="http://www.amazon.com/One-Finger-Mouse-USB-Black/dp/B000BSLTIS"]small ball mouse[/ame] in one hand and MPG in the other to zero axis' during set up. Using PS2 on the main mouse allows USB input for this one and both will control mouse independently.
-modify table to create enclosure
-Stuff I am forgetting or not anticipating.

What I don't know
-exactly how to set up spindle control (I have seen people thank HOSS but have not invested time looking for it yet)
-If my counter weight is the best idea. I get .002" nod any time I move down then tighten the lock on the Z. I don't know how much more I can tighten the Gib and it be safe for the stepper. It is already tight by hand. I'm a little worried that all of my codes will have to have either up or down movements to all cuts which seems cheesy.
***Crevice Reamer says you need a Resister only if I don't have the "NEW G540EZ". Is that a standard now or should I grab some resisters?
-A LOT MORE

I am planning to post TONS of pictures to entertain and hopefully bring people back to answer my stupid questions The goal is to have this done in a month... but the cnc fusion and Keling wont be here for two weeks which means I need EVERY thing planned out and parts on hand. I DO NOT MIND buying a few things to prevent having to "make" parts and waste a night or two. Time trumps money, but I don't have enough of either.

Your input will make or break this build as I know only what I have read in the countless build threads and have no practical knowledge per-say.

[WOTDesigns]

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[WOTDesigns]

just some random photos I took tonight top show where I am starting.

mill



counterweight. 5 gallon bucket came out at exactly 104 lb




quill bracket I made for fluorescent light and digital read out. I have igaging on still the acids' currently. not bad. really nothing compared for the money knowing I would convert soon





not the best shot, but I put 33mm nuts on the Z and X for power feed. across great on the z, but end up using porter cable must of the time





read out board with white board


parts




these are the "big project". expecting to have to make a few hundred of the round flange and 5 times that many adapters. fortunately they are small and I designed a fixture that will hold 10 flanges at a time and another that will hold 16 of the adapters for cnc. it will use mite-bites and dual action clamps. funny how much time I have to design fixtures when turning hand dials

[cornbinder23]

Hey its about time I saw your build thread, lol

Looks like you will have a few projects as soon as you are finished with
the conversion, I see you ordered the deluxe kit, it came with the gas strut for me are you planning on keeping the counterweight or installing a strut?
Dont worry about the stepper torque on the Z I run my gibs very tight and I have even left the lock on and it powers through w/o a hitch
Are you planning on running flood coolant? If so that flourescent light might not be the best idea, LED's might be better for that application and "halo" headlight rings can be had on ebay for pretty cheap.

The cnc fusion kit goes on fast!! It took me a little longer though as I had torn the whole thing down for paint
Looking at your list, did you buy a monitor yet? I have to say that having a touchscreen for this application is great, I am running the mill and the lathe with 2 TS that I put together with parts from ebay very inexpensive and also very easy to do i highly recommend it.
If you are interested I will try to dig up some numbers if you let me know what size and aspect ratio monitor you will be using

JTCUSTOMS

[cornbinder23]

Forgot to mention about the resistors, the EZG540 is definitely the easiest solution as the solder points are much easier to work with than the solder cups on the DB9's, definitely worth it in my opinion, just solder the wires on set the resistance value and close up the covers, the pots for adjusting the values are very sensitive so double check the resistance value before buttoning up the covers, dont get me wrong the standard resistors are not that hard to work with but the EZG540 is the cats meow!!

JTCUSTOMS

[WOTDesigns]

Gas Strut
i just checked to see if I missed it, but the site says nothing about including the strut with deluxe kit :-( note that you mention it (i completely forgot, thank you!) I really do need one. my mill placement is going to be a PITA to build an enclosure around but I can't move it with the counter weight. I emailed cncfusion to ask about the strut.

Will I need to make a riser for the bottom mount to accommodate my increased Z height? our does the strut have a few inches to spare?

Coolant
I know flood will likely provide the best results, but I am not comfortable with the necessary work, time and maintainance required. I have heard nothing but good things about the fogbuster system, and while overpriced, i greatly prefer the peace of mind and lack of health concerns and maintenance. I an planning on getting the solenoid to control via mach 3 as well.
how fast will the 1/2 gallon go with two or three heads? is it worth an extra $100 to double the size to a gallon?

I think you are right either way. I will likely go with leds if for no other reason than they will be smaller profiles and not interfere with the coolant system mounting/direction-- not to mention an engraving head will be following the conversion as soon as possible.

I remember seeing a post about how "easy"it is to make a touch screen, but hadn't investigated it and have since totally forgotten about it. that would definitely be a better route. I have not purchased the lcd yet, but was planning to after work today. I already ordered a 37" flat screen wall mount arm with the intention of making a keyboard and mouse rack under the monitor but touch screen and a, mini keyboard is much better! VERY interested in details. hopefully it isn't anything that will take two weeks to receive parts and conflict with the build timing :-/

come to think of it... I think it was YOUR post on the lathe build where I saw that. going to look now.

I cant tell you how much I appreciate the forehead-to-wall time you have already saved me

[WOTDesigns]

very cool JTCUSTOMS! not a bad price for what you get with that screen, but it looks like this will be a post conversion modification as their shipping time is basically 1-2 months. I will grab those LCDs tonight and take one apart to see if they are a good match for the touch or not.

ordering the shielded 2-22 wires from mcmaster today, and the resisters and g540 spare fuses from digitech also. I think the list of things I forgot is getting shorter but definitely isn't gone.

appreciate others input as well

[WOTDesigns]

picked up 3 identical refurbished dell 1704 monitors for $50 each last night- with power and video cable. all tested and viewed before purchase... they seemed annoyed... I don't care.

why 3? 1 for the wife, one to convert to touch screen and one to use when I destroy one trying to convert to touch screen

ordered the 17" 5 wire resistive usb touch screen for $96 el bay direct from china. after emailing I spent ab extra $15 to receive it in 3-7 business days instead of 1-3 months with free shipping.

found some scraps (3x2) and .75xsomething that are big enough for the motor mount spacers. I can make those this weekend but I'm not sure what else I can do in preparation.

I also ordered the gas strut and some usb, ps2 and video extension cables since they will run along the arm and down the back of the enclosure

[Fastest1]

Great idea on the powerfeed. Creativity at its finest.

[WOTDesigns]

thanks fastest1. it was nice to use at full speed (80ipm) for rapids after I decided I was going to do the conversion. even the porter cable was hard to keep consistent at lower speeds, but beat the hell out of turning handwheels.

[MRM RCModels]

Gas Strut
i just checked to see if I missed it, but the site says nothing about including the strut with deluxe kit :-( note that you mention it (i completely forgot, thank you!) I really do need one. my mill placement is going to be a PITA to build an enclosure around but I can't move it with the counter weight. I emailed cncfusion to ask about the strut.

Will I need to make a riser for the bottom mount to accommodate my increased Z height? our does the strut have a few inches to spare?

Coolant
I know flood will likely provide the best results, but I am not comfortable with the necessary work, time and maintenance required. I have heard nothing but good things about the fogbuster system, and while overpriced, i greatly prefer the peace of mind and lack of health concerns and maintenance. I an planning on getting the solenoid to control via mach 3 as well.
how fast will the 1/2 gallon go with two or three heads? is it worth an extra $100 to double the size to a gallon?

I think you are right either way. I will likely go with leds if for no other reason than they will be smaller profiles and not interfere with the coolant system mounting/direction-- not to mention an engraving head will be following the conversion as soon as possible.

I remember seeing a post about how "easy"it is to make a touch screen, but hadn't investigated it and have since totally forgotten about it. that would definitely be a better route. I have not purchased the lcd yet, but was planning to after work today. I already ordered a 37" flat screen wall mount arm with the intention of making a keyboard and mouse rack under the monitor but touch screen and a, mini keyboard is much better! VERY interested in details. hopefully it isn't anything that will take two weeks to receive parts and conflict with the build timing :-/

come to think of it... I think it was YOUR post on the lathe build where I saw that. going to look now.

I cant tell you how much I appreciate the forehead-to-wall time you have already saved me

Nice plan. Should be a good build. Here's a few questions that I am able to answer:

1. Touchscreens are awesome! Definitely worth the price. Get Greolt's Machscreen overlay. Will make things much easier. I have one on my router an can't live without it. Been meaning to add one to the X3, but can't find the time.

2. Ditto on the fogbuster. I have three heads and the half gallon lasts about two hours with all three going. I normally run with two going so it lasts even longer. Only drawback is that it eats compressors alive. Mine is the 60 gallon version from harbor freight. I really don't care how much the compressors cycles, but my neighbors "understand" when it starts kicking at 0200 .

3. I have a piston from cncfusion. Never installed it, but I think my finishes would be better if I did. I really can't tell the difference though.

Welcome to the addiction (group)

MRM

[WOTDesigns]

FRUSTRATING. I spent the last hour posting the same long response twice and got "token expired" both times. A smarter/less tired man would have copied the second one before posting... that isn't me I guess.

MRM- HI! Your post was literally the one I was reading when I decided I was going to do this. thank you for the help and inspiration you have already unintentionally given me!!

I did several google searches for that overlay and came up with nothing :-/ I would really love a link or something if you have it. I am thinking it is a more touch friendly setup for mach and that is PERFECT.

FOGBUSTER
Your post was the inspiration behind the fogbuster in the first place, but after much thought after reading your post a few hours ago... I am now convinced it is not the best choice for me. Refilling every few hours is fine for hobby, but my goal is proof of concept for production (to allow me to get a bigger turnkey). I do not have a big compressor and do not have space for one. If I do add the gallon fogbuster price to the compressor upgrade... I am spending a LOT of money to NOT have the best choice for my intended usage. So... flood it is. just ordrered a [ame="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000H5VLFG"]pump[/ame] and will figure the rest out later. CNC first, then enclosure, then coolant, then lathe.

However- after deciding not to get the fogbuster I decided to SIMPLIFY my life and get a large tool cabinet to free up the 5 shelves of tooling I have now to use for the CNC parts and components. Eventually this will become my lathe stand I hope.

Ordered
today only the pump above

I did recieve shipping notices from digikey for the resisters and G540 fuses; Allied for the stepper cables, connectors and USB cable; nyjtouch for the touch membrane; amazon via separate company for the USB and Video extensions. for some strange reason the amazon orders I placed two days ago for "stock" parts have not charged or shipped yet. strange.

What is a good conduit to use for flood?!
My searches today were frustrating. Prices range from $.50' to $4.00' without a decipherable difference in some cases. I am leaning towards McMaster pn 7609K2 but at $1.31' it seems a little high. It IS liquid tight PVC and has nice couplers and has a 1.4" bend radius which seems pretty impressive... help.

[MRM RCModels]

FRUSTRATING. I spent the last hour posting the same long response twice and got "token expired" both times. A smarter/less tired man would have copied the second one before posting... that isn't me I guess.

MRM- HI! Your post was literally the one I was reading when I decided I was going to do this. thank you for the help and inspiration you have already unintentionally given me!!

I did several google searches for that overlay and came up with nothing :-/ I would really love a link or something if you have it. I am thinking it is a more touch friendly setup for mach and that is PERFECT.

FOGBUSTER
Your post was the inspiration behind the fogbuster in the first place, but after much thought after reading your post a few hours ago... I am now convinced it is not the best choice for me. Refilling every few hours is fine for hobby, but my goal is proof of concept for production (to allow me to get a bigger turnkey). I do not have a big compressor and do not have space for one. If I do add the gallon fogbuster price to the compressor upgrade... I am spending a LOT of money to NOT have the best choice for my intended usage. So... flood it is. just ordrered a pump and will figure the rest out later. CNC first, then enclosure, then coolant, then lathe.

However- after deciding not to get the fogbuster I decided to SIMPLIFY my life and get a large tool cabinet to free up the 5 shelves of tooling I have now to use for the CNC parts and components. Eventually this will become my lathe stand I hope.

Ordered
today only the pump above

I did recieve shipping notices from digikey for the resisters and G540 fuses; Allied for the stepper cables, connectors and USB cable; nyjtouch for the touch membrane; amazon via separate company for the USB and Video extensions. for some strange reason the amazon orders I placed two days ago for "stock" parts have not charged or shipped yet. strange.

What is a good conduit to use for flood?!
My searches today were frustrating. Prices range from $.50' to $4.00' without a decipherable difference in some cases. I am leaning towards McMaster pn 7609K2 but at $1.31' it seems a little high. It IS liquid tight PVC and has nice couplers and has a 1.4" bend radius which seems pretty impressive... help.

the screen is at the bottom (free).

ArtSoft USA - Screensets

On my touchscreen I use the machmotion overlay. It's not cheap at $200, but well worth it IMHO.

[WOTDesigns]

thats excellent, thank you.

touch screen set looks great, and was almost exact what I envisioned. my plan was to purchase an mpg for around $200- will this essentially replace that need? touch a direction, touch to set an feed rate & spindle speed, touch distance and go?

what primary advantages do you see to the other overlay? the 200 is already in my budget and if it will completely eliminate the need for an mpg (significantly more than this one) I would be willing to do that. kind of funny that it costs $50 more that the software it operates though.

up bright and early to got HF when they open and have a shave to get some help loading the tool box.

[slinger]

That HF tool cabinet is a beast, and it is IMHO the best bang for the buck cabinet out there. I bought one a while back for my garage tools, and I plan to buy another one for the milling tools in my office. I really want the black one for the office, but they never seem to be on sale like the red one.

I also thought the cabinet would make a nice lathe stand. It is a little shorter in length and width than the G0602, but it certainly won't have any trouble handling the weight.

[WOTDesigns]

slinger you are so right its scary. I read all the good reviews but was still amazed at the quality. I am thinking when it becomes my lathe stand I will build an 8" high wooden box with a couple steele flanges that I can drop the post of a bar stool in to raise me up to a better height.

my local HF didn't have it so I had to run to the next over over which is about 15 minutes :-p I cringe when I read everyone say they have to drive 45 minutes... but theyhad it pulled and they loaded it in my van


while waiting for my buddy to help me pull it out... I pulled it out alone. not bad.


very well packaged... even though the wrecking bar and mallet sat on the bumper watching me pull the wood off by hand. first palletized thing iI've ever gotten from hf with no exterior damage.


no assembly required! just put the handle on after cutting the straps. here are the only three tools required


omg its FULL already. j/k. have to move my compressor to my attached storage so I got a reel, an extra 50' hose, fittings, filter/regulator, 4 jaw pullers for the upcoming Pay-Per-View fight: "PriddyShiddy vs. Z gears"


huge casters


snagged some drawer organizers that fit like a glove


less space now, but should have much more shelving for still the stuff coming in next week.


mounted the reel and regulator. replaced the 30' with a 50'. both of these were inside track coupons so it w
as pretty cheap. but I missed a few fittings that I will have to pick up. and another regulator for the splitter behind the mill.

[WOTDesigns]

after seeing how nice this tool chest moves around I started looking for some leveling feet and casters and found [ame="http://www.amazon.com/WoodRiver-Machine-Leveling-Caster-Mounted/dp/B0039ZIPL4"]leveling casters[/ame]... didn't even know they existed, but my over complicated plan just got simplified



I am not sure my 3/4" base with only two 2x4s along the X will do. I'm thinking about putting some CRS along bottom from end to end and mounting the leveling feet to that. likely make 2 leveling jacks for the middle with some threaded rods and a couple coupling nuts.

[cornbinder23]

The Z gears shouldnt be that big of a problem for you, didnt need pullers for mine, in fact I dont think there is enough room to get a puller in there to pull the bevel gear out.
Mine came off with a little heat from a mapp gas torch
I spent a bit of time at the grizzly tent sale in the washington showroom today, I gotta say they are pretty proud of their tool boxes there as they are way overpriced
They had 2 X3's on original pallets selling for 500$, didnt walk out with anything significant, but found 2 very nice made in japan sharpening stones
and a upholstery stapler, they also had 3 G0602's sitting there for about 6-700$.
Any way keep up the good work! Looking forward to seeing this come together

JTCUSTOMS

[WOTDesigns]

I would have loved to grab a g0602 for 600! I'm going my z won't be bad but in reality I'm using this build as an excuse to buy stuff I've wanted to have but dont news NEED like the dremel 4000 variable speed from 5k to 35k and flex shaft I bought yesterday. once I get the mill apart my hands are tied so that should help for grinding the alignment pins and opening holes.

not much to report from last night, just another 13 hour work day/day off. finished the X & Y extensions per crevice reamers sure, but there are no through hole locations and there is no way I'm getting a strait 3" deep hole by hand or onmy drill press at work so I'm going to take the mounts off, mark them and reassemble to drill.

The Y is 1.5" tall which is taller than the stock mount so I'm not sure exactly where it will have to sit to match the cnc fusion kit... but its only 3x4" so I'll droll that later.

1-5/8" EM has less chatter and less machine complaining than the smaller ones I have used on 1.5"depth profiling. also beats the crap out of my fly cutters.


Crevice Reamer recommended spacers


received a crap load of "your order has shipped" notifications yesterday. going to make some more progress cleaning up the shop and getting ready.
******PENDING QUESTIONS******
what conduit to use? hd had some liquid proof at a decent price too, but it isn't very flexible. now that I'm planning flood I want completely sealed... and I'm glad I went with the honeywells

[cornbinder23]

PVC pipe works great for conduit and can be routed alot cleaner than
seal tight, or flex, I used it on my build as conduit and for the flood coolant.
You can use male adapters for bulkhead fittings as well.
For the steppers I just used the corrugated wire sheath found at any auto parts store and routed them so the wouldnt touch the bottom of the enclosure , I didnt trust the sheath on the Belden cable, but in hindsight I would just buy cable that has a higher abrasion resistance and not use the corrugated wrap as it holds chips and is hard to clean off.
One suggestion would be to make sure you have a washdown hose in the enclosure if you plan flood coolant, makes cleanup alot easier

As far as the holes, I believe cncfusion kit is using the stock location for the bolts. so you can measure them for a reference, on second thought you might want to wait for the kit if you dont have it yet as IIRC the y mount is not centered. So the relief cut in the spacer might not be centered either.
I have pics of mine and will post them this eve after work, if I can remember where that SD card is LOL

JTCUSTOMS